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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) C01,C15: Exchange Winawer (Read 9378 times)
dom
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #21 - 12/03/04 at 06:42:48
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One way to play critical line: 8...Qd6!? see Lutz-Kindermann,Garmisch Partenkirchen 1994 (Tiemann)
and I had following try with it: 9.Ne2 Bd7 10.Bf4 Qd7 11.h3 ooo 12.Rb1 f6 13.Bd2 g5 14.Ng3 Rdg8 15.Qe2 Nd8 16.Nh5 Rf8 17.Bb5 c6 18.Ba6 Nf5 19.oo Nh4? (too much ... defending is better: 19...Nd6)  Fressinet-Laurain, simul Casterlsarrasin 2003
  

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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #20 - 11/22/04 at 18:48:05
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Having taken a closer look at
   1 e4 e6 2 d4 d5 3 Nc3 Bb4 4 exd5 exd5 5 Bd3 Nc6 6 a3  Bxc3+ 7 bxc3 Ne7 8 Qh5     I must say i think white has good chances for advantage.

After 8... Be6 ( 8...g6 is more solid but it leaves white with nice edge )9.Rb1 b6 10.Nf3 Qd711.Ng5 0-0-0 12 0-0  Bg4 13 Qxf7 h6 14 f3 Rdf8 15 Qxg7

Now McDonald consider this position without the inclusion of 9 Rb1  b6 as good for black . However this detail change the assesment 180 degrees. The reason is that Bf5 i now not good.

Without Rb1 b6 it goes

14 ... Bf5 15 Nf7 Rhg8 16 Ne5 Rxg7 17 Nxd7 Rfg8!! and the active rooks eats into g2 and second rank .

However with 9 Rb1 b6 it goes:

15... Bf5 16 Nf7 Rhg8 17 Ba6+! Kb8 18 Ne5 and Nxd7 is check so  black has no time for Rfg8.

So does white have an advantage after 7 .... Ne7   Undecided
  
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #19 - 03/20/04 at 11:39:16
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psakhis considers 5....nc6 as most accurate. The fact is that the sequence rb1 b6 at any point  not necessarily is pluss for white and black can quite safely castle queenside. ne7 is usually considered better than nf6 since:

1 it doesnt obstruct a kingside pawn avalanche

2 the focal point on f5 is very important. If black can exchange his bishop on f5, he is usually better.

3 bg5 can be met by f6

Finally the critical line seems:
1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.exd5 exd5 5.Bd3 Nc6 6.a3 Bxc3 7.bxc3 Nge7 8.Qh5 Be6 9.Rb1 b6 10.Nf3 Qd711.Ng5 0-0-0! seems possible as in brendel-jusupov but without move rb1 b6. Its very tactical but according to mcdonald unclear.

5 bd3 c6 is possible but it apears that white is very comfertabel as well and gives black few chances than trying to equalise

The last alternative is 5 bd3 ne7!?
  
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #18 - 12/02/03 at 14:32:50
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Just history...I recall game 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.exd5 exd5 4.Nf3 Nf6 5.Be3 (not so common nowadays) Bd6 6.c4 c6 7.Nc3 oo 8.cxd5 cxd5 9.Bd3 Nc6 10.oo Bg4 11.h3 Bh5 12.g4 Bg6 13.a3 Qd7 14.Nh4 Rae8 15.Bf5 Bxf5 16.Nxf5 Bb8 17.Qf3 Ne4 18.Rae1 Re6 19.Qg2 Rfe8 20.Nxe4 Rxe4 Winawer-Blackburne,Baden Baden 1870
  

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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #17 - 11/29/03 at 20:44:12
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Indeed. I think 5...c6 is certainly a clearer way to seek equality.
  
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #16 - 11/29/03 at 20:09:09
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Thanks for the replies.  I'm starting to think 5...Nc6 is already a slight mistake.
  
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #15 - 11/29/03 at 10:27:03
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Reply to Glenn Snow: one plan for White after 7...Nf6 is to pin knight f6. Following moves might be: 8.Bg5 oo 9.Ne2 h6 10.Bh4 Re8 11.oo Na5 12.Qd2! (with the idea Qf4) Qd6 (12...Nc4?!13.Qf4 g5?! 14.Bxg5 hxg5 15.Qxg5+ Kh8 16.Qh6+ Kg8 17.Nf4!) Qd6 13.Bg3 Qd7 14.Qf4 c6 15.Rfe1 with small advantage to White. The only way for Black to avoid the line is: 10....Na5 11.oo Qd6 but here too White can play similar plan with Bg3 and then Qd2 or play another plan with Rb1.

About Short-Beliavsky,Dortmund 1995 Minev gives in his book (New and forgotten ideas about the French), Nikolic idea 9...Nf5!? but I admit I don't know what to do after 10.oo oo 11.Nf4!?
  

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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #14 - 11/28/03 at 15:07:44
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The second game transposes but with 10. Bg5 being played instead of Pedersen's 10. Ng3
  
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #13 - 11/27/03 at 20:38:49
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Is there an improvement for White in the Pedersen line with 7...Nf6 I gave above?
  
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #12 - 11/24/03 at 18:44:30
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I certainly don't think this line can be that cut and dry. Clearly White must have a good deal of attacking chances given the number of players who have played this opening. Why is this opening so popular with strong White players who use the French as their primary opening with black? Nataf, Timman, and Short have all found this to be a worthy continuation, even against extremely strong opponents. There's a game from 1995 between Short and Beliavsky that I just have to post:

[Event "Dortmund"]
[Site "Dortmund"]
[Date "1995.07.??"]
[Round "8"]
[White "Short,Nigel D"]
[Black "Beliavsky,Alexander G"]
[Result "1-0"]
[Eco "C01"]
1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.exd5 exd5 5.Bd3 Nc6 6.a3 Bxc3+ 7.bxc3 Qf6 8.Rb1 Nge7
9.Ne2 Ng6 10.0-0 0-0 11.f4 Bf5 12.Bxf5 Qxf5 13.Ng3 Qd7 14.f5 Nge7 15.f6 Nc8 16.fxg7 Re8
17.Nh5 Re6 18.Qg4  1-0

Also, that line against 7...Nf6 8. Bg5 might not be an open and shut case:

[Event "Moscow op2"]
[Site "Moscow"]
[Date "1995.11.??"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Vorotnikov,Vladislav V"]
[Black "Zakharov,Alexander V"]
[Result "1-0"]
[Eco "C01"]
1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.exd5 exd5 4.Nc3 Bb4 5.Bd3 Nc6 6.a3 Bxc3+ 7.bxc3 Nf6 8.Ne2 0-0
9.0-0 Na5 10.Bg5 h6 11.Bh4 Qd6 12.Rb1 b6 13.Qd2 Bd7 14.f3 Rfe8 15.Rfe1 Nh7 16.Bg3 Qxa3
17.Bxc7 Nf8 18.Ra1 Qe7 19.Nf4 Be6 20.Nxd5 Qd7 21.Bxb6 axb6 22.Nxb6 Qc7 23.Nxa8 Rxa8 24.Qe3 Rc8
25.Qe5 Nc4 26.Qxc7 Rxc7 27.Ra8 g5 28.Rea1 Nb6 29.Rb8 Nbd7 30.Rb5 Nf6 31.Raa5 N8d7 32.d5 Nxd5
33.Rxd5 Bxd5 34.Rxd5 Kg7 35.c4 Nb6 36.Rd4 Rc6 37.Kf2 Kf6 38.Ke3 Na4 39.Rd5 Nc5 40.Bf5 Na4
41.Bd3 Nc5 42.f4 Ne6 43.g3 Rc8 44.f5  1-0

I fail to believe that any line that has yet been shown guarantees Black equality in this line. That doesn't mean White is completely winning, but there are plenty of chances to be had.
  
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Glenn Snow
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #11 - 10/04/03 at 15:33:58
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After 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.exd5 exd5 5.Bd3 Nc6 6.a3 Bxc3 7.bxc3 Nge7, better than 8.Qf3 might be 8.Qh5! (exclam given by IM S.Pedersen) due to 8...Be6 9.Rb1 b6 10.Nf3 (not mentioned by Watson) 10...Qd6 11.Ng5 h6 12.Nxe6 Qxe6 13.Be3 0-0 14.0-0 Na5 15.Rbe1 Qf6 16.Bc1 c6 17.Re3 with a strong attack.  He (Pedersen) likes, 7...Nf6 8.Ne2 (8.Bg5 h6 9.Bh4 0-0 10.Ne2 Na5 11.0-0 Qd6 12.Rb1 b6 =) 8...Na5 9.0-0 0-0 10.Ng3 Bg4! 11.f3 Bd7 12.Re1 Re8 13.Bf4 Rxe1+ 14.Qxe1 Nc4 15.Bxc4 dxc4 16.Qe5 Qe8!=
  
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #10 - 10/04/03 at 03:34:28
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Is early move Rb1 an improvement ?
I prefer 9.Rb1 to force b6 and 11.Nf4!? (instead of 11.Ng5) given in Psakhis and NCO Teske-Lenz,Aschach 1987.
Kuligowski gives 9.Nh3! with small advantage to White and refers to Lau-Polanica Zdroj 1986, but I have only found one other (?) game Lau-Farago, Rubinstein Memorial 1986 with 9.Rb1 Na5 10.Nh3 Bxh3
  

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Glenn Snow
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #9 - 10/03/03 at 20:59:44
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After 7.Bxc3 Nge7 8.Qf3, Watson recommends 8...Be6 9.Nh3 (if 9.Rb1, then 9...b6 10.Nh3 Qd7 11.Ng5 O-O-O) 9...Qd7 10.Nf4 Bf5 11.O-O O-O-O ("With chances for both sides", Psakhis.) 12.a4 h5!
Are there any White improvements on this?
  
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Re: Exchange Winawer
Reply #8 - 08/26/03 at 05:03:12
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I'd rather have my knight on c6 rather than d7. Mind you, I'd also rather like 2 bishops too...
  

"When I am White, I am because I am White. When I am Black, I win because I am Bogolyubov" (?!) - Efim Bogolyubov, noted chess player and optimist.
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Winawer (the man and the variation)
Reply #7 - 08/17/03 at 04:21:28
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Tim Harding wrote a good chess&"historical" paper about Winawer. Read it quickly (before it moves) at URL: http://www.chesscafe.com/TIM/kibb.htm
  

“Learn from the mistakes of others. You can never live long enough to make them all yourself.”  - Groucho Marx
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