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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) C11: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6 (Read 24071 times)
Matemax
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #12 - 02/24/09 at 17:36:59
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Nice game with a nice idea for Black - I dont understand 14.Qc2, if 14.g3 White may have to chance to evacute the King or play Bh3. I think White has a bad position after the d4-pawn is removed and you made a nice finish. Playing Re1 at the end is of course better  Smiley
  
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #11 - 02/24/09 at 16:28:18
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Here's my first result with this piece sac.  Unfortunately my opponent blundered at the end, but I suspect I was already winning:

1.Nc3 d5 2.e4 e6 3.d4 Nf6 4.e5 Nfd7 5.f4 c5 6.Nf3 Nc6 7.Be3 Qb6 8.Na4 Qa5+ 9.c3 c4 10.b4 Nxb4 11.cxb4 Bxb4+ 12.Kf2 b5 13.Nb2 O-O 14.Qc2 f6 15.g3 fxe5 16.dxe5 Bc5 17.Bxc5 Nxc5 18.Bh3 Qa3 19.Rhd1 Ne4+ 20.Kg2 g5 21.Nd4 gxf4 22.Bxe6+ Bxe6 23.Nxe6 fxg3 24.Nxf8 gxh2 25.Nd3 Qxf8 26.Nf2 h1=Q+ 27.Rxh1 Qg7+ 28.Kf1 Ng3+ 29.Kg1 Nf5+ 30.Ng4 Qxg4+ 31.Qg2 Qxg2+ 32.Kxg2 Kf7 33.Rxh7+ Ke6 34.Rd1?? Ne3+ 0-1

His note suggested that he meant to play 34.Re1.

I'm currently playing a second game in this line; my opponent played 13.Nc5...
  

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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #10 - 01/18/09 at 14:47:52
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As an addition to your posted analysis I would like to add the following thread: http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1214391315.
You can also check NIC YB 88 where Moskalenko mentions it. So for me it is still not clear how White can achieve advantage and the line with 7...Qb6 is far from refuted. At least the ball is in White's hands(foots) Smiley.
  
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #9 - 01/17/09 at 18:49:14
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Almost three years after abandoning the French, I now have two cc games that have allowed me to play the piece sacrifice, 10...Nxb4!?  Both entered the French by weird (and fascinating) transposition.  I'll post both games as we move further beyond the critical stage of the theory I originally submitted, but looking at these lines with fresh eyes strengthens my conviction that Black can cause White some serious problems here...
  

"Luck favours the prepared mind."  --Louis Pasteur
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #8 - 11/28/08 at 12:46:24
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I have had the opportunity to revisit this line in a correspondence game just recently, and was struck to discover that Black has a remarkable record with the piece sacrifice since 2003: +6, -3, =2!

Is this surprise value or the theoretical merits of the position?

The lone addition to the stuff I presented at the beginning of the thread seems to indicate that Black has found a number of interesting new moves after 13.Nxc5...
  

"Luck favours the prepared mind."  --Louis Pasteur
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #7 - 05/31/07 at 23:26:17
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FYI in line g3 above Khalifman is optimistic about Whites chances after 16Be2 (rather than Qd4) Bxc5 17Bxc5 Qxc5+ 18Qd4.
  
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #6 - 05/23/07 at 02:37:32
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A recent game in this line:

[Event "RUS-ch sf Urals 60th"]
[Site "Nizhnij Tagil"]
[Date "2007.03.14"]
[Round "4"]
[White "Korjakin,Artem"]
[Black "Kalmachevskikh,Viktor"]
[Result "0-1"]
[Eco "C11"]
1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.e5 Nfd7 5.f4 c5 6.Nf3 Nc6 7.Be3 Qb6 8.Na4 Qa5+ 9.c3 c4 10.b4 Nxb4 11.cxb4 Bxb4+ 12.Kf2 b5 13.Nc5 Qb6 14.Nxd7 Bxd7 15.Be2 Be7 16.g4 b4 17.Qc2 a5 18.Nd2 0-0 19.Kg3 a4 20.Nxc4 dxc4 21.Bxc4 Bb5 22.Rhc1 Rac8 23.Qe2 Rxc4 24.Rxc4 Bxc4 25.Qxc4 Qb7 26.Rc1 b3 27.axb3 axb3 28.Rb1 Rb8 29.f5 exf5 30.gxf5 Qe4 31.Rxb3 Rxb3 32.Qxb3 Bh4+ 33.Kh3 h5 34.Qd1 Be1 35.Bg1 Qxf5+ 36.Kg2 Bc3 37.Qf3 Qc2+ 38.Kf1 Bxd4 39.Bxd4 Qc4+ 40.Kg2 Qxd4
41.Qxh5 Qd2+ 42.Kg3 Qe3+ 43.Kh4 Qd2 44.Kh3 Qe3+ 45.Kh4 Qf4+ 46.Kh3 g6 47.Qe2 Kg7 48.Kg2 Kh6 49.h3 Qf5 50.Qb2 Qe4+ 51.Kg3 Qe3+ 52.Kg2 Kg5 53.Qb8 Qd2+ 54.Kg3 Qd3+ 55.Kg2 Kf5 56.Qe8 Qd5+ 57.Kf2 Qe6 58.Qf8 Kxe5 59.Kg3 Kf5 60.Qh6 Qe5+ 61.Kg2 Qe4+ 62.Kg1 Qf4 63.Qh7 Ke4 64.Qh8 Kf3 65.Qa8+ Qe4 66.Qa5 Qb1+ 0-1

13...Qb6 seems to be a new move, though I don't know if it's an improvement over my original analysis.  I suppose the win speaks for itself, but I'll have to look at this position more carefully...
  

"Luck favours the prepared mind."  --Louis Pasteur
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #5 - 07/13/06 at 01:54:17
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Steffen Pedersen's book has some good analysis on this line.  I think it was his book that made me prefer 9 ... c4 to 9 ... cxd4, when the piece sac really doesn't come off.  Worth thinking about, but I think you have more than enough options at move 7 anyway...
  

"Luck favours the prepared mind."  --Louis Pasteur
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #4 - 07/12/06 at 22:56:41
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Btw: I think the critical move for Black was 9....cd4.  But as I mentioned in another thread this critical line doesn't seem too good for Black any more.

Since I'm playing the Steinitz here, I will certainly consider 9...c4 before deciding my next move!

Thanks for the timely update of this thread!
  
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #3 - 07/12/06 at 17:49:04
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986 wrote on 04/03/06 at 21:23:22:
thanks for your analyses, in the variation G1 after the mistake 12. Bd2? I think the right move is b5 and then c3, perhabs a mispelling?

regards Tom


Absolutely right.  It should read 12 Bd2? b5 -+.  For some reason, I am unable to edit the original message.  Statute of limitations or some such thing, perhaps...
  

"Luck favours the prepared mind."  --Louis Pasteur
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #2 - 04/03/06 at 21:23:22
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thanks for your analyses, in the variation G1 after the mistake 12. Bd2? I think the right move is b5 and then c3, perhabs a mispelling?

regards Tom
  
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Re: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
Reply #1 - 04/01/06 at 02:37:25
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Hello,

First of all i need to be thankful for this inspiration. In former times i tried to play this Sacrifice with exchange on d4. But this seems not to be OK for Black.
Now i will study this line with ...c4 and post the result of it here. Hope to see u again for a Discussion then.

Regards
  
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C11: Steinitz with 7 ... Qb6
03/17/06 at 14:25:33
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Some time ago, I spent some effort working on this line.  Current books don't do it justice, especially the piece sacrifice, which I think has considerable merit.  I've since moved away from these lines, and haven't looked at these notes in awhile, but I thought I'd post them here in the hope that they might be of interest to someone.  I wonder, also, about a collaborative effort to fill in the holes.  As you will note, very little original analysis is here.  Most of it is collecting game scores and pasting them together.  So far as I recall, however, most of the text is mine...

(Note the trap after move 13 in G2).

French Steinitz Variation, with 7. … Qb6

        1.e4            e6
           2.d4            d5
           3.Nc3            Nf6
           4.e5            Nfd7
           5.f4                   c5
           6.Nf3            Nc6
           7.Be3            Qb6


A. 8.a3
B. 8.dxc5
C. 8.Qd2
D. 8.Bd2
E. 8.Rb1
F. 8.Bb5
G. 8.Na4

G.      8.Na4            Qa5+
           9.c3            c4
           10.b4            Nxb4

Safer, perhaps, is 10. … Qc7.
           11.cxb4      Bxb4+
           12.Kf2
           
12.Bd2? c3 -+
           12. …            b5

G1. 13.Nc5
G2. 13.Nb2
G3. 13.a3

G1.            13.Nc5            Nxc5
13.… Bc3 14.Bd2 Bxd2 15.Qxd2 Qxd2+ 16.Nxd2 Nxc5 17.dxc5 Kd7 18.Ke3 a5 (18.… a6 anticipates 20. axb5+ and prevents 21. Bxc4) 19.a4 Kc6 20.axb5+ Kxc5 21.Bxc4 dxc4 22.Rhc1 Bb7 23.Nxc4 Bd5 24.Nxa5+ Kxb5 25.Rcb1+ Kc5 26.Ra3 Bc4 27.Nb7+ Kd5 28.Rc3 Rhb8 29.Rd1+ Kc6 30.Rxc4+ Kxb7 31.Rb1+ 1-0 (Frolyanov-Chebotarev, Cherepovets 2001).  Alternatively, 13.… Bc3 14.f5 Nxc5 15.dxc5 Bxa1 16.Qxa1 exf5 17.e6 f6 18.Nd4 0-0 19.g3 Re8 20.Bg2 Bxe6 21.Nxe6 Rxe6 22.Bxd5 Rae8 23.Rd1 Kf8 1/2-1/2. (Ashby-Charter, Leeds 1998).
           14.dxc5      Bc3
It does seem a shame to part with this dark-squared bishop.  It has to be the strongest minor piece on the board.  14.… Bd7 15.a3 (15.Be2 Rc8 (15. ... Bc3 16.Bd2 Bxd2 17.Qxd2 Qxd2 18.Nxd2 Rc8 19.Ke3 Rxc5 20.Kd4 Rc7 ended in a long and complicated draw in Frolyanov-Salinnikov, Tomsk 2002.) 16.f5 Qc7 17.c6 Bxc6 18.fxe6 fxe6 19.Rf1 Bc3 20.Rb1 Bxe5 21.Kg1 0-0 22.Nxe5 Qxe5 23.Bxa7 Rxf1+ 24.Bxf1 Qf5 25.Rb2 e5 26.Be2 Ra8 27.Bg4 Qg5 28.Be6+ Kh8 29.Rf2 d4 (29. … Qe7! seems to be simply winning: 30.Bxd5 Rd8) 30.Qe1 g6 31.Qb4?! (31.h4) Kg7 (31.… Re8!?) 32.Qd6 Qc1+ 33.Rf1 Qe3+ 34.Kh1 Qe4 35.Bh3 Qe2 36.Qe7+ (36.Qf6+)Kh6 37.Qh4+ Qh5 38.Qf6 Qxh3 39.Qxc6 Qd3 and Black lost in Hermida Gonzalez-Alvarino Cazon, Candas 1999, perhaps on time.  It should be noted that in the final position, Black’s superior position has collapsed.  40.Qf6 Qe2 41.Bc5 and it’s White who has the winning chances) Bc3 16.Rb1 0-0 17.Nd4 Rfc8 18.Nc2 f6 19.exf6 Bxf6 20.Be2 Qd8 21.Bf3 Qe7 22.Re1 Bc3 23.Re2 Rxc5 24.Bd4 (24.Bxc5 Qxc5+ 25.Kf1 is okay for White, too) Bxd4+ 25.Qxd4 Qd6 and White had a good pull in Stanke-Paulsen, German League 1994.
           15.Bd2      Bxd2
           16.Qxd2      b4!?
           17.c6

17.Qd4 Bd7 (17.… Bb7!?) 18.Bxc4 dxc4 19.Qxc4 Bb5 20.Qb3 Ba4 21.Qc4 Rc8 (21.… 0-0, intending Rfc8; the a8-R might be better placed on b8) 22.Rhc1 0-0 returns the material and now it’s White with the passed pawn, though Black’s position looks at least equal.  Mind you, it seems a shame to part with the beautiful pawn chain that Black has built.  18.Nd2 Rc8 19.Bxc4 could be even better for White after the knight reaches e4, so Black might think about 17.… Ba6 as a means of discouraging the return of material and maintaining the initiative.
           17. …            Qb6+
           18.Nd4      a5
           19.Be2      Ba6

Black must beware of tricks involving Bxc4 and returning the piece for two of the passed pawns.  Ba6 is crucial.
           20.a4
20.Rc1? Bb5  -+
           20. …            c3
20.… Rc8!? 21. Kf1 0-0 looks like an improvement: locking in the rook on h1, and maintaining the tension.  Black should only play c3 when rooks are in position, thereby gaining tempi on the game.  Black might be rather pleased with 16. … b4!?
     21.Qe3 Bxe2 22.Kxe2 Qc5 23.Rhc1 0-0 24.Rc2 Rfe8 25.Rd1 Ra6 26.c7 Qxc7 27.Qd3 Rb6 28.Nb5 Qc6 1/2-1/2 (Ellithorpe-Gay, USA-ch corr. 1984).


G2.            13.Nb2            Ba3
Standard texts offer 13.… Bc3 14.Qc2 b4 15.Be2 Nb6 (Wittmann-Roth, Austrian Team ch., 1988) as unclear, with some initiative for Black, but 15.Rc1! looks like an important improvement: 15. … Bxb2 (forced because White threatens 16.Na4.  15.… Qxa2 16.Na4 Qxc2 17.Rxc2 and White is better.) 16.Qxb2 Qb6 17.Bxc4! dxc4 18.Rxc4 and White returned the material with a big initiative in Sundberg-Van Bruchem, ICCF 2000.
     13.… Qa3?! looks as though it might be rather effective in hampering White’s king’s efforts to retreat to g1 after Rhf1, since the bishop on e3 needs protecting, but 14.Bc1 puts the question to the Black queen, who must retreat (14.… Qc3? 15.Ng1, intending Ne2), and perhaps the best either side can hope for is a draw by repetition.  13.… f5 hasn’t been tried and might warrant some investigation, though it does allow 14.a4, which can force Black’s hand on the queenside.
           14.Qc2      f6
14.… f5!? 15.Be2 0-0 16.Rhf1 Nb6 looks interesting.
           15.Be2
15.exf6 Nxf6, with Ne4 to follow.
           15. …            0-0
           16.Rhf1      f5

16. … fxe5? 17.fxe5 Nb6—with a mind to bringing the knight to f5 via c8-e7-f5—looks like a tempting plan for Black, putting pressure on the White king along the newly opened f-file.  However, it may be too slow and Black must be wary of a rapid kingside attack.  18.Kg1 h6 19.Bxh6 and Black is floundering: 19. … gxh6 20.Qg6+ Kh8 21.Qxh6+ Kg8 22.Ng5 and White has sprung a mating trap.
     No better is 18. … Bd7 21.Ng5 g6 22.Bh5 Be8 23.Bg4 Bd7 24.Rxf8+ Rxf8 (24. … Bxf8 25.Qf2 +-) and Black needn’t continue.
           17.Kg1             Nb6
Black’s dark-squared bishop looks wonderfully mobile in this position, though the position may be hard to evaluate.
     The lone game in this line continued: 17.Kg1 Nb6 18.Nd1 Bd7 19.g4 b4 20.gxf5 exf5 21.Ng5 h6 22.Nf3 Ba4 23.Qb1 c3 24.Bd3 Rac8 25.Bc2 Bb2 26.Bxf5 Rxf5 27.Qxf5 Bxa1 28.Qe6+ Kh8 29.f5 Qb5 30.Nh4 Qe8 31.Qd6 Nc4 32.Ng6+ Kh7 33.Qxb4 Bxd1 34.Rxd1 Nxe3 35.Rxa1 Nc2 36.Qb1 Nxa1 37.Qxa1 c2 38.Qc1 Qf7 39.Nf4 Qxf5 40.Ne2 Qg4+ 41.Kf1 Qf3+ 42.Ke1 Qh1+ 43.Kd2 Qxh2 44.Kd3 Qh3+ 45.Kd2 Qg2 46.Kd3 Qe4+ 47.Kd2 h5 48.Qf1 c1=Q+ 49.Nxc1 Qc2+ 50.Ke3 Qxc1+ 51.Qxc1 Rxc1 52.Kf4 Kg6 0-1 (Bosse-Poetsch, Bad Zwesten, 2003).


G3.            13.a3            Be7
                  14.Nc5

As in the earlier lines, retreating the knight to b2 warrants consideration. 14.Nb2 Nb6?! (It’s unlikely that Black can get away with the pawn on a3: 14. … Bxa3? 15.Bc1 b4 16.Bxc4 dxc4 17.Nxc4 Qa5 18.Nd6+ and Black looks miserable.  The best option appears to be 14 … 0-0 15.Qc2 f6 and Black looks very solid.) 15.Qc2 Bd7 16.Bd2 Qa6 17.Be2 Qb7 18.Bb4 a5 19.Bxe7 Kxe7 20.g4 g6 21.h4 b4 22.a4 Rac8 23.h5 Qc6 24.Nh4 Rcf8 25.hxg6 hxg6 26.Nxg6+ fxg6 27.Qxg6 Rhg8 28.Rh7+ Kd8 29.Qh6 b3 30.Kg3 c3 31.Rc1 Qc7 32.Ba6 Qb8 33.Qh4+ Kc7 34.Rxc3+ Nc4 35.Bxc4 Qb4 36.Rxd7+ Kb6 37.Rxb3 1-0 (Mazzotti-Quinto Celle Ligure, 1989)
           14. …            Nxc5
           15.dxc5             Qc7
           16.Qd4            Bd7
           17.Be2             0-0
           18.g4             Rfc8

Black looks okay in this line.  Play continued: 19.Qc3 a5 20.Rhb1 Bxc5 21.Bxc5 Qxc5+ 22.Kg2 b4 23.axb4 axb4 24.Qc2 b3 25.Qc3 Qb6 26.Bxc4 dxc4 27.Rxa8 Rxa8 28.Qxc4 Ra2+ 29.Kg3 Qf2+ 0-1 (Maier-Gann Karlsruhe, 2003).
« Last Edit: 07/24/11 at 08:59:38 by dom »  

"Luck favours the prepared mind."  --Louis Pasteur
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