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 25 C30-C39 C33: The Fascinating King's Gambit (Read 76651 times)
Glenn Snow
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #43 - 02/04/05 at 20:38:10
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TFKG offers a transposition to the main line Modern after, 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Bc4 d5 4.Bxd5! Nf6 5.Nf3 Nxd5 6.exd5 Qxd5 7.Nc3!.  This position also happens to be recommended for Black in Kaufman's "The Chess Advantage in Black and White" on page 352.  Black has various possible queen moves but Kaufman recommends 7...Qe6+.  Johannson writes, "7...Qe6?!+ is hardly worth taking seriously...", but a much stronger eighth move, after 8.Kf2, is given by Kaufman.  So after, 7...Qe6!?+ 8.Kf2 Qb6+ 9.d4 Be6 10.Re1 Be7 11.Bxf4, 11...Nc6 is given as an improvement on 11...c6 which ended in a draw.  Several more moves are given, and if I'm reading the last line correctly then I believe Kaufman is stating that Black has an advantage.  I think 10.Qe2!? is a stronger move than 10.Re1 after which I think both sides must play carefully.  White seems to be marginally better in Fritz analysis (which actually rates it as =).  Anyway, I was curious to see what others thought.
  
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alumbrado
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #42 - 02/04/05 at 02:40:32
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My copy arrived yesterday  Grin

Sadly, I was too late home from work yesterday to give it more than a cursory glance (and another one at 6.30am today before coming back to the office  Sad )

But ... I think I am going to be able to spend pretty much the whole w/e looking at it, so I may have some comments and questions (as a relative KG novice) in a few days' time ...

Incidentally, I couldn't help noticing, even on a cursory glance, that appearing in the acknowledgments and dotted throughout the book, are references to a certain Mark Nieuweboer in Surinam ... who has thus far been characteristically modest about his contribution ...
  

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Glenn Snow
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #41 - 02/04/05 at 00:05:09
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Received my copy on just yesterday (2-2-05).  A wonderfully thorough book.  I think the $36.00 price is fully justified for as much original analysis the book contains (and as Thomas has mentioned, someone who doesn't play the KG but plays 1...e5 is unlikely to fork out the dough just to make sure his defense to the KG holds).  I do have one analytical question concerning a variation analyzed in another book, but I think I'll wait till some more people get their orders in.  (perhaps Alumbrado and Dragonslayer have their copies by now?)
  
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #40 - 02/03/05 at 10:48:01
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Well, he does mention that they transpose, which hardly needs saying as it is rather obvious isn't it?

You're right but McGrew writes 3...c6! as if it is better than 3...Nf6 4.Nc3 c6. Maybe he thinks White's 4th move alternatives after 3...Nf6 (4.d3 etc.) are better than 4.Nc3 and can be avoided with the move-order 3...c6.
After 3...c6 there is also 4.Nc3 Qh4+ 5.Kf1 f3 to consider.

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Actually, I think 5.Nf3 is also playable as is 4.d3 and to my surprise even 5.Qf3, thanks to an unexpected transposition... (and no, I don't mean 5...d5 6.exd5 Bd6 7.Qe2+.)

I forgot to mention 5.Nf3 since it probably transposes to the Knight's gambit (1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Nf3 d5 4.exd5 Nf6 5.Bc4 c6 6.Nc3 and can also be reached through a Nimzowitsch cg move-order or the unusual 2...exf4 3.Nf3 c6) after 5...d5 6.exd5 which is good for White. I suppose (just analyzing blindfolded here) that Black can also play 5...Bb4.

4.d3 seems drawish to me even if the Polgar sisters played it regularly.

Look forward to discover the transposition after 5.Qf3 when I get your book  Wink
  
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TalJechin
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #39 - 02/03/05 at 05:29:04
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Yes, Na5 or Bb4 would be some kind of Bishop's Opening, though I think most KGeers wouldn't mind that too much.

And yes, the tricky Transposers chapter is 99% about black trying to trick white into a King's Knight Gambit, and sometimes white should allow this - after 2...Nf6 3.Nf3 I take a long look at the Shallopp defence 3...exf4 4.e5 Nh5 - which you hopefully will see for yourself some day soon... Wink
  

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alumbrado
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #38 - 02/03/05 at 05:15:17
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Well, the "problem" is that Black can play 1.e4 Nc6 2.Nc3 e5 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.d3 Na5 or 4...Bb4.

There is no reason why you should cover any of this in your book: you would be quite justified in only dealing with the position after 1.e4 e5 2.f4 - I just wondered if, since you had a chapter on "tricky transpositions", this was one of them ...

Maybe one day, eventually, I will get to find out first hand ...  Undecided
  

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TalJechin
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #37 - 02/03/05 at 04:59:06
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Yes, but 1.e4 Nc6 2.Nc3 e5 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.d3 and 5.f4 seems like an OK Classical KGD. But I suppose alumbrado is right - there must be some way for black to avoid a KG! Cheesy
  

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MNb
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #36 - 02/02/05 at 20:14:48
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I would not advise 1.e4 Nc6 2.Nc3 e5 3.f4 as it is not sensible to play the Bishop's Gambit exf4 4.Bc4 here: Qh4+ 5.Kf1 Bc5!
  

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TalJechin
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #35 - 02/02/05 at 11:45:27
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Did you choose the absolutely slowest shipment alternative? ???  Even my bunch of books arrived today! Cheesy

After 1.e4 Nc6, why not play 2.Nc3 here too? Btw, when Miles played the Sigeman tournament, i think the game Hector-Miles went 1.e4 Nc6 2.Nc3 - during the dinner after the tournament I asked Miles if he'd've played 2...d5 or 2...e5 if Johnny had tried 2.f4 - which gave him a good laugh...

  

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alumbrado
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #34 - 02/02/05 at 09:52:05
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My copy of the book has still not arrived Sad

If black plays 1...Nc6!? is there a clever way to try to drag Black into KG lines?  2.f4?! d5! looks as if it might be good for Black to me, while 2.Bc4 Nf6 is also tricky ...
  

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MNb
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #33 - 02/01/05 at 20:09:58
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I just wanted to remark, that RJ Fischer only busted the King's Knight Gambit. After publishing his famous article he realised that White has an improvement on move 3.
When a certain Kasparov signed in for a swiss tournament somewhere in The Netherlands, the organizers paniced, as they were not prepared to give him proper accomodation. Were they relieved, when they learned his first name - Sergey.
  

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TalJechin
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #32 - 02/01/05 at 18:14:41
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TalJechin, I sure hope your book arrives soon!!


So do I, so do I! Cheesy

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Anyway he examines the line 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Bc4 Nf6 (or 3...c6 4.Nc3 Nf6 though he doesn't indicate that these lines are analogous) 4...c6!


Well, he does mention that they transpose, which hardly needs saying as it is rather obvious isn't it?

Quote:
5.e5?, 5.Qe2 and 5.Qf3 while in fact White's only playable moves are 5.d4 and 5.Bb3!


Actually, I think 5.Nf3 is also playable as is 4.d3 and to my surprise even 5.Qf3, thanks to an unexpected transposition... (and no, I don't mean 5...d5 6.exd5 Bd6 7.Qe2+.)
« Last Edit: 02/02/05 at 03:22:53 by TalJechin »  

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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #31 - 02/01/05 at 17:37:23
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GM Emil Sutovsky recently played this variation against Nisipeanu. In New In Chess Magazine issue 7/2004 he comments the game. Here are the first few moves:
1.e4 d6 2.Nc3 e5 (2...c5 is a closed Sicilian or open but White chooses!; 2...Nf6 3.d4 e5 is more Philidor stuff, but White can play 3.f4!? when 3...e5 is a KG declined and 3...c5 a Sicilian Grand Prix, but Black has missed out on the Tal gambit as well as ...e6 and ...d5 lines)
3.f4! exf4 4.Bc4 Now it is a Bishop's gambit.
Sutovsky (as did IM Lawrence Day who played 4.d4 in this position) dislikes 4.Nf3 which he claims leads to a bad version of the classical gambit (Fischer defence). Actually this is not so, but let's just leave people thinking that and score a few easy points (Btw this demonstrates clearly that even GMs are oblivious to recent theory as ling as it has not been in Informator or the week in chess).
4...Qh4 5.Kf1 Be6 6.Qe2! This also occurred in Fischer-Evans, USA 1963. After Fischer had "refuted" the King's gambit...food for thought.

On another note I read McGrew's recent column and was very disappointed. I tried to contact him and ask if there was going to be a follow-up to the article with the real games, so far without luck.
Anyway he examines the line 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Bc4 Nf6 (or 3...c6 4.Nc3 Nf6 though he doesn't indicate that these lines are analogous) 4...c6! and now:
5.e5?, 5.Qe2 and 5.Qf3 while in fact White's only playable moves are 5.d4 and 5.Bb3!   Angry

TalJechin, I sure hope your book arrives soon!!
  
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TalJechin
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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #30 - 02/01/05 at 10:54:37
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Well, a few years ago Kasparov managed to trick me with that 1...d6 idea... Wink

So in the chapter on tricky transpositions I recommend 2.Nc3 to avoid the Philidor as 2...e5 3.f4 would still be a KG. Play usually end up in an Austrian Attack or a Closed Sicilian. But it also frequently enters the great unknown...




Btw, it was Sergej Kasparov, an IM from Belorussia, not GK. Grin
  

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Re: The Fascinating King's Gambit
Reply #29 - 02/01/05 at 08:58:46
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Lest that last post appear somewhat churlish, cutting out the Petroff, the Latvian, the Elephant etc. as well as not having to learn something good against 2...Nc6, is already a worthwhile achievement!

Personally, though, I would rather play the main lines of the Philidor than that endgame.
  

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