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Normal Topic Any move orders the Modern should avoid? (Read 1025 times)
HagenWatch1
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Re: Any move orders the Modern should avoid?
Reply #3 - 04/18/15 at 17:38:59
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RdC wrote on 04/18/15 at 11:14:52:
HagenWatch1 wrote on 04/18/15 at 01:41:10:
I'm curious about move orders in the Modern that shouldn't be used when White uses certain openings that might trick or confuse Modern defenses.



I would think that depends as Black on what positions you want to play or avoid. As one example, if White is allowed to play e4,d4 and c4, the objective best plan can be just to play .. Nf6 and transpose to a Kings Indian. If White plays e4,f4,Nf3 without playing d4, it can be difficult not to play .. c5 thereby transposing to a Sicilian. If you play Sniper style with g6, Bg7 and c5, avoiding a transposition to an Accelerated Dragon can be difficult if White wants to allow it.

I would suggest that for success in the Modern, it's necessary to know your way round a few other openings where there are transpositional chances.



This is why I would have loved the Modern Tiger edition even more had it done the work in tree format to follow variations more easily. Doing complete games in my opinion is nice but doesn't help when you need to see the variation trees at a glance to locate the line you're looking for.

Transposing to a King's Indian does seem to be the answer to many of these White opening moves...but that puts me in a bind because in that case I'd be playing the King's Indian rather than the Modern defense. If that's the case then it means move order is more important than ever in the Modern otherwise I could be drunk and go to a tournament and simply play the Modern Defense regardless of what White plays.

Then there's that chapter where the author gives the funny example of being screamed at in bed late at night about why would God allow people to play the Modern Defense only to be forced to play the King's Indian line when White plays e4,d4 and c4 in consecutive order. I'm assuming this could happen only if your opponent knows you like to play the Modern Defense. Otherwise how could the opponent "know" what move order you'd take after the moves 1. e4 g6? Well, scratch that...maybe 1...g6 is giving away the game plan too early? Maybe 1...d6 would be better? I certainly can't play 1...Nf6 because that leads to the Alekhine Defense. 1...d5 is out because that's the Scandinavian. I have been wondering about this move order...1. e4 e6...feinting the French Defense...only to go the other direction after White plays 2. d4 and go 2...g6?! But then after 3. Nf3 Bg7 comes 4. Bg5! attacking the Queen. Now I'm trapped because I have to reply 4...Ne7 or 4...f6 blocking the bishop on g7.
  
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RdC
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Re: Any move orders the Modern should avoid?
Reply #2 - 04/18/15 at 11:14:52
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HagenWatch1 wrote on 04/18/15 at 01:41:10:
I'm curious about move orders in the Modern that shouldn't be used when White uses certain openings that might trick or confuse Modern defenses.



I would think that depends as Black on what positions you want to play or avoid. As one example, if White is allowed to play e4,d4 and c4, the objective best plan can be just to play .. Nf6 and transpose to a Kings Indian. If White plays e4,f4,Nf3 without playing d4, it can be difficult not to play .. c5 thereby transposing to a Sicilian. If you play Sniper style with g6, Bg7 and c5, avoiding a transposition to an Accelerated Dragon can be difficult if White wants to allow it.

I would suggest that for success in the Modern, it's necessary to know your way round a few other openings where there are transpositional chances.
  
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Stanley
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Re: Any move orders the Modern should avoid?
Reply #1 - 04/18/15 at 04:42:36
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Hi Hagen's Watch,

      much like some of your other threads and your suggested 'New Move in the Caro-Kann Advance for White,7.Bh3' Smiley,maybe just post some of your games to show where you are having trouble?

Or at least,in this case,post your Modern Defence games or talk through ideas you've found yourself. Sorry,I get the impression from your posts with your strong views on chess matters that you are quite an active player,OTB or online? Hence the suggestion.
  
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HagenWatch1
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Any move orders the Modern should avoid?
04/18/15 at 01:41:10
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I'm curious about move orders in the Modern that shouldn't be used when White uses certain openings that might trick or confuse Modern defenses.

For example, I was surprised one day into being tricked to playing a Closed Sicilian line when White started off with 1. Nf3.

So this got me thinking about trick move orders Black needs to be aware of before diving into the Modern. So are there opening move order that Black needs to be careful about before responding to White should he or she play not so obvious opening move choices?
  
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