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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Open Ruy Lopez (Read 199917 times)
dfan
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #121 - 02/28/13 at 13:50:14
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Schaakhamster wrote on 02/28/13 at 12:16:33:
The problem is that the Dilworth can be "avoided" on the way to the main tabiya which would mean including either another mainline reply or playing that worse endgame after 9. Nbd2 Bc5

He already gets all the way up to 9.c3 Bc5 10.Nbd2 O-O 11.Bc2, where 11...Nxf2 would be the Dilworth, so he's already dealt with all the lines that would avoid it anyway.
  
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MartinC
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #120 - 02/28/13 at 13:07:28
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I think the repitoire books thing is down to what sells.

There are actually quite a few basically complete surveys getting written but many of them - Scherbakov's noteboom book say - are getting presented as repitoire books.

That's probably down to managing expectations. A repitoire book can safely cut out entire lines when they're not really theoretically relevant. A 'complete' book? You'd get endless, violent, complaints..... Never mind that it'd probably be more useful Smiley

On another note, excellent that they no doubt are, surely the impact of the GM repitoire books on specifically GM level chess is inherently limited?

Ideas of course but the detail is such an obvious, public, target.... Once you get a level of two below that and the amount of time for prep decreases its another matter.
  
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Schaakhamster
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #119 - 02/28/13 at 12:21:47
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Igor wrote on 02/28/13 at 08:46:22:
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I see no reason why chess book publishers should not have views and express them about reviews (both those with names affixed and those hiding behind aliases). I am surprised that this offends.


In fact on their blog there is an article every week starting with: "Usually we don't talk about other publishers / reviewers...  BUT..."  Grin


I giggled when he wrote something along the lines of my book got 6/6 but Avrukh's only got 5/6 and it's better then my book. Some real passive aggressiveness going on there.
  
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Schaakhamster
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #118 - 02/28/13 at 12:16:33
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Bibs wrote on 02/28/13 at 08:11:27:
Schaakhamster wrote on 02/28/13 at 08:04:44:
I'm not offended, just seems time consuming which could be spend on producing more books  Grin


True, true! Am surprised the amount of time on that blog responding to the likes of 'Gilchrist is a legend' about precisely when the postman is coming.
Would probably help them if folk stopped pestering and just let 'em get on with it.

I was disappointed that the Dilworth wasn't included. Their right of course, I just wanted to learn about it, a line that has intrigued me. Ah well.


The problem is that the Dilworth can be "avoided" on the way to the main tabiya which would mean including either another mainline reply or playing that worse endgame after 9. Nbd2 Bc5
  
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #117 - 02/28/13 at 08:46:22
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Quote:
I see no reason why chess book publishers should not have views and express them about reviews (both those with names affixed and those hiding behind aliases). I am surprised that this offends.


In fact on their blog there is an article every week starting with: "Usually we don't talk about other publishers / reviewers...  BUT..."  Grin
  
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Bibs
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #116 - 02/28/13 at 08:11:27
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Schaakhamster wrote on 02/28/13 at 08:04:44:
Bibs wrote on 02/28/13 at 04:34:31:
Schaakhamster wrote on 02/27/13 at 20:23:58:
just an innocent question: is rebuking criticism on quality chess books in your job description? I have seen you having a go at several reviews on the Quality Chess blog. Doesn't seem a very efficient use of time. You can't please everyone.


I see no reason why chess book publishers should not have views and express them about reviews (both those with names affixed and those hiding behind aliases). I am surprised that this offends.
Disagreeing is not "rebuking".
Somebody here erroneously suggested that GMs take no note of QC texts. Aagaard disagreed and provided multiple examples. Aside from those stated I know of another top 10 player who is familiar with QC work from a personal conversation.
Readers here have views, writers have views, publishers have views. All express politely, respectfully and all is well.

(And no, I have nothing to do with QC at all. I last went to Scotland 28 years ago. It rained every day.)


I'm not offended, just seems time consuming which could be spend on producing more books  Grin


True, true! Am surprised the amount of time on that blog responding to the likes of 'Gilchrist is a legend' about precisely when the postman is coming.
Would probably help them if folk stopped pestering and just let 'em get on with it.

I was disappointed that the Dilworth wasn't included. Their right of course, I just wanted to learn about it, a line that has intrigued me. Ah well.
  
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Schaakhamster
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #115 - 02/28/13 at 08:04:44
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Bibs wrote on 02/28/13 at 04:34:31:
Schaakhamster wrote on 02/27/13 at 20:23:58:
just an innocent question: is rebuking criticism on quality chess books in your job description? I have seen you having a go at several reviews on the Quality Chess blog. Doesn't seem a very efficient use of time. You can't please everyone.


I see no reason why chess book publishers should not have views and express them about reviews (both those with names affixed and those hiding behind aliases). I am surprised that this offends.
Disagreeing is not "rebuking".
Somebody here erroneously suggested that GMs take no note of QC texts. Aagaard disagreed and provided multiple examples. Aside from those stated I know of another top 10 player who is familiar with QC work from a personal conversation.
Readers here have views, writers have views, publishers have views. All express politely, respectfully and all is well.

(And no, I have nothing to do with QC at all. I last went to Scotland 28 years ago. It rained every day.)


I'm not offended, just seems time consuming which could be spend on producing more books  Grin
  
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Bibs
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #114 - 02/28/13 at 04:34:31
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Schaakhamster wrote on 02/27/13 at 20:23:58:
Jacob Aagaard wrote on 02/27/13 at 10:54:09:
barnaby wrote on 02/27/13 at 02:01:01:
[quote author=5052555A340 link=1084036321/105#105 date=1361928483][quote author=7E7069797A707D7279696E1C0 link=1084036321/103#103 date=1361924779]

last thing, it is called a gm repertoire but the majority of people buying it will be well below that level ... keep it real, will ya?

gms these days aint waiting for books and then playing those repertoires at high levels

please ... the title is to make people that are club to tournament players feel better that they are playing lines the big boys and girls play


It is rather ludicrous to think that grandmasters are not heavily influenced by the Grandmaster Repertoire series. Gelfand took up 6…Nbd7 in the Najdorf because of Ftacniks’ book, probably more than hundred GMs have taken on Avrukh’s lines from GM1&2, with Yusupov coining the term: “I Avrukhed my opponent”. Ponomariov – Wang Yue in the Slav is a common example of how this happens. Ponomariov won two pawns, but sadly messed up in the technical phase.
Kramnik has openly expressed being inspired by Marin’s books, McShane played Marin’s repertoire for about a year, winning among others against Magnus Carlsen. Anand used one of the lines in his match with Topalov, but gave it his own twist, after Peter Heine Nielsen got infatuated with the books. Delchev used a novelty from Nikos and my book on the Tarrasch against Bacrot.
I really could go on, but I think I have made my main point. Obviously there is a caveat: Although books by Marin and Avrukh on main lines will influence grandmaster practice more than a book on the Open Spanish, Modern Benoni or Tarrasch, it is clear that these books are interesting to grandmasters of the highest level.


just an innocent question: is rebuking criticism on quality chess books in your job description? I have seen you having a go at several reviews on the Quality Chess blog. Doesn't seem a very efficient use of time. You can't please everyone.


I see no reason why chess book publishers should not have views and express them about reviews (both those with names affixed and those hiding behind aliases). I am surprised that this offends.
Disagreeing is not "rebuking".
Somebody here erroneously suggested that GMs take no note of QC texts. Aagaard disagreed and provided multiple examples. Aside from those stated I know of another top 10 player who is familiar with QC work from a personal conversation.
Readers here have views, writers have views, publishers have views. All express politely, respectfully and all is well.

(And no, I have nothing to do with QC at all. I last went to Scotland 28 years ago. It rained every day.)
  
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #113 - 02/27/13 at 22:08:48
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My impression is that The Open Spanish isn't as good as its sister GMxx books. Maybe it's because of limitations in the opening itself. Anyway, the author states it avoids the Spanish torture but most mainlines are just equal or worse endings as far as I understand browsing through. Ok, it is life of chess, but I simply hoped for more... I haven't played or analyzed anything really in the OS for a long time so I was just happy to have something to read.
  
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Schaakhamster
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #112 - 02/27/13 at 20:23:58
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Jacob Aagaard wrote on 02/27/13 at 10:54:09:
barnaby wrote on 02/27/13 at 02:01:01:
[quote author=5052555A340 link=1084036321/105#105 date=1361928483][quote author=7E7069797A707D7279696E1C0 link=1084036321/103#103 date=1361924779]

last thing, it is called a gm repertoire but the majority of people buying it will be well below that level ... keep it real, will ya?

gms these days aint waiting for books and then playing those repertoires at high levels

please ... the title is to make people that are club to tournament players feel better that they are playing lines the big boys and girls play


It is rather ludicrous to think that grandmasters are not heavily influenced by the Grandmaster Repertoire series. Gelfand took up 6…Nbd7 in the Najdorf because of Ftacniks’ book, probably more than hundred GMs have taken on Avrukh’s lines from GM1&2, with Yusupov coining the term: “I Avrukhed my opponent”. Ponomariov – Wang Yue in the Slav is a common example of how this happens. Ponomariov won two pawns, but sadly messed up in the technical phase.
Kramnik has openly expressed being inspired by Marin’s books, McShane played Marin’s repertoire for about a year, winning among others against Magnus Carlsen. Anand used one of the lines in his match with Topalov, but gave it his own twist, after Peter Heine Nielsen got infatuated with the books. Delchev used a novelty from Nikos and my book on the Tarrasch against Bacrot.
I really could go on, but I think I have made my main point. Obviously there is a caveat: Although books by Marin and Avrukh on main lines will influence grandmaster practice more than a book on the Open Spanish, Modern Benoni or Tarrasch, it is clear that these books are interesting to grandmasters of the highest level.


just an innocent question: is rebuking criticism on quality chess books in your job description? I have seen you having a go at several reviews on the Quality Chess blog. Doesn't seem a very efficient use of time. You can't please everyone.
  
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brabo
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #111 - 02/27/13 at 19:42:18
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Jacob Aagaard wrote on 02/27/13 at 10:54:09:
It is rather ludicrous to think that grandmasters are not heavily influenced by the Grandmaster Repertoire series. Gelfand took up 6…Nbd7 in the Najdorf because of Ftacniks’ book, probably more than hundred GMs have taken on Avrukh’s lines from GM1&2, with Yusupov coining the term: “I Avrukhed my opponent”. Ponomariov – Wang Yue in the Slav is a common example of how this happens. Ponomariov won two pawns, but sadly messed up in the technical phase.
Kramnik has openly expressed being inspired by Marin’s books, McShane played Marin’s repertoire for about a year, winning among others against Magnus Carlsen. Anand used one of the lines in his match with Topalov, but gave it his own twist, after Peter Heine Nielsen got infatuated with the books. Delchev used a novelty from Nikos and my book on the Tarrasch against Bacrot.
I really could go on, but I think I have made my main point. Obviously there is a caveat: Although books by Marin and Avrukh on main lines will influence grandmaster practice more than a book on the Open Spanish, Modern Benoni or Tarrasch, it is clear that these books are interesting to grandmasters of the highest level.

I wonder why today we have all these grandmaster repertoire series while 15 years ago I remember we had mostly openingbooks covering 1 specific opening in detail. Is it because writing a complete book about an opening has become impossible with the growing amount of theory? Is it fashion? Is it because readers are more interested in getting a quick playable repertoire instead of knowing the last detail in a long forgotten sideline?
  
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #110 - 02/27/13 at 14:26:01
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barnaby wrote on 02/27/13 at 02:01:01:
I did not assign it a B- minus for that reason.

I have not actually divulged any reason yet for why i gave it that rating


Then what was the point of posting "B-" in the first place?

barnaby wrote on 02/27/13 at 02:01:01:
was actually going to but now will not


Oh, dear me.  Now I shall never know.

But the Riga is not good chess; there is no need to mention it in a repertoire book for the Black pieces.  As for the Dilworth, it's a repertoire book, you know?  Not a compendium.

They call it a GM repertoire book because it is of sufficient breadth, depth and precision to form the basis of a top-level repertoire in the given opening. 

@Flaneur Bleu: The Dilworth does not lose a piece.  Consult your sources, or see here:

https://ruylopez.chesstheory.org/p.php?z=pt&a=16838&b=0&c=16838&d=0



  

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dfan
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #109 - 02/27/13 at 13:35:42
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barnaby wrote on 02/27/13 at 02:01:01:
dfan wrote on 02/27/13 at 01:28:03:
That said, I don't see the rationale for assigning a repertoire book a B- because it covers different lines from the ones you were hoping for.

I did not assign it a B- minus for that reason.

I have not actually divulged any reason yet for why i gave it that rating,

OK. Your comment consisted of two criticisms and a grade so I assumed they were related.
  
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #108 - 02/27/13 at 10:54:09
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barnaby wrote on 02/27/13 at 02:01:01:
[quote author=5052555A340 link=1084036321/105#105 date=1361928483][quote author=7E7069797A707D7279696E1C0 link=1084036321/103#103 date=1361924779]

last thing, it is called a gm repertoire but the majority of people buying it will be well below that level ... keep it real, will ya?

gms these days aint waiting for books and then playing those repertoires at high levels

please ... the title is to make people that are club to tournament players feel better that they are playing lines the big boys and girls play


It is rather ludicrous to think that grandmasters are not heavily influenced by the Grandmaster Repertoire series. Gelfand took up 6…Nbd7 in the Najdorf because of Ftacniks’ book, probably more than hundred GMs have taken on Avrukh’s lines from GM1&2, with Yusupov coining the term: “I Avrukhed my opponent”. Ponomariov – Wang Yue in the Slav is a common example of how this happens. Ponomariov won two pawns, but sadly messed up in the technical phase.
Kramnik has openly expressed being inspired by Marin’s books, McShane played Marin’s repertoire for about a year, winning among others against Magnus Carlsen. Anand used one of the lines in his match with Topalov, but gave it his own twist, after Peter Heine Nielsen got infatuated with the books. Delchev used a novelty from Nikos and my book on the Tarrasch against Bacrot.
I really could go on, but I think I have made my main point. Obviously there is a caveat: Although books by Marin and Avrukh on main lines will influence grandmaster practice more than a book on the Open Spanish, Modern Benoni or Tarrasch, it is clear that these books are interesting to grandmasters of the highest level.
  
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Re: Open Ruy Lopez
Reply #107 - 02/27/13 at 02:01:01
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dfan wrote on 02/27/13 at 01:28:03:
Blue Flaneur wrote on 02/27/13 at 00:26:19:
I'm pretty sure the Dilworth loses a piece. I don't why it would be included in a repertoire made for GMs.

Well, the GM who wrote the book has played it 7 out of 8 times he has reached that position.

That said, I don't see the rationale for assigning a repertoire book a B- because it covers different lines from the ones you were hoping for.



I did not assign it a B- minus for that reason.

I have not actually divulged any reason yet for why i gave it that rating, was actually going to but now will not since you people so hyper sensitive about banal stuff.

sheesh


last thing, it is called a gm repertoire but the majority of people buying it will be well below that level ... keep it real, will ya?

gms these days aint waiting for books and then playing those repertoires at high levels

please ... the title is to make people that are club to tournament players feel better that they are playing lines the big boys and girls play
  
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