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MNb
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #15 - 04/01/04 at 16:28:31
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I would say kingside, though my silicon partner does not mind queenside either.
  

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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #14 - 03/28/04 at 20:26:13
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And which side will White castle on??
  
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MNb
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #13 - 03/28/04 at 17:46:13
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After 1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 g6 4.Be3 c6 5.h3 Nbd7 6.f4 b5 7.Bd3 e5 8.Nf3 b4 9.Ne2 exd4 10.Bxd4 c5 11.Be3 Qe7 12.Ng3 White is preparing for an attack, wherever the Black king will go or stay. Maybe it is a matter of taste, but I can not imagine that any attacking player has objections against this line. Another option is 11.Bf2 intending Bh4 of course.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
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MNb
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #12 - 03/28/04 at 16:40:10
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In the Austrian Attack c7-c6 is not considered very strong for Black. That is why 4.Be3 c6 5.h3 Bg7 6.f4.
After 4.Be3 Bg7 I want to play a plan that every Dragoneer should recognize: Qd2, o-o-o, f3, Bh6, h2-h4-h5 and mate.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #11 - 03/27/04 at 17:02:38
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Why would you want to play Be3 and then f4??? Isn't just an Austrian Attack then? Why not 4. Bg5(!) Bg7 and now you can play f4. It just seems to me like the d4 square doesn't need reinforcement and so White should prefer to have his bishop outside the pawn chain.
  
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #10 - 03/27/04 at 16:59:07
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After 8.Nf3, (1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 g6 4.Be3 c6 5.h3 Nbd7 6.f4 b5 7.Bd3 e5 8.Nf3) perhaps Black can play actively with 8...b4!? 9.Ne2 exd4 maybe followed by ...c5.  What do you think?
  
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MNb
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #9 - 03/27/04 at 15:14:49
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Sorry, I meant 7...e5 in stead of 7...Bb7.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
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MNb
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #8 - 03/27/04 at 15:13:21
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Has Black any other options except Bg7 after 4.Be3 c6 5.h3 Nbd7 6.f4 b5 7.Bd3 Bb7 8.Nf3!?
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #7 - 03/26/04 at 21:09:25
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I believe in the 1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 g6 4.Be3 c6 5.h3 variation, that 5...Nbd7 is more accurate than 5...Bg7.  Gallagher then gives 6.f4 b5 7.Bd3 e5 8.Qf3 Bb7 as best for Black.  White still may be a little better but it still seems quite complicated.  I haven't actually looked to see how well Black has done from this position.
  
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MNb
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #6 - 03/26/04 at 18:50:28
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The most agressive way to meet the Pirc is in my opinion 4.Be3 indeed:
A)4.Be3 Bg7 5.Qd2 o-o 6.o-o-o and 7.f3 followed by Bh6 and h2-h4-h5.
B)4.Be3 Bg7 5.Qd2 c6 6.Bh6 Bxh6 7.Qxh6 e5 (b5 8.e5!) 8.o-o-o Qe7 9.f3 Gonzalez De Lena Alvarez-Garcia Gonzalez, Asturias 2001.
C)the knight sally Ng4 is considered dubious these days.
D)4.Be3 c6 5.h3 Bg7 6.f4 and in the Austrian Attack the move h3 is probably more useful than c6.

Line B is critical. More popular, maybe better and anyhow more solid is 6.Nf3 and Black can prevent White's attacking plans with Qa5 7.h3 Nbd7 8.Bd3 o-o 9.o-o e5. White might have an edge here.
In general I agree with Wonderer.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
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Wonderer
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #5 - 03/26/04 at 04:26:13
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If you're sure your future opponent only has Pirc Alert, then I think you'll be quite OK from the opening whatever line you choose, as that book is probably the most over rated opening book I've ever read.

Lots of longwinded explanations of simple strategy plus a few 'theoretical novelties' (many of which had already been tried several years before the book, according to my database) while forgetting to give a proper round up of the existing theory...

Nunn is still the best source on the Pirc/Umfimtsev or Norwood's book Winning with the Modern (which transposes to Pirc positions at several points).

Either go for the Long Bow with Be3 and Qd2 which is both dangerous and easy to play for white, or if you know the Closed Sicilian with white, just play 2.Nc3, g3, d3 Bg2, Be3 Qd2/Qc1 etc and you are very likely to get the same kind of h-file attack without black counterplay against d4...
  
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KingDan
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #4 - 03/25/04 at 20:05:22
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I think i would be more likely to play be3 then g3.... just not my style
e4 d6 d4 nf6 nc3 g6 be3 c6 qd2 b5 bd3 e5! is a move...
but dxe5 dxe5 nf3 nbd7 a4 b4 maybe I can be satified with my positional advantage.

Pretty soon an important tournament is coming up and i am going to play a pirc player. It's 50/50 whether or not I get white so I want to be ready. Does anyone know of a line in pirc alert which is dated or refuted to allow a white advantage?
  
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #3 - 03/25/04 at 18:30:52
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I would say this is a more positional but passive treatment of the Pirc. Despite what the books say, I've always hated this opening and it always seemed to me like Pirc players were players who loved to be aggressive and fianchetto their king's bishop, but didn't have the guts for the Dragon (yes, I do think I am more "macho" then all you pirc players out there!!). Anyway, I feel that 4. Be3 is a very good, flexible that has both positional and aggressive purposes. 4...Bg7? 5. Qd2 and I would say that White has quite an advantage while 4...c6! 5. Qd2 b5 6. Bd3 followed by Nf3, h3, and O-O is very nice and plans to strike on the queenside with a later a4. More aggressive is 4. Bg5 which I think is very strong and probably the closest thing to a refutation that is out there.
  
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MNb
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #2 - 03/25/04 at 18:19:33
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According to Nunn's book Black has basically four options:
A) a setup with c7-c5. White can transpose to the Sicilian Dragon or the Benoni. In both the king's fianchetto is considered being harmless.
B) a setup with Nc6, e5 and exd4 when positions remind of a Philidor Variation: 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 exd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 g6 when again 6.g3 is not the most aggressive move.
C) a setup with c6, a5 and Na6. This is not bad according to Nunn.
D) a setup with Nbd7 and e5 which Nunn advises to avoid, except 4.Nge2 Bg7 5.g3 o-o 6.Bg2 e5 7.h3 Nbd7 8.o-o c6 9.a4 b6.

If White plays 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.g3 o-o 6.Bg2 then Black has the additional possibility of Bg4.
I would say it is mainly a matter of taste.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
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KingDan
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Re: Pirc Question
Reply #1 - 03/25/04 at 17:21:50
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btw, 4 g3 info is also appreciated.
  
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