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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) C02: Milner-Barry Gambit (Read 37181 times)
bragesjo
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #36 - 02/25/24 at 17:52:16
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I am no expert on the line but I created a acount at Chessable and bought The GothamChess 1. e4 Repertoire some dags ago. Engines today are much different they see long term compensation much better than only 4 years ago. They also se longer before horizon effekt. I can not give an entire chapter but many lines are covered. I dont think white is better evolution is 0.00 when black has an extra pawn. The Bc5 line is met by Nxd4 Bxd4 Qh5 quiting some players games. I have not computer checked the entire analys but to my human eye whites play look more simple but computers says 0.00. I also think books get outdated much faster today. At any rated the original idea with Nc3 is evaluated as much better for black.
« Last Edit: 02/26/24 at 09:00:30 by bragesjo »  
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kylemeister
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #35 - 02/25/24 at 15:30:03
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I notice that after 9. Nbd2 Bc5 (back in '92 Psakhis called 9...Nc6 "the simplest"), 10. b4 was called "perhaps the most critical line" in the June 2019 update.
  
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Bibs
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #34 - 02/25/24 at 13:40:50
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Bragesjo,

You might look at the game Smerdon v Sadler. Some years ago, but iirc that ...b6 kinda busted the line.

Looked it up, and was discussed here prior:
https://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/chess/YaBB.pl?num=1403291137/12

Game link: https://old.chesstempo.com/gamedb/game/3590261

Have newer and more powerful engines found anything here to resurrect white...?
  
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bragesjo
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #33 - 02/25/24 at 10:21:18
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Sorry to resurect an old thread but by accident I came a cross something called Smerdon variation in Millner-Barry. After cxd4 cxd4 Bd7 00 Nxd4 white plays Nbd2 and computers think full compensation here as well.

At any rate I prefire Hector variation but I think it is intersting that computer thinks full compensation in many lines except the in original Millner Bary idea where it preferces black.
  
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Nernstian59
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #32 - 09/02/23 at 22:25:21
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bragesjo - Thanks for the informative update.  It's interesting that that the Hector Gambit approach is also being tried in positions arising from ...Bd7 instead of ...Qb6, but it seems reasonable to explore the idea in similar positions, given its success in the ...Qb6 line. 

The May 2023 French update even has the game Kulaots-Bacrot, Vrnjacka Banja 2023 where the idea was tried in the 6.a3 line in the French Advance Variation: 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 c5 4.c3 Nc6 5.Nf3 Qb6 6.a3 Nh6 7.Bd3!? cxd4 8.0-0.
  
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bragesjo
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #31 - 08/31/23 at 11:31:48
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I can tell that Robert Ris also goes for Hector gambit in hes 1 e4 attack course and he improves on Coffee House at some points. The gambit is dangereus works in Correspondence Chess as well I think I have 2 wins and 2 draws after 4  games with white. I can also add the Hector first game in the line was when he was black in Slav Queens gambit in 2006 vs Brynell same position arrose but colors reversed and thus opponent extra tempo still a win.

One of my friends has invented "Svensson Gambit" same idee but Bishop at e2 and not d3 still playable. The ide for white is to take back with bpawn. Computers claim full compensation even in this line.

There has also been developments that white plays the same idee as Hector gambit even when black has played Bd7 instead of Qb6, less stronger still full compensation.
  
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Nernstian59
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #30 - 08/28/23 at 23:11:11
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AndyFeng35 wrote on 08/28/23 at 18:21:43:
My opinion, if you know how to play against Milner-Barry Gambit, in 75% you will win the game.

Does Black win at the same percentage against the delayed form of the Milner-Barry? FYI - this line goes 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 c5 4.c3 Nc6 5.Nf3 Qb6 6.Bd3 cxd4 and now 7.0-0, instead 7.cxd4 as in the original M-B Gambit. The delayed version is often credited to Johnny Hector, who apparently played it as early as 2008. It really caught on when Carlsen played it against Harikrishna in a 2020 blitz game.

The delayed M-B has been more successful than the original version and has been recommended in a number of White 1.e4 repertoire books, including Gawain Jones' Coffeehouse Repertoire.  See this thread

https://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/chess/YaBB.pl?num=1634744219

for a short discussion. The delayed M-B/Hector Variation is also covered in the November 2020 French update:

https://www.chesspublishing.com/content/2/nov20.htm#adv
  
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AndyFeng35
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #29 - 08/28/23 at 18:21:43
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My opinion, if you know how to play against Milner-Barry Gambit, in 75% you will win the game. It can be scarry for the beginners only.
  
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chandrashekharkoravi
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #28 - 11/29/13 at 06:35:54
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Rc8! I think this move is better than Ne7.. 12.  Kh1 Bc5 13.  Bg5 h6 14.  Bd2 Ne7 15.  Rac1 O-O-/+ This move might be the improvement *
  
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tony37
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #27 - 11/28/13 at 12:37:10
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I think both 15.f4 and 15.Rad1 are better moves than 15.Rac1 in your line
after 15.f4 white can play Rf3 (with a possible Rg3 or Rh3 to follow), although black should still be better I think
also interesting is 12...Qh4 13.f4 Nh6
  
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dom
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Re: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #26 - 11/27/13 at 18:29:49
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chandrashekharkoravi wrote on 11/27/13 at 06:32:17:
I don't think that your 14. Rf3 is the best what is your plan with it?


If you want to argue to my post (7 years old !? ) you can do, of course...but what else you propose for White. ? (another move than 14.Rf3)

It's easy to dismiss one move without any concrete variations or ideas for both sides...For example: I didn't reply on CanadianClub last post, because woman champion's video was nice to watch and chess interesting, but my first idea is a quick Black reply ...f6!? to Nun gambit. But I have no time to analyze or search for games, hence I did'nt post because my arguments not ready.

****

I just checked your posts in other threads on chesspub: only one sentence or no idea to propose...to some extend some others went much more annoyed by them:

Quote:
To help a new member (welcome! Smiley) the questions that you ask across the different threads, which tend toward the same idea (tell me what to do in line x) do tend to annoy people quite quickly. Lots of people are friendly, there is plenty of good will, and much help offered.
But it is give and take. Bring something to the table.
Offer ideas.



  

“Learn from the mistakes of others. You can never live long enough to make them all yourself.”  - Groucho Marx
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chandrashekharkoravi
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Re: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #25 - 11/27/13 at 06:32:17
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dom wrote on 08/20/05 at 05:14:48:
Mnb: I disagree...a) Bb5 not available because Black has a knight on c6 square b) White can't play Nc3 and cxd4 next move.

14...Bc5! is Piskov's idea, but it's not the end of the game... 15.Bxa6 (15.Bb5? Qf2 16.Bxd7+ Kxd7 17.Qg4? Nd3 Kosten and Harding ; 15.Bxh7 Qf2 17.Qxf2 Bxf2 18.Bb1 ooo! Bellet-Apicella,France 1995 (Harding or Kosten) better for Black than 18...Ke7  Blasek-Kishnev,Gelsenkirchen 1991 (MCO and Lane) with small advantage to White according to Lane - "Beating the French" after 20.Rf1) Qf2 16.Qxf2 Bxf2 Organdzijew-Drasko,Skopje 1992 (ECG) and now White can try 17.Bb5!? =

Best move for White is 14.Rf3! (and not 14.Rd1) and then 14...Bc5 (if 14...Nxd3 then White seems to have small advantage due to blockade on d4 square with he knight)  15.Be3 Qxd3 16.Bxc5 Qxe2 17.Nxe2 Bb5 18.Nd4! Nc6 19.Rc3=

At the beginning of the line: 6...Bd7 (6...cxd4 is the accurate move) is considered dubious because of  famous game Nimzowitsch-Salwe,Karlsbad 1911 (or gamesLowe-Kennedy, 1849 (ECG)  ; Nimzowitsch-Tarrasch,San Sebastian 1912 (Watson))  after the move 7.dxc5!

My best recorded line for White is Rubinetti-Ivkov, Palma de Majorque 1970 (Lane et Zlotnik)




I don't think that your 14. Rf3 is the best what is your plan with it? What will you play after 14....Rc8 N if 15. a3 then Bc5 16. Qd1 Nxd3 17.Rxd3 and Qf2...I think black is fine
  
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CanadianClub
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #24 - 11/20/13 at 14:06:39
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The only way to try with white is the Nbd2 line, as played by Jiri Nun iirc.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGs7bmXSrSE

It seems dangerous for black, isn't it?
  
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #23 - 11/18/13 at 10:34:32
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Have a look here for MBG analysis. There is also a large database of MBG games. Smiley hullchessclub.com
  
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dom
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Re: C02: Milner-Barry Gambit
Reply #22 - 10/07/13 at 21:16:37
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SWJediknight wrote on 10/07/13 at 00:23:35:
In Play the French 4 Watson recommends 10...a6, concluding (probably correctly, in my opinion) that Black has some advantage in all lines, and says that 10...Qxe5 is good but there are claims that certain lines may not offer Black enough winning chances.


I always preferred the 10...a6 move instead of 10....Qxe5 variations despite knowing both systems. But in a6 system I replaced a later Nd3 with Bc5.
  

“Learn from the mistakes of others. You can never live long enough to make them all yourself.”  - Groucho Marx
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