Latest Updates:
Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls (Read 5808 times)
de Jongh
Guest


Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #12 - 09/01/05 at 19:49:08
Post Tools
Youre right of course. But Kramnik wasnt able to get much out of the Anti-Marshall against Peter Leko in their 'world-championship'-match. In fact Peter scored a good win in the real Marhall.
A very rich source of the real Marshall is Tim Hardings CD.
Although 1.5 years older than Lalic's book the analysis and coverage of lines are way superior.
Unfortunately it doesn't cover the Anti-Marshall.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Smyslov_Fan
God Member
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #11 - 09/01/05 at 07:47:52
Post Tools
de Jongh,

Thanks for the warning!

BTW, the 7.h3 8.d3 has been given the Kasparov stamp of approval so it is probably at least worth a lot of study!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
de Jongh
Guest


Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #10 - 08/29/05 at 15:35:31
Post Tools
By the way, I wouldn't trust Lalic book too much. Read the review of Curt Hansen in CheckPoint Jan.2004 at www.chesscafe.com: It's rather devastating:
"It's a book that can best be described as inadequate". Smiley
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
tafl
Senior Member
****
Offline



Posts: 380
Location: Norway
Joined: 05/27/05
Gender: Male
Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #9 - 08/17/05 at 01:22:49
Post Tools
Thank you guys!

These are very interesting developments. I need to have a closer book and buy a book or two, but I now have a starting point for further investigations.
  

A computer once beat me at chess but it was no match for me at kick boxing - Emo Philips
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
CheckMate
Guest


Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #8 - 08/16/05 at 10:06:15
Post Tools
7. -0-0 8. h3 Bb7! 9. d3 d6 10. a3 is very, very trendy and the most common
anti-marshall as of today. Good books on this line is "The Marshall Attack" by Bogdan Lalic and "White Opening According to Anand, volume 2" by Alexander Khalifman. Both these books treat this line in great depth.

By the way it's bad to offer the gambit by 8. -d5 in this line because white's knight comes quickly to c3.

However I don't beleive this line offers more chances to black than the main line closed, so your move order makes very much sense anyway! White's play is rather slow and requires a great  deal of patience and positional sense.

CheckMate

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Willempie
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing
.com!

Posts: 4312
Location: Holland
Joined: 01/07/05
Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #7 - 08/16/05 at 09:18:48
Post Tools
7.. 0-0 8. h3 Bb7 is indeed one you need to know about as white. I think it is not better than say the Zaitsev. It is not necessarily worse, but it is not a showstopper for me as white.
  

If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bob000
Guest


Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #6 - 08/16/05 at 08:57:15
Post Tools
Don't get too optimistic. 7.. 0-0 8. h3 Bb7 and 9.c3 is now unplayable for white because ...d5! Not a Marshall, something even better for black. h3 commits White to some anti Marshall system.

Is 8...Bg4 really all that good of a response to 8.a4? I was under the impression that the pin is a mistake until white commits to d4 and experience has born proved this to be true. I think the answers here are  Bb7, though black has to be careful not to get move ordered into a bad version of a mainline and b4, which transposes into a sideline usually reached via a later a4.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Willempie
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing
.com!

Posts: 4312
Location: Holland
Joined: 01/07/05
Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #5 - 08/16/05 at 08:55:32
Post Tools
There are one or two variations white has to know, but they are not better than the closed for black.

Be warned about the book though, in the introduction he apologises that the book is physically heavy (unlike part 1) Wink
  

If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
tafl
Senior Member
****
Offline



Posts: 380
Location: Norway
Joined: 05/27/05
Gender: Male
Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #4 - 08/16/05 at 08:34:18
Post Tools
Quote:
After having gone through Khalifman's book, I dont see anything where you can benefit from the 7.. 0-0 8 h3 move order.


Interesting - does that mean White can avoid the Marshall at no cost?

In that case maybe I should consider taking up the Ruy Lopez mainline for White too.

Anyway - it seems I have to get that book!
  

A computer once beat me at chess but it was no match for me at kick boxing - Emo Philips
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
tafl
Senior Member
****
Offline



Posts: 380
Location: Norway
Joined: 05/27/05
Gender: Male
Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #3 - 08/16/05 at 08:30:59
Post Tools
Quote:
I am not a specialist in these lines, but I recall having read recently that 8...Bg4 is considered a fully adequate answer to 7...d6 8. a4 while, of course, 8...Bg4 is unavailable after 7...0-0  8. a4.


Hmm... that rings a bell - maybe I knew that 25 years ago after all?  Embarrassed
  

A computer once beat me at chess but it was no match for me at kick boxing - Emo Philips
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Willempie
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing
.com!

Posts: 4312
Location: Holland
Joined: 01/07/05
Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #2 - 08/16/05 at 08:21:47
Post Tools
After having gone through Khalifman's book, I dont see anything where you can benefit from the 7.. 0-0 8 h3 move order.
  

If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Markovich
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 6099
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Joined: 09/17/04
Re: Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
Reply #1 - 08/16/05 at 08:11:21
Post Tools
Quote:
I consider taking up the Closed Ruy Lopez again. I am not likely to start playing the Marshall Gambit but consider to adopt the Marshall move-order 7...0-0 in order to induce some anti-Marshall lines (as I did 25 years ago) rather than going straight for the normal Closed with 7...d6. I must admit that I never had any deep insight into this, and never reflected over the difference between e.g. 7...0-0 8.a4 (fairly common) and 7...d6 a4 (very rare).  Embarrassed Could somebody enlighten me, please?

In addition I have a couple of related questions:
- I believe 7...0-0 8.a4 is now considered the only anti-Marshall line of any theoretical significance (please inform me if this is not so). Is there now any consensus to what is the mainline and the theoretical verdict? A reference to a model game (with Kasparov as White maybe?) would be nice.
- Is there any way Black can take advantage of the 7...0-0 8.h3 move-order?


I am not a specialist in these lines, but I recall having read recently that 8...Bg4 is considered a fully adequate answer to 7...d6 8. a4 while, of course, 8...Bg4 is unavailable after 7...0-0  8. a4.
  

The Great Oz has spoken!
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
tafl
Senior Member
****
Offline



Posts: 380
Location: Norway
Joined: 05/27/05
Gender: Male
Marshall Feint and the Anti Marshalls
08/16/05 at 07:49:31
Post Tools
I consider taking up the Closed Ruy Lopez again. I am not likely to start playing the Marshall Gambit but consider to adopt the Marshall move-order 7...0-0 in order to induce some anti-Marshall lines (as I did 25 years ago) rather than going straight for the normal Closed with 7...d6. I must admit that I never had any deep insight into this, and never reflected over the difference between e.g. 7...0-0 8.a4 (fairly common) and 7...d6 a4 (very rare).  Embarrassed Could somebody enlighten me, please?

In addition I have a couple of related questions:
- I believe 7...0-0 8.a4 is now considered the only anti-Marshall line of any theoretical significance (please inform me if this is not so). Is there now any consensus to what is the mainline and the theoretical verdict? A reference to a model game (with Kasparov as White maybe?) would be nice.
- Is there any way Black can take advantage of the 7...0-0 8.h3 move-order?
  

A computer once beat me at chess but it was no match for me at kick boxing - Emo Philips
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo