Latest Updates:
Normal Topic what about 9.0-0-0 Rb8!? (Read 3890 times)
Da Costa Junior
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline



Posts: 42
Location: Campinas
Joined: 03/04/04
Gender: Male
Re:  what about 9.0-0-0 Rb8!?
Reply #4 - 05/07/04 at 15:37:45
Post Tools
Yes, 10...Bd7 11.Bb3 Na5 is the best continuation to transpose to Chinese Dragon.

I just mention why ...Ne5 is not good for black.

Thanks.
  
Back to top
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Oldschool
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


Stefan Sievers (FM)

Posts: 29
Location: Hamburg
Joined: 05/04/04
Gender: Male
Re:  what about 9.0-0-0 Rb8!?
Reply #3 - 05/07/04 at 13:51:53
Post Tools
This is one of the stranged topics I have read for quite a while. I don´t know why but I just can´t resist to give my 2 cents:

a) @teyko: pls refrain from suggesting moves without explaining the ideas behind them. In that case we not only have to answer the question but also to figure out what crazy ideas you might have in mind. That is because your mind remains a complete mystery to us in view of some of your comments!

b) @the other posters: Dismissing moves without even trying to figure out what´s behind them is not called for either. In that case the saying "silence is golden" seems to be applicable since otherwise your are in danger of publishing complete nonsense.

c) The idea of 9...Rb8 is probably deeply hidden within Teyko´s mind, but let my try to perform a telepathic brain scan. This should be a tutorial for others on how to analyze with your own mental skills instead of mindlessly hitting the "analysis button" on your favourite chess program:

Apparantly Teyko thinks the rook is better placed on b8 than on a8. That is because of the use of the b-file once it opens. 9...Rb8 may also help preparing b5. On the other hand it may cost a valuable tempo.  But is there another idea? What was the threat after Black´s 8th move? Black wanted to free himself by 9...d5. All White 9th moves are directed against d5 (with 9.0-0-0 being a very special case) , which would give Black the better game after 9.h4? So the question to answer is, did Black prepare d6-d5 with 9...Rb8. Let us figure it out:

10.h4 d5! 11.h5! (11.exd5 or 11.Nxc6 are useless with the Black rook well positioned on b8) We have reached by transposition the line 9.0-0-0 d5 10.h4?! where Black has an esay game after 10...dxe4 11.h5 Nxd4 12.Bxd4 e5! However, if after 9.0-0-0 d5 10.h4 Rb8 is a good move is not so clear. Maybe it´s playable. After the logical 11.h5 Black has probably to play 11...e5 12.Nxc6 bxc6 13.hxg6 poses some problems fot Black 13...fxg6 (13...d4 14.Bh6) 14.exd5 cxd5 (14...Qa5 15.Bc4!) 15.Sxd5 Le6 16.Lc4 Sxd5 17.Lxd5 Lxd5 18.Dxd5+ Dxd5 19.Txd5 e4 20.b3 seems eventually insufficient for Black.

Also on 10.h4 as well as 10.g4 Black can try to transpose to 9.0-0-0 Nxd4 lines. i.e 10.h4 Nxd4 11.Bxd4 Be6 12.Kb1 Qc7 when the black rook often goes to b8 as well but 13.Nd5 seems better for white both with 10.h4 as well as with 10.g4 since i that lines Black plays Qc7 and Rc8 instead of Rb8

Finally 10.Bc4 transposes to what is here called the Chinese Dragon. Let me say that 10.Bc4 doesn´t seem to be the most logical move here if Black just prepared b7-b5. After 10...Bd7 11.Bb3 Na5 is currently regarded as the best move so Da cots junior´s comment is rather obsolete.

I suggest that Teyko plays 9...Rb8 and shares his experience with us shortly.

Now I feel to have fulfilled my "due" and prefer to meet my girlfiend rather than looking at other obsure suggestions.  Grin

Have a nice day!

Stefan

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Da Costa Junior
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline



Posts: 42
Location: Campinas
Joined: 03/04/04
Gender: Male
Re:  what about 9.0-0-0 Rb8!?
Reply #2 - 04/28/04 at 09:51:27
Post Tools
In Chinese Dragon it's better
12.f4 Neg4 13.h3 Nxe3 14.Qxe3 with better position for white side see M. Russell - Kafka, Goa 2002.

I think 10.h4!? or 10.g4!? are better for white side.

  
Back to top
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Glenn Snow
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1720
Location: Franklin
Joined: 09/27/03
Gender: Male
Re:  what about 9.0-0-0 Rb8!?
Reply #1 - 04/27/04 at 21:46:57
Post Tools
Since White played an early Bc4 the game transposed into the so called Chinese Variation.  I'm not sure what point ...Rb8 would have without the Bc4 inserted.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Teyko
Full Member
***
Offline


Gambits Dammit

Posts: 247
Location: Scotland
Joined: 10/01/03
Gender: Male
what about 9.0-0-0 Rb8!?
04/27/04 at 20:28:06
Post Tools
I was wondering what is wrong with responding to 9.0-0-0 with Rb8. It would be preparing the attack on the king and remedy the issue with 10.Kb1.

I am just thinking and have only found one game from 1980.

[Event "JUG-ch M corr"]
[Site ""]
[Date "1980.??.??"]
[Round "0"]
[White "Nadenic,Josip"]
[Black "Matkovic,J"]
[Result "0-1"]
[Eco "B76"]
1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 g6 6.Be3 Bg7 7.f3 0-0 8.Qd2 Nc6
9.0-0-0 Rb8 10.Bc4 Ne5 11.Bb3 Bd7 12.h4 b5 13.h5 Nc4 14.Bxc4 bxc4 15.Nd5 Nxd5 16.exd5 Qb6
17.c3 Qa5 18.Kb1 Bxd4 19.Qxd4 Bf5+ 20.Ka1 Rb5 21.a3 Rfb8 22.Qxa7 Qxa7 23.Bxa7 R8b7 24.g4 Bd3
25.Bd4 Rxb2 26.hxg6 fxg6 27.Rde1 R2b3 0-1

Any thoughts?
  
Back to top
IP Logged
 
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo