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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit??? (Read 49572 times)
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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #18 - 09/16/10 at 21:26:59
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I had a deep look this summer at 1.d4 f5 2.e4 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 Nc6 5.d5 Ne5 6.Qe2 because I got it in one of my games on the board.

A)
6. ...Nf7 looks risky because of 7. Nh3 (An English amateur called Brown, recently tested this with success against his much higher rated opponent) e5! 8.dxe6 (e.p.) dxe6 and now 9.Nxe4 as well as 9.Bd2 lead to very interesting play. Besides the better known 7.Bxf6 exf6 8.Nxe4 Be7! 9.d6 cxd6 10.0-0-0 isn't really enjoyable either for black although I must admit that I couldn't find a clear advantage for white.

B)
6. ... d6 7.Nxe4 (Again a wonderful idea of the English amateur although there are other interesting tries: f4, Bxf6 and 0-0-0) Nxd5 8.Nf3 Nxf3+ 9.Qxf3 Be6! 10.c4 Nb4 11.Qc3 Nc6 12.Be2 and white still has nice compensation for the pawn. The last moves of black were certainly not easy to find so I expect more Nxe4 in the future although I must admit that 6. ... d6 isn't played that often

C)
6. ... c6 (My favorite) 7.0-0-0 (The most natural choice although 7.Bxf6 and 7.f4 aren't without venom either.)
C1)
7. ... cxd5?! (Win with the Stonewall Dutch recommends this move but I don't like it) 8.f4! (Not discussed in the book) Nf7 9.Bxf6 gxf6 10.Nxd5 e6?! (A bit better is 10. ... Nd6 11.Qh5 Nf7 12.Re1 e6 13.Rxe4 +/=) 11.Qxe4 Be7 12.Nxe7N (An easy amelioration on Schleber - Luetke with big advantage for white)
C2)
7. ... Nxd5N (A new move and my favorite. Besides this, I think 7. ... d6 looks also playable although more risky.) 8.Nxd5 (Rybkas favorite but probably Fritz 8.Nxe4 is safer) Nf7! 9.Nf4 Nxg5 10.Qh5+ Nf7 11.Bc4 g6 12.Bxf7+ Kxf7 13.Nxg6 and white wins the exchange but black gets marvelous counterplay for it.

This were just a few critical lines out of my long analysis to explain that the whole variation is still in his childshoes.
  
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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #17 - 02/15/08 at 02:16:35
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rossia wrote on 02/10/08 at 17:24:37:
Which move order would be best if Black wants to bypass gambit lines such as 2.e4 and 2.g4:

a) 1. d4 d6
b) 1. d4 g6
c) other?


Any ideas or suggestions, pros and cons of omitting of 2....f5?  Smiley


Those who want to combine the Classical Dutch with the French should play 1...e6; those who want to combine the Leningrad with the Pirc should play either 1...d6 or 1...g6.
There are no real ways for White to take benefit from Black's move order (except entering the French and the Pirc of course; some like to play against it!). 1.d4 e6 2.Nf3 f5 3.d5 is also innocent as long Black knows what he is doing.
  

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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #16 - 02/10/08 at 19:47:20
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But if the black player likes to play the Pirc/Modern with black, than 2.e4 is already a psychological victory for him  Cheesy
  

Yusupov once said that “The problem with the Dutch Defence is that later in many positions the best move would be ...f5-f7” but he is surely wrong.
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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #15 - 02/10/08 at 18:45:05
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Well, the big con to 1...d6 or 1...g6 is surely that White can now play 2.e4 without gambitting a pawn!

Is the Staunton really something to be feared?
  
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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #14 - 02/10/08 at 17:24:37
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Which move order would be best if Black wants to bypass gambit lines such as 2.e4 and 2.g4:

a) 1. d4 d6
b) 1. d4 g6
c) other?


Any ideas or suggestions, pros and cons of omitting of 2....f5?  Smiley
  
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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #13 - 02/09/08 at 19:02:58
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Perhaps a new try for white is 1.d4 f5 2.e4 fe4: 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 Nc6 5.d5 Ne5 6.Qe2 c6 7.0-0-0 cd5: 8.Nd5:!? Nf7 (Kindermann) 9.Bf6: gf6: 10.Qe4: e6 and now instead of 11.Nc3 transposing to the Radjabox-Danielsen line, what about 11.Ne3 ? This prevents f5 by black.
Play could go on 11. ... Qa5 12.Kb1 f5 13.Qf4 d5 14.Nf3 Bd7 15.c4 with an initiative for white.
But I think black could improve on that line.
  
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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #12 - 02/08/08 at 17:07:07
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Hey friends, look what theory says about Staunton:

Staunton Gambit 2.e4


1.d4 f5 2.e4
An aggressive and tough approach. White wants to attack at once and makes a central pawn sacrifice (White: I am a sorcerer, my attack will be powerful and brilliant).

Howard Staunton played his gambit for the first time in 1846 - Staunton,H - Horwitz,B  1-0.

Here 2...d6 is weak and White gets an advantage by many ways 3.exf5 Bxf5 KeyLink Euwe,M - Weenink,H  1-0, 3.Nc3 Nf6 KeyLink Meijers,V - Koenig,D  1-0, 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bd3 Nc6 KeyLink Flohr,S - Hazenfuss,W  1-0, Leko,P - Tornai,I  1-0, 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bd3 fxe4 5.Ne4 KeyLink Malaniuk,V - Lopes,R  1-0. The greedy 2...fxe4 is correct (Black: Thanks a lot for the pawn).

2...fxe4

After 3.Nd2 Black obtains some edge with 3...Nf6 Bisguier,A - Bronstein,D  0-1.

White has two other continuations here: A) 3.f3 and B) 3.Nc3.

A) 3.f3

Now White obtains an advantage after 3...e3 KeyLink 4.Bxe3 Gurin,A - Stepanov,I  1-0, Psaras,S - Panagiotopoulos,N  1-0. White has good compensation for the pawn after 3...exf3 4.Nxf3 KeyLink Karaklajic,N - Matulovic,M  ˝-˝, Feicht,A - Panchenko,A  1-0. The debatable move 3...e5 leads to positions with chances for both sides Schlotter,D - Berlin,D  0-1, Dominiguez,J - Rios,E  1-0. Better is 3...d5.

3...d5!

Wise. Black defends his pawn and open way for the dark-squared bishop. He gets a small edge Pinkerton,A - Tozer,R  0-1.

B) 3.Nc3

Stronger than 3.f3. White develops his knight and attacks the e4-pawn. Now Black can play 3...g6 and 3...Nf6. White has a clear edge after 3...d5? KeyLink Luik,H - Nikolaevsky,Y  1-0, Bondarenko,V - Glek,I  ˝-˝.

3...g6 4.Nxe4

White has a minimal advantage after both 4...Bg7 5.Nf3 KeyLink Timoscenko,G - Gazik,I  1-0 and 4...d5 5.Ng5 KeyLink Baudot,D - Goerens,J  ˝-˝, Schebler,G - Danner,G  1-0. Probably, this plan with 3...g6 is suited for the Leningrad Dutch experts.

3...Nf6

Logical. Now White can try 4.g4, 4.f3 and 4.Bg5. The main line 4.Bg5 will be considered in the next chapter 11. Staunton Gambit 2...fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5.

4.g4

The psychic attack. White wants to scare his opponent and to crush the Black's position quickly. After the weak 4...d5?! KeyLink it is possible sometimes Thorfinnsson,B - Sebe Vodislav,R  1-0, Najer,E - Kharashkina,B  1-0, Lys,J - Vagner,T  1-0. But Black can stop the rival's activity with 4...h6! KeyLink Schulze,H - Jugow,A  0-1, Dalkiran,S - Onischuk,A  0-1, 4...h6! 5.f3 KeyLink Tyroler,A - Araiza Munoz,J  0-1, Conquest,S - Malaniuk,V  0-1, Ligterink,G - Van Mil,J  1-0, Dutch Defence - 2.e4 fe4 3.Nc3  Line and gets an edge.

4.f3

Black has four options 4...Nc6, 4...e3?! 5.Bxe3, 4...exf3?! 5.Nxf3 and 4...d5!.

4...Nc6

This leads to a small edge to White Lehmann,H - Smyslov,V  0-1, Grigorian,K - Tal,M  ˝-˝, Slavina,I - Lewandowska,K  1-0.

4...e3?! 5.Bxe3

White has the better chances Ratner,B - Aratovsky,N  1-0, Orlov,G - Edwards,M  ˝-˝.

4...exf3?! 5.Nxf3

White has good compensation for the pawn after 5...d5 KeyLink Mikenas,V - Kotov,A  1-0, 5...e6 6.Bd3 KeyLink Jacobson,E - Model,A  1-0. After 5...g6 White must prefer 6.Bg5 with compensation, please see in the line 4.Bg5 g6 5.f3 exf3 6.Nxf3 in the next chapter, because 6.Bf4 is unclear Walter,R - Schwab,M  1-0, Delvecchio,H - De Boni,J  0-1, Napora,D - Weber,K  0-1.

4...d5!

Simple and good. Black gets a minimal advantage after 5.Bg5 Bf5 KeyLink Gurin,A - Gumerov,R  0-1, 5.Bg5 Bf5 6.Qd2 KeyLink Poliak,E - Sakharov,Y  0-1, Roods,S - Deng,K  0-1 and after 5.fxe4 dxe4 6.Bc4 KeyLink Menyhart,T - Krizsany,L  0-1, Summers,C - Zeidler,S  0-1, Abbasifar,H - Dovliatov,S  0-1and after 6.Bg5 Bf5 KeyLink Lasker,E - Alekhine,A  0-1, Gulko,B - Gurevich,M  0-1, Vafiadis,K - Grunberg,M  0-1, 6.Bg5 Bf5 7.Bc4 KeyLink Abbasifar,H - Dzhumaev,M  1-0, 6.Bg5 Bf5 7.Bc4 Nc6 8.Nge2 KeyLink Liardet,F - Malaniuk,V  0-1, 8...Qd7 KeyLink McAlpine,K - Timmerman,G  ˝-˝, Malinin,V - Skotorenko,V  1-0. But if White plays precisely he can level the game.


STAUNTON GAMBIT 2...fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5

1.d4 f5 2.Nc3 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5

The best reply. Black has no less than six continuations: A) 4...b6, B) 4...d5?, C) 4...c6, D) 4...g6, E) 4...e6?! and F) 4...Nc6!?.

A) 4...b6

An interesting idea. The arising positions are double-edged with slightly better chances to White Rabinovich,A - Kaspi,A  1-0, Perdomo,L - Bartel,M  0-1.

B) 4...d5?

A mistake. White grabs the d5-pawn after 5.Bxf6 exf6 6.Qh5+ g6 7.Qxd5 KeyLink Anderssen,A - Dufresne,J  1-0, Goregliad,S - DeMoore,S  1-0 and 7...Bb4KeyLink Yagupov,I - Trunov,A  1-0.

C) 4...c6

Somewhat passive. Here weak is 5.Bxf6 exf6 6.Nxe4 d5 7.Ng3 KeyLink Dominguez Rueda,J - Vallejo Pons,F  0-1, 7...Bd6 KeyLink Neumann,G - Anderssen,A  0-1, Vinogradov,E - Anatsky,A  0-1. Better is 5.f3! and White has good compensation for the pawn after 5...exf3 KeyLink Lasker,E - Pillsbury,H  1-0, Lalic,B - Kovacevic,V  1-0, Dutch Defence - 2.e4 fe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 5.Bg5  Line. White obtains some advantage after 5...e3 KeyLink as usually Berkovich,D - Potapov,A  ˝-˝ and after 5...Qb6 Martiska,P - Lanc,A  0-1. In the case of 5...d5 6.fxe4 dxe4 KeyLink White gets a small edge due to Black cannot continue the regular ...Nc6, because he has already played ...c6 Lehtinen,H - Kallio,H  1-0, Bauer,C - Tseitlin,M  1-0. White has the nice prospects and after 5...Qa5 6.Qd2 KeyLink Maksimenko,A - Malaniuk,V  ˝-˝, Santa Torres,L - Holness,M  1-0.

D) 4...g6

Black has a small edge, if White plays the dubious 5.Bxf6?! exf6 6.Nxe4 d5 KeyLink Norman,G - Tartakower,S  0-1, Toth,J - Krizsany,L  0-1. Harmless is 5.Bc4 Orzech,D - Jakubiec,A  0-1, Phillips,J - Curdo,J  0-1. Black has good counterplay after 5.h4 d5 6.h5 KeyLink Rubinraut,S - Shirazi,K  0-1. Again 5.f3! is better and White has nice compensation for the pawn after both 5...e3 KeyLink Purgin,N - Karagodin,V  1-0 and 5...exf3 6.Nxf3 Bg7 KeyLink Nemet,I - Roebers,J  1-0.

E) 4...e6?!

Here White has an easy and comfortable game. Also this position can arise after the transposition 2.Nc3 Nf6 3.Bg5 e6 4. e4 fxe4. After 5.Nxe4 Be7 White gains an edge with 6.Nxf6+ Bxf6 KeyLink Levitt,J - Girinath,P  1-0, Palliser,R - Purton,B  1-0, 6.Bxf6 Bxf6 7.Qh5+ g6 8.Qh6 KeyLink Vera,R - Conejero Gimenez,J  1-0, 8.Qh6 Nc6 KeyLink Knaak,R - Ftacnik,L  1-0, Popov,V - Neiksans,A  1-0, 8.Qh6 Qe7 KeyLink Karr,J - Ragonese,L  1-0, 7.Nf3 Qe7 KeyLink Hase,M - Metzer,K  1-0, Koutsin,S - Naegele,H  1-0, 7.Nf3 Nc6 KeyLink Tukmakov,V - Zelic,M  1-0, 7.Nf3 b6 8.Bd3 KeyLink Kruppa,Y - Mahmoody,M  1-0, 7.Nf3 b6 8.Bd3 Bb7 9.Qe2 KeyLink Timoshenko,G - Antal,G  1-0, 7...0-0 KeyLink Savchenko,S - Van Parreren,H  1-0, Dizdar,G - Fercec,N  ˝-˝, 7...0-0 8.Bd3 KeyLink Lasker,E - Thomas,G  1-0, Rufener,M - Ali,M  0-1, 7...0-0 8.Bd3 Nc6 9.c3 KeyLink Efstathiou,D - Potapov,P  1-0, 9.c3 d5 KeyLink Svidler,P - Hassabis,D  1-0, Hernandez,Y - Hoang Thanh Trang  0-1.

A tough warrior never makes such moves as 4...e6.

F) 4...Nc6!?

The strongest continuation. Black increases his pressure in the centre by developing the queenside's knight. Now after 5.Bb5 KeyLink Black has dynamic counterplay with 5...a6 Breyer,G - Vajda,A  0-1, Cifuentes Parada,R - Malaniuk,V  ˝-˝, Van Mil,J - Hoeksema,H  1-0. The alternatives are 5.f3 and 5.d5 Ne5.

5.f3

Black gets good counterplay with 5...d5 KeyLink Cifuentes Parada,R - Willms,J  1-0, Toth,D - Wiley,T  0-1, Huang Qian - Hoang Thanh Trang  ˝-˝, 5...d5 6.fxe4 dxe4 KeyLink Cenal Gutierrez,R - Santo Roman,M  0-1, Ziese,G - Kalinitschew,S  0-1, Chow,A - Gurevich,D  0-1. After 5...e5 6.d5 Nd4 7.Nxe4 Be7 KeyLink Black has counterchances Horberg,B - Larsen,B  0-1, Blanco Gramajo,C - Milicevic,D  0-1, Cifuentes Parada,R - Schmittdiel,E  0-1.

5.d5 Ne5

The major position of the Staunton Gambit. White can choose between 6.Qe2, 6.Bxf6 exf6 and 6.Qd4 Nf7. Here 6.f3 is not popular but playable Moskalenko,V - Herrera Mellado,L  1-0.

6.Qe2

Black has sufficient counterplay with 6...c6!? Radjabov,T - Danielsen,H  ˝-˝, Hughey,M - Spraggett,K  0-1. Also 6...Nf7 is playable Mateuta,G - Berg,E  0-1, Eriksson,J - Berg,E  ˝-˝.

6.Bxf6 exf6

Black has no problems Fronczek,H - Agdestein,S  0-1.

6.Qd4 Nf7

Black has normal couterchances after 7.Nh3 KeyLink Markov,J - Berkovich,D  1-0, Durando,D - Wiley,T  0-1, 7.Bf4 Hall,R - Saunders,M  0-1. If 7.Bh4 then 7...g5! with sharp play in Katetov,M - Simagin,V  0-1, Sychev,A - Sokolowski,R  1-0.

On 7.h4 Black can use the calm 7...e5!? KeyLink Salamone,G - Markgraf,A  0-1 and the double-edged 7...c6 8.0-0-0 KeyLink Felber,R - Alvarez Villar,H  1-0, Longa Yauca,J - Lopez de Turiso,J  ˝-˝.

Black has lively counterplay after 7.Bxf6 exf4 8.Qe4+ KeyLink Markus,J - Bosch,J  0-1, 8.Nxe4 f5!? 9.Nc3 KeyLink Ziese,G - Balinov,I  0-1, 8.Nxe4 f5!? 9.Ng3 KeyLink Gudmundsson,G - Donner,J  0-1, Juergens,V - Malaniuk,V  0-1, Naumann,A - Kindermann,S  1-0, 8.Nxe4 Be7 KeyLink Gnichtel,G - Lutz,C  0-1, 8.Nxe4 Be7 9.0-0-0 0-0 KeyLink Troeger,P - Tal,M  0-1, Kravtsov,S - Vyzmanavin,A  0-1, 10.f4 KeyLink Schroeder,W - Mainka,R  0-1, Vernersson,P - Agrest,E  0-1.

  
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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #11 - 02/08/08 at 02:51:58
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Markovich wrote on 02/07/08 at 15:37:31:
No, 4...Nc6 simply must be correct after 4.Bg5, or the Staunton is back in business.

I agree completely, so I am following the thread with the highest interest.
6.Qe2 c6 7.0-0-0 cxd5 (Nf7 8.h4 cxd5 or Nxd5 are to be considered indeed) and I recognize two critical lines:
a)8.Nxd5 e6 9.Nc3 Nf7 10.Bxf6 gxf6 11.Nxe4 Bauer-Santo Roman, FRA 1996.
b)8.Bxf6 gxf6 9.Qh5+ Nf7 10.Qxd5 e6 11.Qxe4 Radjabov-Danielsen, Torshavn 2000.
So where do you want to have your queen and knight?

Markovich wrote on 02/07/08 at 15:37:31:
Of course the Staunton is only really an antidote to the Leningrad, since Black (if he likes the French) can otherwise begin 1...e6.

There are also some Leningrad-practioners who begin 1.d4 d6 evt. 2...f5; 3...Nf6; and 4...g6.
  

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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #10 - 02/07/08 at 18:58:04
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Dragan Glas wrote on 02/07/08 at 17:16:55:
Greetings,

My database (based on TWIC) gives 8. Bxf6, gf; 9. Qh5+, etc.

White seems to have a good score with this Qe2 line

[When I was active, the Staunton was my response to the Dutch.]

Kindest regards,

Dragan Glas


I believe 8. Bxf6 may not be any better for than 8.Nxd5.  I do not have a lot of games in db after 9. Qh5, but best line I have for white is 9. ...Nf7
10. Qd5  e6
11. Qxe4 Bh6+
12. Kb1 f5
13. Qa4  (Qb4   Qe7 = Radjabov-Danielson)
and now
13. ...0-0 as in Hughey-Spragett keeps very equal,with chances for both sides, white's advantage being almost eliminated and if Black gets active with the Bishop pair, black has excellent winning chances, which exist for both sides.


In the Radjabov position after move 13. Qb4, engines seem to like White even after Qe7, but reality seems that once Q's come off and the event horizon is reached, the computer assesment comes back into line with GM assesment, I believe.  Black has a better center prescence than White, and the B pair, but other pieces maybe still mildly constipated.


I really think the Staunton needs to be respected, but poses no current critical/serious problems for the hard-core Dutch player.



Edited 1x : error in content
  

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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #9 - 02/07/08 at 17:16:55
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Greetings,

My database (based on TWIC) gives 8. Bxf6, gf; 9. Qh5+, etc.

White seems to have a good score with this Qe2 line

[When I was active, the Staunton was my response to the Dutch.]

Kindest regards,

Dragan Glas
  
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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #8 - 02/07/08 at 16:36:52
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Interesting stuff! Staunton definitely can not refute Dutch, of course not. But it is tricky, yes yes indeed!

Look at these games to convince yourselves:

Horvath,Csaba (2538) - Alonso Moyano,Jonathan (2365) [A83]
Capablanca mem op 42nd Havana (1), 18.05.2007


1.d4 f5 2.e4 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 c6 5.f3 d5 6.fxe4 dxe4 7.Bc4 Nbd7 8.Bb3 Nb6 9.Nge2 Bf5 10.0-0 Qd7 11.Ng3 Bg4 12.Qe1 Qxd4+ 13.Be3 Qe5 14.Ngxe4 0-0-0 15.Ng5 Bh5 16.Rf5 Qd6 17.Ne6 Bg4 18.Nxd8 Kxd8 19.Rf4 Bd7 20.Rd1 Qc7 21.Be6 Kc8 22.Rfd4 Qe5 23.Bxd7+ Nbxd7 24.Qd2 Qc7 25.Rd3 e5 26.Qf2 Bb4 27.Qf5 Bxc3 28.Rxc3 Rf8 29.Bc5 Re8 30.b4 e4 31.Be3 Qe5 32.Qxe5 Rxe5 33.Bd4 Rd5 34.Kf1 a6 35.Ke2 Rg5 36.Rg3 Rxg3 37.hxg3 Kc7 38.c4 b6 39.Ke3 c5 40.bxc5 bxc5 41.Bxf6 Nxf6 42.Kf4 Kb6 43.Rb1+ Kc6 44.g4 Ne8 45.Kxe4 Nd6+ 46.Kd3 Nf7 47.Re1 Kd6 48.Ke4 Kc6 49.Rf1 Nd6+ 50.Kd3 Kd7 51.Rh1 h6 52.Rh5 Kc6 53.g5 Nf7 54.gxh6 gxh6 55.Rf5 1-0

Cruz Sanchez,Cristhian (2451) - Rzayev,Bahruz (2073) [A83]
Logrono op U20 Logrono (3), 15.08.2007


1.d4 f5 2.e4 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 Nc6 5.d5 Ne5 6.Qd4 Nf7 7.h4 c6 8.0-0-0 Qb6 9.Bxf6 gxf6 10.Qxe4 Qxf2 11.Nf3 Bh6+ 12.Kb1 Qe3 13.Qa4 0-0 14.Re1 Qc5 15.Bd3 e6 16.g4 Bg7 17.Qe4 f5 18.gxf5 exd5 19.Qf4 Nh6 20.Rhg1 Nxf5 21.Qg4 Kh8 22.Bxf5 Bxc3 23.bxc3 Qxc3 24.Re5 1-0

Reefschlaeger,Helmut (2320) - Schmidt Schaeffer,Sebastian (2370) [A83]
BL2-Sued 0607 Germany (8.5), 01.04.2007

1.d4 f5 2.e4 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 c6 5.f3 Qb6 6.fxe4 Qxb2 7.Bd2 Qb6 8.Nf3 d6 9.Rb1 Qc7 10.e5 dxe5 11.dxe5 Ng4 12.Bf4 g5 13.Nxg5 Bg7 14.Bc4 Bxe5 15.0-0 Bxf4 16.Bf7+ Kf8 17.Be6 Nf6 18.Rxf4 Qxf4 19.Qd8+ Kg7 20.Qxe7+ Kg6 21.Qf7+ Kxg5 22.Qg7+ 1-0

But let us see how Black handles Staunton:



Szymanski,Andrzej1 (2251) - Malaniuk,Vladimir P (2522) [A83]
Najdorf mem op-A Grodzisk Mazowiecki (1), 20.07.2007


1.d4 f5 2.e4 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 Nc6 5.d5 Ne5 6.Qd4 Nf7 7.Bxf6 exf6 8.0-0-0 Be7 9.Qxe4 0-0 10.Re1 Bc5 11.Nh3 g6 12.g4 Ng5 13.Nxg5 fxg5 14.d6 Bxd6 15.Bc4+ Kg7 16.Nd5 c6 17.Qd4+ Rf6 18.Re8 Bc5 19.Rg8+ Kxg8 20.Nxf6+ Kh8 21.Qxc5 Qxf6 22.Re1 d5 23.Re8+ Kg7 24.Be2 b6 25.Qe3 Kf7 26.h4 Bb7 27.Rxa8 Bxa8 28.hxg5 Qe7 29.Qf4+ Kg7 30.Qd4+ Kg8 31.Qd2 Bb7 32.Bf3 Qe5 33.c3 Bc8 34.Kc2 Be6 35.Kc1 Kf7 36.b3 a5 37.Kb2 b5 38.Qd4 Qxg5 39.Qa7+ Kg8 40.Qb8+ Kg7 41.Qc7+ Bf7 42.Kc2 Qf6 43.Qg3 b4 44.Be2 g5 45.cxb4 axb4 46.Bd3 c5 47.Bf5 h5 48.f3 h4 49.Qc7 c4 50.bxc4 dxc4 51.Kb1 c3 52.Qd7 h3 0-1

Panchenko,Alexandar G (2365) - Dovzik,Juri (2415) [A83]
Uzhgorod Spring op Uzhgorod (4), 26.05.2007


1.d4 f5 2.e4 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 Nc6 5.d5 Ne5 6.Qd4 Nf7 7.Bxf6 exf6 8.Nxe4 f5 9.Ng3 g6 10.0-0-0 Bh6+ 11.f4 0-0 12.Nf3 Bg7 13.Qd2 b5 14.h4 h5 15.Bd3 Qf6 16.c3 Rb8 17.Rhe1 c5 18.Bf1 Rb6 19.Nh1 b4 20.c4 Ra6 21.Kb1 Qd8 22.g3 Qa5 23.b3 Qd8 24.Ne5 Qf6 25.Nf2 d6 26.Nfd3 Re8 0-1

Hrabusa,Matej (2304) - Potapov,Pavel (2379) [A83]
Arctic Cup 3rd Salekhard (4), 11.10.2007


1.d4 f5 2.e4 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 Nc6 5.d5 Ne5 6.Qe2 Nf7 7.h4 c6 8.0-0-0 cxd5 9.Nxd5 Nxd5 10.Rxd5 b6 11.g3 Bb7 12.Rd4 Nxg5 13.hxg5 e6 14.Bg2 Qxg5+ 15.Kb1 0-0-0 16.Bxe4 d5 17.Bxh7 Qf6 18.Rf4 Qe7 19.Qf3 Qd6 20.Ne2 Kb8 21.Rf7 Rd7 22.Rxd7 Qxd7 23.Bd3 Rxh1+ 24.Qxh1 e5 25.Qh8 Qf7 26.Qh2 e4 27.g4+ Qc7 28.Qh8 Qc5 29.Bb5 Qxf2 30.Nc1 Kc7 31.Qh5 Qf6 32.Qe8 Qe7 33.Qg6 a6 34.Be2 Qf6 35.Qh5 g5 36.Qh2+ Bd6 37.Qh7+ Kb8 38.Qd7 Be5 39.c3 d4 40.cxd4 Bxd4 41.Qe8+ Ka7 42.Qd7 Kb8 43.Qe8+ Kc7 44.Nb3 Bxb2 45.Nd2 Ba3 46.Nc4 Be7 47.Ne3 Bc6 48.Qg8 Qd4 49.Nc4 Qg1+ 50.Kc2 Qf2 0-1

Matviychuk,Andrey (2190) - Khaetsky,Roman (2379) [A83]
UKR Games (Men) 3rd Evpatoria (3), 22.05.2007


1.d4 f5 2.e4 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 Nc6 5.f3 d5 6.Bb5 a6 7.Ba4 b5 8.Bb3 Na5 9.Bxf6 Nxb3 10.Bxg7 Bxg7 11.axb3 0-0 12.Qd2 Bb7 13.0-0-0 Qd6 14.Kb1 e5 15.fxe4 exd4 16.Nxd5 Rae8 17.Nf3 Rxe4 18.Nb4 Bh6 19.Ng5 Qe7 20.h4 c5 21.Nd3 c4 22.bxc4 bxc4 23.Ne1 c3 24.Qc1 Bd5 25.b3 Rb8 26.Nd3 Bxb3 27.cxb3 Re2 28.b4 Rxb4+ 0-1

Bebchuk,Boris (2182) - Melnikov,Dmitry (2315) [A83]
St Petersburg White Nights op St Petersburg (6), 30.06.2007


1.d4 f5 2.e4 fxe4 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bg5 c6 5.Qe2 d5 6.f3 Bf5 7.Bxf6 gxf6 8.fxe4 dxe4 9.0-0-0 Qc7 10.Kb1 Nd7 11.g4 Bg6 12.Bg2 0-0-0 13.Bxe4 e5 14.Nf3 Bb4 15.Bxg6 Bxc3 16.Qd3 hxg6 17.Qxc3 e4 18.Nd2 f5 19.Rdf1 Rdf8 20.h4 Nb6 21.Qa3 Qg7 22.Qd6 Qd7 23.Nxe4 Qxd6 24.Nxd6+ Kc7 25.c4 Kxd6 26.c5+ Kd5 27.cxb6 axb6 28.h5 fxg4 29.hxg6 Rxh1 30.Rxh1 Rg8 31.Rh5+ Ke4 32.d5 cxd5 33.Rg5 Kf4 34.Rxd5 Rxg6 0-1





  
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drkodos
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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #7 - 02/07/08 at 16:23:18
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ArKheiN wrote on 02/07/08 at 14:51:22:
Yes 6.Qe2 is my favourite move, and the speciality of GM Timoshenko. After 6..c6 7.0.0.0 cxd5 8.Nxd5 and now what? 6..Nf7 is probably the main move where 7.h4 is good. Black often get the bishop pair but they have to like their swiss cheese. Probably still equal with best play.



Actually, 8. ...e6!  is a good move at this juncture.  According to my database & resources, it is the best chance for black and after grabbing back his pawn with a Queen sortie, White is not much better than equal.  


Shame on any Dutch player than does not know how to navigate these not-so-murky waters
  

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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #6 - 02/07/08 at 15:37:31
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DoubledPawns wrote on 02/07/08 at 08:27:28:
I remember that 4...Nc6 is not forced; I think there were alternatives such as 4...g6 (I will need to check) which are yet to be refuted. Probably White can get a small edge at best, but no refutation.


No, 4...Nc6 simply must be correct after 4.Bg5, or the Staunton is back in business.

Of course the Staunton is only really an antidote to the Leningrad, since Black (if he likes the French) can otherwise begin 1...e6.
  

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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #5 - 02/07/08 at 14:51:22
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Yes 6.Qe2 is my favourite move, and the speciality of GM Timoshenko. After 6..c6 7.0.0.0 cxd5 8.Nxd5 and now what? 6..Nf7 is probably the main move where 7.h4 is good. Black often get the bishop pair but they have to like their swiss cheese. Probably still equal with best play.
  
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1.a3 e5 2.Nc3 Ba3 3.Ne4
Bf8 4.Ra5 Ke7 5.Re5#

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Re: Dutch refuted by Staunton gambit???
Reply #4 - 02/07/08 at 08:27:28
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I remember that 4...Nc6 is not forced; I think there were alternatives such as 4...g6 (I will need to check) which are yet to be refuted. Probably White can get a small edge at best, but no refutation.
  

Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something - Plato
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