Latest Updates:
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie (Read 13627 times)
ArKheiN
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing.com!

Posts: 705
Location: Belgium
Joined: 03/30/05
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #34 - 12/19/13 at 22:02:19
Post Tools
To gewgaw, 3..cxd4 is not forced, but after 3..Bg7 there is 4.dxc5, 4.d5, or even 4.c4 where I can't play my Gurgenidze...
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Fllg
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 568
Joined: 05/30/09
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #33 - 12/19/13 at 18:50:35
Post Tools
After 3...Bg7 4.dxc5 Qa5+ 5.c3 Qxc5 6.Be3 Qc7 7.Na3! is at least a bit better for White imho. You also have to reckon with 4.d5 with a Benoni structure which perhaps is not to everybodys liking who wants to play the accelerated Dragon.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
gewgaw
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing.com!

Posts: 621
Location: europe
Joined: 09/09/04
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #32 - 12/19/13 at 15:48:39
Post Tools
Is 3.d4 cd4 forced? Why not 3. ...Bg7?
  

The older, the better - over 2200 and still rising.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Swiss_Dragon
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 135
Location: Garching
Joined: 05/03/05
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #31 - 12/19/13 at 13:21:32
Post Tools
ArKheiN wrote on 12/19/13 at 10:44:46:
- and your line 8..Qa5 9.Nc3 Bg7 which I have analysed. There is many lines here where Black has a very dynamical play here but there is a line where White just sacrifice the exchange and Black have many problems. Here is the line:
8..Qa5 9.Nc3 Bg7 10.0-0 (10.a3 should transpose as well) 0-0 11.a3! d5 12.exd6 Bf5 13.axb4! Qxb4 14.Qh4 with a strong initiative/attack for White.

What do you think about that SwissDragon?

Oops. I missed that exchange sacrifice. Yes, it looks rather unpleasent for Black. So better look at 7...Nb6.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ArKheiN
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing.com!

Posts: 705
Location: Belgium
Joined: 03/30/05
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #30 - 12/19/13 at 10:44:46
Post Tools
To Swiss Dragon:

I will have a look at 7..Nb6!? with your idea.

I never liked 7..Nc7.

My favourite move has always been 7..Nb4 and then:

8.Bb5! where Black has some choices:

- 8..Qa5 9.Nc3 d5 has been considered as refuted later since Silman's and Donaldson's Book.

-8..Bg7 without Qa5, which is too passive,

-8..a6 (it's the move I always had in mind in the case where someone plays this line against me) which is quite interesting but here too I don't see a "full" equalization, it's at least "+/=".

- and your line 8..Qa5 9.Nc3 Bg7 which I have analysed. There is many lines here where Black has a very dynamical play here but there is a line where White just sacrifice the exchange and Black have many problems. Here is the line:
8..Qa5 9.Nc3 Bg7 10.0-0 (10.a3 should transpose as well) 0-0 11.a3! d5 12.exd6 Bf5 13.axb4! Qxa1 14.Qh4 with a strong initiative/attack for White.

What do you think about that SwissDragon?
« Last Edit: 12/19/13 at 22:00:06 by ArKheiN »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Swiss_Dragon
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 135
Location: Garching
Joined: 05/03/05
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #29 - 12/19/13 at 08:12:53
Post Tools
ArKheiN wrote on 12/19/13 at 00:24:16:
Swiss Dragon, despite that, I am always afraid that someone plays to me 3.d4 cxd4 4.Qxd4! with good knowledge (which hasn't arised against me yet). I think this is the real test for Black. 4..Nf6 5.Qa4 Nc6 6.e5 (6.Nc3 is quite good too) Ne5 7.Qe4 and now do you really think Black can fully equalize? I think not.

You are right, 4.Qxd4! should be listed as a critical test for Black. As you say it is played very rarely. I think Black can get close to equality after 5.Qa4 Nc6 6.e5 Ne5 7.Qe4 Nb6! 8.Nc3 Bg7 9.Bf4 d5!
Also 7...Ndb4!? 8.Bb5 Qa5 9.Bc3 Bg7! is interesting.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ArKheiN
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing.com!

Posts: 705
Location: Belgium
Joined: 03/30/05
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #28 - 12/19/13 at 00:24:16
Post Tools
I love the accelerated dragon and the Gurgenidze and played it many time at 2000 to GM level with fair results, but I don't use the accelerated dragon move order because of the Rossolimo which I hate very much (mostly the quick Bxc6 against g6). So I have played it a lot with the hyper accelerated move order, and I have quite good results against 3.c3, 3.d4 cxd4 4.Qxd4 or other.

Swiss Dragon, despite that, I am always afraid that someone plays to me 3.d4 cxd4 4.Qxd4! with good knowledge (which hasn't arised against me yet). I think this is the real test for Black. 4..Nf6 5.Qa4 Nc6 6.e5 (6.Nc3 is quite good too) Ne5 7.Qe4 and now do you really think Black can fully equalize? I think not.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Swiss_Dragon
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 135
Location: Garching
Joined: 05/03/05
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #27 - 12/18/13 at 10:30:40
Post Tools
Hi all!

To add my 50 cent: I personally do like to play the (hyper-)accelerated dragon with 2...g6. The main advantages are:
1) White doesn't have annoying 3.Bb5 systems like against 2...d6 and 2...Nc6. Also the move c3 will always be met by d7-d5 in one go. I think Black is perfectly fine in the Alapin line with 2...g6.
2) White doesn't have the 9.0-0-0 and 9.g4 lines like against the normal dragon.

So White basically has two ways to fight for an advantage:
A) The Bc4-line against the dragon, which is what probably everyone of us likes to play with Black.
B) The Maroczy bind. Here I like the Gurgenidze system comined with early pushing the a-pawn a7-a5, a5-a4. In this line Black has more counter-chances than in most other Maroczy-lines. As an illustration see the following game.

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Othy
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


Light, seeking light,
doth light of light beguile.

Posts: 28
Joined: 02/02/11
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #26 - 12/18/13 at 00:50:09
Post Tools
That's great aggressive king play! Thanks for sharing.

I don't particularly care for 8.h3 for White, and might consider venturing something more like 8.Nfd2.



Altogether, though, against 2...g6, I might prefer a transposition to the Alapin with 3.c3, which I think is better for White against early fianchetto setups. But I just have Sveshnikov's work to go by for my conclusions there.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
chandrashekharkoravi
Full Member
***
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 155
Joined: 08/13/13
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #25 - 12/17/13 at 17:06:31
Post Tools
I think that this is a instructive game for black against maroczy bind
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bragesjo
God Member
*****
Offline


Long live the Nimzo Indian

Posts: 1406
Location: Eskilstuna
Joined: 06/30/06
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #24 - 12/17/13 at 13:17:47
Post Tools
I can also add that black can also play Qa5 vs Bc4 that sets up a trap, white is forced to castle short or lose a pawn for no compensation.

However, blacks positon in not that easy, since white can play Nb3 and will reach a Be2 line a tempo up if black retreats to d8 with the queen. If black instead retreats to c7 (most common move in my experience) black can no longer sacrifce that exchange at c3 without first moving a queen so  black will still be a tempo down and whites gets a stronger attack than reguar Be2 line. However it is stilll not that clear whites extra tempo means an edge.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Othy
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


Light, seeking light,
doth light of light beguile.

Posts: 28
Joined: 02/02/11
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #23 - 12/17/13 at 01:49:49
Post Tools
Ah, I see. Reading comprehension fail on my part.

Perhaps this reveals that subconsciously I've made my decision, since I was so consumed with the idea of the Maroczy that I failed to differentiate it from the explicit mention of Bc4. Thanks for the help, all.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
YaBB Moderator
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10083
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #22 - 12/16/13 at 18:00:47
Post Tools
Concrete: 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.Nc3 Bg7 6.Be3 Nf6 7.Bc4 O-O 8.Bb3 d6 9.f3 and Black has avoided both 9.O-O-O and 9.g4 in the Dragon.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MartinC
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 1905
Joined: 07/24/06
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #21 - 12/16/13 at 16:34:48
Post Tools
I think its the rather simpler point that to force an accelerated dragon Yugoslav style white has to commit to playing an early Bc4.

Hard to get back to 9 o-o-o/g4 then Smiley
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Othy
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


Light, seeking light,
doth light of light beguile.

Posts: 28
Joined: 02/02/11
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #20 - 12/16/13 at 15:56:20
Post Tools
MartinC wrote on 12/16/13 at 09:36:35:
Depends. In general I'd say that anything you know relatively well and gives you a chance to play for two results is more than good enough for normal usage.


Good point.  Grin

bragesjo wrote on 12/16/13 at 12:20:31:
If you play Bc4 yugoslav vs regular Dragon, enter the anti yugoslav lines would be praticall or else you have to learn two lines vs regular Dragon since there are players that play accelerated to avoid 9 0-0-0 but like to play vs 9 Bc4.


I used to play 9.Bc4 in the Yugoslav, but have not formally looked through its theory in many years (after some frustration with the Najdorf, I began playing 4.Qxd4, until eventually switching to a non-1.e4 repertoire). Until I get a chance to review the many significant theoretical advances I'm sure to have missed, I was intending to play 9.g4. Looking through some threads here, 9.0-0-0 has also looked interesting.

Can I ask to what transpositional trick you are referring? The only try I am familiar with is 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 g6, intending ...d7-d6 and entering the dragon having ruled out the Maroczy. However, my understanding is that 6.Nxc6 bxc6 7.e5 is good for White.

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bragesjo
God Member
*****
Offline


Long live the Nimzo Indian

Posts: 1406
Location: Eskilstuna
Joined: 06/30/06
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #19 - 12/16/13 at 12:20:31
Post Tools
If you play Bc4 yugoslav vs regular Dragon, enter the anti yugoslav lines would be praticall or else you have to learn two lines vs regular Dragon since there are players that play accelerated to avoid 9 0-0-0 but like to play vs 9 Bc4.




  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MartinC
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 1905
Joined: 07/24/06
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #18 - 12/16/13 at 09:36:35
Post Tools
Depends. In general I'd say that anything you know relatively well and gives you a chance to play for two results is more than good enough for normal usage.

Facing that sort of thing is hardly going to excite black players Smiley If there are then specific weaker players who are comfortably drawing against you in it then looking up something different would make sense.

Of course you might want to play something different for the interest. The early Nb3 lines should be in quite good standing I guess as in several fairly recent books.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Othy
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


Light, seeking light,
doth light of light beguile.

Posts: 28
Joined: 02/02/11
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #17 - 12/15/13 at 08:51:35
Post Tools
I'm going to revive this thread here, now a year later, rather than starting a new discussion.

I'm currently getting back to the White side and looking for the updated opinions on the lines discussed here. I used to play the Maroczy with great success a decade ago as a class B playing 9.Be3. Currently to my eye, the Gurgenidze looks like a pretty simple equalizing/drawing line for Black (and indeed, has been very easy for me playing some practice positions from the Black side). Primary opposition 1900-2300.

Should I just suck it up, create maximum complications in the Gurgenidze and congratulate my opponent for the effort if they're up to steadily holding the drawn ending?

I share bragesjo and BPaulsen's views on the 7.Nc2 setups.

Would entering the main lines of the Anti-Yugoslav with Nb3 be a better practical choice? Are the ...a5 lines a theoretical issue?

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bragesjo
God Member
*****
Offline


Long live the Nimzo Indian

Posts: 1406
Location: Eskilstuna
Joined: 06/30/06
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #16 - 12/22/12 at 10:58:24
Post Tools
Now have I acess to a board but I dont have access to my books so I can not double check but this was the closest thing I came to recreate the Nc2 from my memory, and thats hard since I dont play it wth either side!

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bragesjo
God Member
*****
Offline


Long live the Nimzo Indian

Posts: 1406
Location: Eskilstuna
Joined: 06/30/06
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #15 - 12/21/12 at 14:02:39
Post Tools
I can only add that for those who has never heard of Dzinzi he is well known to make analytical mistakes and overoptemistic evaluations on his promoted ideas, I have found several such things in the book I mentioned. So I one uses any Dzindzi analyse, be shure to double check them yourself!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
fling
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 1465
Joined: 01/21/11
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #14 - 12/21/12 at 12:58:48
Post Tools
chk wrote on 12/21/12 at 09:39:28:
From what I have seen mainly from Greet's book, both Be3 and Bg5 give a slight edge to White (maybe very slight as the situation is more or less as described by BPaulsen above). But the resulting endings may require some patient defence, hence my previous quote: "you will need good endgame skills to face the main line".

Well, this is mostly the case with many other setups for Black vs. the Bind (except maybe the ...f5-break tries). The main reason I suggested the Gurge as a starting point is mainly because it is easy to set up and remember.


I agree, and this is what I meant before too. Anyway, I don't know who really is better or worse in the Nc2-systems, I always thought White had a small edge if he avoids all the tactics (not that easy), but it is still solid for Black. I don't think any side is at +=/=+ anyway, maybe equal then!

I also think that endgame skills are more a necessity for the Accelerated Dragon compared to the proper Dragon variation (maybe just memory for those...).

The key to the Maroczy bind is experience and patience. Both sides have to time counterplay etc. Much more important than the theoretical verdict at club level, IMO.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
chk
God Member
*****
Offline


a pawn is a pawn

Posts: 1063
Location: Athens
Joined: 10/26/06
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #13 - 12/21/12 at 09:39:28
Post Tools
From what I have seen mainly from Greet's book, both Be3 and Bg5 give a slight edge to White (maybe very slight as the situation is more or less as described by BPaulsen above). But the resulting endings may require some patient defence, hence my previous quote: "you will need good endgame skills to face the main line".

Well, this is mostly the case with many other setups for Black vs. the Bind (except maybe the ...f5-break tries). The main reason I suggested the Gurge as a starting point is mainly because it is easy to set up and remember.
  

"I play honestly and I play to win. If I lose, I take my medicine." - Bobby
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
BPaulsen
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love Light Squares!

Posts: 1702
Location: Anaheim, CA, USA
Joined: 11/02/08
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #12 - 12/21/12 at 04:51:59
Post Tools
The main line in Experts Versus the Sicilian was equal as far as I could tell. I don't think the claim of a white edge reasonable, nor should white lose with accurate play (in some ways black is a tad easier to play). That was my findings after spending a lot of time on it.

As an aside, the main line Gurgenidze with Be3 (instead of Bg5) isn't fully equal for black as far as I know. Given many white players aren't all that good at milking small edges of the spatial variety against solid but passive positions, you can expect to draw frequently against all but the most prepared GMs with good technical skills fairly easily.
  

2288 USCF, 2186 FIDE.

FIDE based on just 27 games.
Back to top
YIMAIM  
IP Logged
 
fling
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 1465
Joined: 01/21/11
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #11 - 12/20/12 at 21:01:03
Post Tools
Well, Chess Openings for Black Explained had some nice points, but it is Dzindzi work you know. I can't really believe it is better for Black either, more like a small edge for White.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kylemeister
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 4134
Location: USA
Joined: 10/24/05
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #10 - 12/20/12 at 20:56:10
Post Tools
Over the years I've seen that Maroczy line with Nc2 and ...Nf6 regarded as +=, = or unclear -- a claim that it should be =+ is surprising indeed.
Incidentally a couple of old games it reminds me of are Portisch-Tukmakov and Keene-Tal -- though Keene in effect played the black side of the reversed-color version from the English.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bragesjo
God Member
*****
Offline


Long live the Nimzo Indian

Posts: 1406
Location: Eskilstuna
Joined: 06/30/06
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #9 - 12/20/12 at 20:25:41
Post Tools
About 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.c4 Nf6  6.Nc3 d6 and allows 7.Nc2 I actually dont think that white has anything special in this line. Experts vs the Sicilian recommended Nc2 and called the most critical line, (a side note on a exchange sac that can not be accepted)  an edge for white while for example Chess Openings for black Explained called the position the opposete (an edge for black). I am not shure who is better since computers are very closed to 0.00 but every decent engine I tried has had extremly small negative numbers.

I dont have ny board at the moment so I can not give the exact variation, it is only from memory and I dont play accelerated Dragon as black since it is  very hard to win against a good players vs the Bind.

About Bc4 Yugoslav like and Qa5 line, it is true that it forces 0-0 but the drawbacks are than white can play a later Nb3 that tranpsoses to Dragon 0-0 line with the difference that whites attack is stronger since black will either be a tempo down on a normal line or place the Queen at c7 that rules out any Rxc3 exchange sacs line. I won a team match lasting seasons as white in this line when black became desperation when my attack got started quickly.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
YaBB Moderator
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10083
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #8 - 12/20/12 at 14:49:07
Post Tools
chk wrote on 12/20/12 at 13:08:47:
I agree and I would suggest that you first have a glance at the Gurgenidze set-up vs. the Maroczy. imo it is the easiest setup to learn and remember and not particularly easy for the White player to prove anything.

1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.c4 Nf6  6.Nc3 Nxd4 (d6 allows 7.Nc2) 7.Qxd4 Bg7 8.Bg5 O-O 9.Qd2 preparing Nd5 doesn't looks so easy to me for Black.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
chk
God Member
*****
Offline


a pawn is a pawn

Posts: 1063
Location: Athens
Joined: 10/26/06
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #7 - 12/20/12 at 13:08:47
Post Tools
I agree and I would suggest that you first have a glance at the Gurgenidze set-up vs. the Maroczy. imo it is the easiest setup to learn and remember and not particularly easy for the White player to prove anything. But you will need good endgame skills to face the main line (though some interesting alternatives for Black do exist e.g. for the connoisseurs: ...Qxa2 vs. 7. f3).
  

"I play honestly and I play to win. If I lose, I take my medicine." - Bobby
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MartinC
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 1905
Joined: 07/24/06
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #6 - 12/19/12 at 21:22:18
Post Tools
That depends on how hard you mean by hard Smiley At an awful lot of levels it's entirely fine. It takes really quite a good player to be able to 'sit' on a Marozcy bind style position.

Greet's starting out book is much more than enough to well above that level. It's lot more thorough/thicker than their standard starting out book. Plenty of good explanations of the plans too though.

It's basically just an excellent book Smiley It also includes a lot of different plans vs the Marozcy, some of which are plentifully unbalanced.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
CanadianClub
Senior Member
****
Offline


Greetings from Catalonia!

Posts: 263
Joined: 11/11/12
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #5 - 12/19/12 at 19:40:39
Post Tools
Well, it seems that the Acc. Dragon is more a draw weapon against hard oposition than nothing else, isn't it?

But I'm going to try here and there and we'll see if it suits me (especially against Exchange French entusiats  xDD)...

thx !
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Bonsai
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 616
Joined: 03/13/04
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #4 - 12/19/12 at 14:35:27
Post Tools
RdC wrote on 12/19/12 at 12:57:12:
3) The options of Dragon Sicilians of being mated against a wild attack 0-0-0 + Bh6 + h4 + h5 and so on... are there also in Accelerated Variations?

Traditional wisdom is that playing the Accelerated forces White into lines where he has to play 0-0 because otherwise Black can play d7-d5 in one move instead of two.

That wisdom dates back to at least as far as a 1968 Candidates match between Tal and Korchnoi. On re-examination, it seems to me that Black gets a difficult ending which Korchnoi was able to defend. So Black can only avoid main line hacks by being able to play this or similar endings.

http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1081850

You are of course referring to 7...0-0. 7...Qa5 more or less forces 8.0-0 and I'd have no concerns playing the resulting positions against weaker players. Instead after 7...0-0 there's also the wild a5 + d5 lines.

In any case, the one big problem with the AccDragon is the Maroczy Bind. If you are fine with playing the positions from one of the possible lines against that that, everything else is more managable.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
chk
God Member
*****
Offline


a pawn is a pawn

Posts: 1063
Location: Athens
Joined: 10/26/06
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #3 - 12/19/12 at 14:16:11
Post Tools
My input:
1) Yes, but not at all if you add the anti-sicilians. I think you will need to eventually read 2 opening books (1 on Acc. Dragon & 1 on Anti-Sicilians).
2) It is a very solid opening and IMO not suited for winning vs. lower rated opponents. e.g. I was considering it also as a 2nd weapon to couple my Najdorf, but for situations that I would like to play sth solid. The main problem is the Maroczy Bind where Black has rather few chances to play for a win (and I must confess I am amazed you were allowed to play e6+d5 in your games).
3) Not really, there are many ways to semi-force White into O-O.
4) It depends (I'd say almost yes to both of your questions). Maybe not 'huge' as you say, but a problem nevertheless. However, as fling says above, it is useful that you know the French and thus can play with a 'French' pawn structure (and maybe also 'French' plans) vs. the Alapin (proper or deferred) and the Closed Sicilian/KIA/Grand Prix.
5) Excellent choice, I second what fling says above.

my 2c, chk  Cool
  

"I play honestly and I play to win. If I lose, I take my medicine." - Bobby
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
RdC
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 665
Joined: 05/17/08
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #2 - 12/19/12 at 12:57:12
Post Tools
3) The options of Dragon Sicilians of being mated against a wild attack 0-0-0 + Bh6 + h4 + h5 and so on... are there also in Accelerated Variations?

Traditional wisdom is that playing the Accelerated forces White into lines where he has to play 0-0 because otherwise Black can play d7-d5 in one move instead of two.

That wisdom dates back to at least as far as a 1968 Candidates match between Tal and Korchnoi. On re-examination, it seems to me that Black gets a difficult ending which Korchnoi was able to defend. So Black can only avoid main line hacks by being able to play this or similar endings.

http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1081850
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
fling
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 1465
Joined: 01/21/11
Gender: Male
Re: Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
Reply #1 - 12/19/12 at 12:51:49
Post Tools
I'll take a shot:

1. Yes, the amount of theory is smaller IMO.

2. Yes, against passive/inferior opponents it's ok. However, against good play from White, the winning chances are very small. It is a solid system but kinda hard to have any chances if White knows what to aim for. Not as imbalanced as say the Tarrasch.

3. You will probably meet these at club level too, but they are nothing to worry about if you know the variations. Black has not spent a tempo on ...d6 and can e.g. sometime strike in the centre with ...d5 against this, or use the tempo for something else to defend without problems.

4. Well, these are my main problem with the Sicilians at club-level. Nothing really threatening to Black, but White often dictates the pawn structure etc, as compared to the French where you can most of the times get e6-d5 no matter what. The c3-sicilian might be hard to generate good winning chances against.

5. Yes. It is a great book. Maybe the best of all Starting Out, because it is really explaining what is going on.

I can add that knowing the French can help you out a lot in some of the anti-sicilians. And vice versa.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
CanadianClub
Senior Member
****
Offline


Greetings from Catalonia!

Posts: 263
Joined: 11/11/12
Gender: Male
Accelerated Dragon questions from a newbie
12/19/12 at 12:23:32
Post Tools
Hi,

I'm a French Defense player (elo aprox 1950). But I saw last week a video called "The Accelerated Dragon Assault" or something like that in a friend house (in fact not the entire video) and I liked a lot the type of positions Black achieve in some variants, with very powerfull bishops, some nice tactics...  And he told me that the amount of theory of their AccDragon is smaller than my French. I played some 5 min games against a 2050 player of my club last Saturday (not same opponent) and all the matches went with a Maroczy Bind plus an e6+d5 break from me to get dynamic (a little risky compared with my French) but playable positions.

But I have some questions:

1) Is really smaller that amount of theory to play that Acc. Dragon (compared with my Advance, Exchange, KIA, Guimard and Nc6-vs-Nc3 variants... of my French) ?

2) Options to win against passive/inferior opponents are enough to consider it as a 2nd weapon of my arsenal (compared to Exchange French, for example) ?

3) The options of Dragon Sicilians of being mated against a wild attack 0-0-0 + Bh6 + h4 + h5 and so on... are there also in Accelerated Variations?

4) Are Anti-Sicilians (Rossolimo, Alapin, Morra...) a huge amount of work now (and are they a really problem or not) ?

5) Is Greet Starting Out book enough at my level (I play against foes between 1900 and 2100) ?


I know the answers of my friend but I don't consider it enough; I hope he don't read this  Grin

Thx in advance, maybe I'm going to deal with you dragons in a future...
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo