Latest Updates:
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3 4
Topic Tools
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) C42 C43 1.e4e5 2.Nf3Nf6 what else does black need? (Read 27885 times)
Fernando Semprun
Senior Member
****
Offline


Be nice to others. Life
is to be enjoyed!

Posts: 402
Location: Madrid
Joined: 04/29/03
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #54 - 09/14/05 at 07:14:56
Post Tools
Ivanchuk has used the Bishop Gambit previously, game featured in Mc Donald's book.

Bad spelling is a terrible disease, Top (desease? hmm, at least it is close to decease....), specially among native speakers....

Hi daniel, will reply to your e-mail shortly! (nice chap this daniel...)
  

Fernando Semprun
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
X
God Member
*****
Offline


Education is a system
of imposed ignorance.Chomsky

Posts: 571
Joined: 10/04/03
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #53 - 09/13/05 at 23:57:34
Post Tools
Yeah, that suggests a reply to such a taunt:  "Maybe you should pick up go.  I hear it's against the rules to push pieces."   Cheesy
  

Power to the People!&&http://www.gravel2008.us/           http://www.nationalinitiative.us/&&Mike Gravel for President 2008
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Online


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10758
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #52 - 09/13/05 at 21:12:21
Post Tools
Probably that you rather should try go, bridge or checkers instead.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
X
God Member
*****
Offline


Education is a system
of imposed ignorance.Chomsky

Posts: 571
Joined: 10/04/03
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #51 - 09/13/05 at 20:05:35
Post Tools
I never quite understood that taunt (and its variations).  What does that say when you have lost to someone who "can't play chess?"
  

Power to the People!&&http://www.gravel2008.us/           http://www.nationalinitiative.us/&&Mike Gravel for President 2008
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Smyslov_Fan
YaBB Moderator
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #50 - 09/13/05 at 08:57:03
Post Tools
I was once berated by an International Master after I beat him.  He shouted,   

"That wasn't chess!  You don't know how to play chess!  I thought you were a chess player, but you just push pieces!"

To be fair, I was White, and by move seven or so, I was already struggling for equality in one of his pet lines.  He pushed too hard and lost in an endgame.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
micawber
God Member
*****
Offline


like many sneaks and skunks
in history he's a poet

Posts: 852
Location: Netherlands
Joined: 09/07/05
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #49 - 09/13/05 at 01:03:46
Post Tools
That reminds me of someone who, (after having lost) rather angrily told me:
"If you hadnt played such a bad opening I never would have lost from you !" Smiley
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Smyslov_Fan
YaBB Moderator
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #48 - 09/12/05 at 03:03:46
Post Tools
Fun is in the eye of the beholder.  Sometimes, watching your opponent grimace in dread at being bored to death at the board is tremendous fun!

Having said that, Black had better at least draw the game, or you've got some explaining to do as to why you chose that opening!  If Black wins (which is entirely possible), then White can't complain one bit about Black's opening.  Ok, he can complain, but it will ring a bit hollow.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
micawber
God Member
*****
Offline


like many sneaks and skunks
in history he's a poet

Posts: 852
Location: Netherlands
Joined: 09/07/05
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #47 - 09/10/05 at 08:01:34
Post Tools
Hey,
I agree that the petroff is posible blacks most reliable choice
against e4 e5 Nf3. But hey, what about having a lot of fun.
Youre missing out on all the gambits and sharp unclear lines you can play as black after 1.e4,e5 2.Nf3,Nc6  Cheesy
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Daniel_Boix
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


I love ChessPublishing.com!

Posts: 20
Location: Barcelona
Joined: 09/10/05
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #46 - 09/10/05 at 06:19:25
Post Tools
Hi all!

Yes ... anything else borring than 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 or playing the caro-kann!!  zzzzz

I think cofee sellers will be very happy!!!!

that'a a joke!  Roll Eyes

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Michael Ayton
God Member
*****
Offline


‘You’re never alone with
a doppelgänger.’

Posts: 1947
Location: durham
Joined: 04/19/03
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #45 - 07/01/04 at 03:19:16
Post Tools
Very interesting post, TopNotch, but could I suggest it be copied to (and subsequent posts be placed under) the specific Philidor Defence thread, which I started yesterday?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TopNotch
God Member
*****
Offline


I only look 1 move ahead,
but its always the best

Posts: 2211
Joined: 01/04/03
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #44 - 06/30/04 at 20:01:00
Post Tools
I'm afraid that the much maligned Philidor defence while perhaps not as bad as theory suggests, is certainly not a comfortable opening for Black.  Grin

The Phil can be broken down into four main branches for black:

A.)-> Mestel's Variation: 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 f5?! Over the years this line has been sporadically rehabilitated  as a surprise weapon by enterprising players. Nevertheless the current thinking is that this line is all but busted beyond repair. For more details just beg  Smiley

B.)-> Larsen's Variation (Resembles the Dragon, but minus the fire! Wink:  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 ed4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.Nc3 Bg7 6.Be3 GM Tony Kosten in his book on the Philidor writes " It is not clear that, with accurate play, White can demonstrate any real advantage. Conversely, the slightest mistake on his part can lead to immediate, catastrophic consequences". LOL!! .....Maybe this might have been true in the pre Database age, but those days are long gone and in fact if white does play accurately Black is in dire straits. Compared to the Dragon, the half open e file in Larsen's line does not offer sufficient counterplay against white's 0-0-0 position. Please do not bother posting a response claiming that some combination of .....Nxd4, followed by....c5, Qa5, a6, b5 and Be6 offers black adequate counter chances. IT DOES NOT!!

C.)-> Antoshin's Variation:  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 ed4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 Be7 A much underrated system recently championed by the French phenom, GM Etienne Bacrot, however I expect this line to soon drop back out of fashion. The critical line still begins 6.Bf4!, and up untill recently was thought to lead to a clear advantage for White. However the discovery of a surprising Rook sac for Black by GM D Nisipeanu has obscured the issue somewhat. Nevertheless with precise play White can still claim some advantage. Another promising path for White is 6.Nde2!? with the idea of g3 and Bg2 squashing any future central counterplay by Black. This line was recently used by GM Grischuk to defeat Bacrot.

D.)-> Hanham Variation: 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 Nf6?! 4.Nc3?! Nd7 This is the starting position for the Hanham, and I think its Black's most reliable choice if he must play the Philidor. Please note however, that the move order given is not an optimum one since white can opt for 4.de5! Ne4 5.Qd5 which is known to lead to a slight but persistent endgame advantage for white. In light of this most Hanham Variation practitioners try other move orders in an attempt to reach their position, such as: 1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 Nbd7 4.Nf3 e5 or 1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 e5 It should be noted that both these alternative move orders have their pros and cons, and even if Black reaches his desired Hanham all is not roses, provided White knows his stuff. 

To sum up I don't think that the Philidor is good enough to have as your main defence to 1.e4, but as a surprise weapon it has its uses. I have seen even good White players go under quickly to an aggressive setup sometimes employed by Black in the Hanham line that goes something like this: Defer castling and go h6, Nbd7 to f8, g5, Ng6, Rg8, Nf4 with quite a powerful kingside attack - This particular setup is quite dangerous for White if one does not know how to counter it effectively.  

Theory does not consider either The Petroff or Philidor defence very ambitious or combative for black, so I remain puzzled by Ambitious Amateur's continued attraction to these lines. Considering AA's defensive tastes the handle 'Unambitious Amateur' seems much more appropriate.  Wink 

Till next time, peace n luv.

Top  Grin


           
  

The man who tries to do something and fails is infinitely better than he who tries to do nothing and succeeds - Lloyd Jones Smiley
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Michael Ayton
God Member
*****
Offline


‘You’re never alone with
a doppelgänger.’

Posts: 1947
Location: durham
Joined: 04/19/03
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #43 - 06/30/04 at 12:30:04
Post Tools
Thanks for the suggestions, A.A.!

I agree that this opening should be discussed in a separate thread (that's only logical), so I'm starting one. It's always preferable, in my view, that someone critical of an opening setup should be prepared to back their opinion up with reasons/analysis, so I for one am looking forward to further post(s) from MNb.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Online


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10758
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #42 - 06/30/04 at 09:19:39
Post Tools
I agree and I will explain why in a separate thread. This thread is about the merits of the Petrov.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
AmateurDragoneer
Senior Member
****
Offline



Posts: 387
Location: NY
Joined: 06/17/03
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #41 - 06/30/04 at 06:45:54
Post Tools
Oh, please no!! I can't believe we're discussing the merits of that opening, because they are few.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Online


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10758
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 ...e5!? 2.Nf3 Nf6! what else does black n
Reply #40 - 06/30/04 at 05:17:15
Post Tools
Wouldn't it be better to start a separate Philidor thread?
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3 4
Topic Tools
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo