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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Correspondence Chess in a new age (Read 7854 times)
nimzo5
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #43 - 12/18/17 at 00:03:02
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TRW-

As a fellow ICCF player with a less ambitious goal of getting some IM norms. I repeatedly find that anything less than massive time, attention and resources fail to accomplish a better than 2300-2350 type performance.  When I get through an IM norm tournament with 50% score and someone else grabs a norm I spend quite a bit of time looking at their wins (time forfeit aside) to try to see if there is anything I can learn from:
1) the opening choice (including the historical repertoire of both players)
2) any favored engine (see if they repeatedly use stockfish etc.)
3) style (are they anticomputer types, first choice engine etc.)
4) how quickly they played

etc.

I think there was a nice window between 2013-2015 where a motivated person could really make some headway. Now, I am a bit in awe of how powerful engines are - I can spend 3 days of analysis in Aquarium and have little to add to what a Xeon running H6 might come up with in an hour.

Still, I think a little gumption goes a long way in activity.

Best Regards,

Nimzo5
  

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Jupp53
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #42 - 10/12/17 at 16:03:56
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Sharing and discussing is the key to detect your errors.
  

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brabo
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #41 - 10/12/17 at 08:32:16
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ErictheRed wrote on 10/11/17 at 20:43:10:
dfan wrote on 10/11/17 at 19:34:28:
brabo wrote on 10/11/17 at 07:35:16:
In fact I was thinking to write a new article for my blog about people not willing to answer technical questions about chess. Recently I played against an IM and he refused to answer my question what he had prepared against the line I normally play in the opening we had on the board.

That seems entirely reasonable to me.


Seriously, why would he answer that question?  Unless he was a personal friend or something.

We are living in a society which is becoming more and more individualistic. We see this in the post-mortems but also here on the forum. Players share less information than before.

However I still believe sharing is much more productive than just hiding things. I share a lot but I am also getting back a lot of useful information by grateful people. In the end we become both better and stronger from such voluntary cooperation.

If my opponent would've just shared what he prepared then I would've gladly shared all my investigations in that particular opening. He knows very well that even if we ever meet each other again (maybe never) that I will never permit him to let me hit with that preparation.
  
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brabo
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #40 - 10/12/17 at 08:08:44
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Seeley wrote on 10/11/17 at 20:54:27:
brabo wrote on 10/11/17 at 07:35:16:
In fact I was thinking to write a new article for my blog about people not willing to answer technical questions about chess. Recently I played against an IM and he refused to answer my question what he had prepared against the line I normally play in the opening we had on the board. I played a different line which I had in store as back-up against a too heavy preparation.

I wouldn't consider that a 'technical question about chess'. What you asked your opponent to do was to reveal part of his opening repertoire, or at the very least to share with you an idea that he'd worked on before your game that he might wish to use in the future, be it against you or against someone else. Why should he tell you that? I most certainly wouldn't share that information with an opponent and, to be honest, I'd consider it a bit cheeky if someone asked me to.

Well it concerned a line of which I am almost sure he will never get on the board again. I am talking about the opening which I discussed in my article http://chess-brabo.blogspot.com/2016/10/avrukh-part-2.html see the idea of 8... Nbd7. I am the only player in the databases, having played it more than once in practice. It just sounds ridiculous for me that an amateur doesn't want to share his preparation in such scenario. Besides I have a very strong suspicion of what he prepared so I justed wanted to know if I guessed it correctly. Anyway the post-mortem was immediately stopped after this.
  
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HgMan
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #39 - 10/11/17 at 22:08:23
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Focus, people!   Angry
  

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an ordinary chessplayer
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #38 - 10/11/17 at 21:32:32
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@Seeley - I'm with you on this one. For the most part, preparation that can be used in the future is just not discussed. Occasionally one might reference a specific game that had been looked at, but not the actual novelty! In the hypothetical case that my opponent is known to blog about openings, I would be even more reluctant to reveal the unknown. I think it was Larsen who wrote: "Masters are willing to reveal their improvements for a price - one point!"
  
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Seeley
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #37 - 10/11/17 at 20:54:27
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brabo wrote on 10/11/17 at 07:35:16:
In fact I was thinking to write a new article for my blog about people not willing to answer technical questions about chess. Recently I played against an IM and he refused to answer my question what he had prepared against the line I normally play in the opening we had on the board. I played a different line which I had in store as back-up against a too heavy preparation.

I wouldn't consider that a 'technical question about chess'. What you asked your opponent to do was to reveal part of his opening repertoire, or at the very least to share with you an idea that he'd worked on before your game that he might wish to use in the future, be it against you or against someone else. Why should he tell you that? I most certainly wouldn't share that information with an opponent and, to be honest, I'd consider it a bit cheeky if someone asked me to.
  
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ErictheRed
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #36 - 10/11/17 at 20:43:10
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dfan wrote on 10/11/17 at 19:34:28:
brabo wrote on 10/11/17 at 07:35:16:
In fact I was thinking to write a new article for my blog about people not willing to answer technical questions about chess. Recently I played against an IM and he refused to answer my question what he had prepared against the line I normally play in the opening we had on the board.

That seems entirely reasonable to me.


Seriously, why would he answer that question?  Unless he was a personal friend or something.
  
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dfan
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #35 - 10/11/17 at 19:34:28
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brabo wrote on 10/11/17 at 07:35:16:
In fact I was thinking to write a new article for my blog about people not willing to answer technical questions about chess. Recently I played against an IM and he refused to answer my question what he had prepared against the line I normally play in the opening we had on the board.

That seems entirely reasonable to me.
  
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brabo
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #34 - 10/11/17 at 07:35:16
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trw wrote on 10/10/17 at 19:13:10:
brabo wrote on 10/10/17 at 07:27:59:
trw wrote on 10/10/17 at 05:07:06:
They kept trying to attribute the novelty to him but he refused saying he found it in a correspondence database.

I doubt very much that anybody asked directly Kramnik where the novelty came from. Besides you can't expect that these top-players will reveal their sources. There is always secrecy around which players, computer-networks, databases... they have access to. You can't blame them to behave like that as at that level it is all about collecting information and surprising the opponent.



I don't know if the video interview is still stored anywhere but yes they did directly ask him. If I have time later, I will try to find it.

That would be great. In fact I was thinking to write a new article for my blog about people not willing to answer technical questions about chess. Recently I played against an IM and he refused to answer my question what he had prepared against the line I normally play in the opening we had on the board. I played a different line which I had in store as back-up against a too heavy preparation.
  
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #33 - 10/11/17 at 02:41:49
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Shall we use Facebook to form a private group?
  

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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #32 - 10/10/17 at 22:33:22
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ErictheRed wrote on 09/04/17 at 19:26:47:
I'm sort of curious: if a player had a state-of-the-art computer (all the best hardware) and simply played correspondence by letting it run as deeply as he possibly could, then making the first choice of the engine every time; about what rating would that correspondence player have these days, do you think?


We'd probably have to better define what "state-of-the-art" hardware means these days, but 2200-2300 Elo seems like a good guess. I would not expect more, maybe less, perhaps.

I've played and beaten players who, by all appearances, almost totally relied on their overnight analysis, using average hardware [something like a quad], and they were rated less than 2000 ICCF. This suggests that average hardware alone can yield around 1900 Elo at best.
  

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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #31 - 10/10/17 at 19:13:10
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brabo wrote on 10/10/17 at 07:27:59:
trw wrote on 10/10/17 at 05:07:06:
They kept trying to attribute the novelty to him but he refused saying he found it in a correspondence database.

I doubt very much that anybody asked directly Kramnik where the novelty came from. Besides you can't expect that these top-players will reveal their sources. There is always secrecy around which players, computer-networks, databases... they have access to. You can't blame them to behave like that as at that level it is all about collecting information and surprising the opponent.



I don't know if the video interview is still stored anywhere but yes they did directly ask him. If I have time later, I will try to find it.
  
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Jupp53
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #30 - 10/10/17 at 17:05:14
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Having an old version of Tim Hardings CD I can clearly say it was better than ChessBase.
  

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brabo
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Re: Correspondence Chess in a new age
Reply #29 - 10/10/17 at 07:27:59
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trw wrote on 10/10/17 at 05:07:06:
They kept trying to attribute the novelty to him but he refused saying he found it in a correspondence database.

I doubt very much that anybody asked directly Kramnik where the novelty came from. Besides you can't expect that these top-players will reveal their sources. There is always secrecy around which players, computer-networks, databases... they have access to. You can't blame them to behave like that as at that level it is all about collecting information and surprising the opponent.
  
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