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Poll Question: What do you think about From's Gambit, 1.f4 e5?
bars   pie

Sound    
  10 (17.2%)
So messy that it's playable    
  15 (25.9%)
Objectively struggling against best play    
  22 (37.9%)
Unsound    
  7 (12.1%)
Dead    
  4 (6.9%)




Total votes: 58
« Created by: CraigEvans on: 03/20/06 at 09:46:13 »
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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) From's Gambit - Current Opinion (Read 22555 times)
le_gars
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #54 - 10/10/07 at 22:26:05
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I  was sure you would also find something on ...Be7  Grin  Your variations are quite convincing and it is very difficult to find a promising continuation for white indeed. I am going to investigate it more deeply...
  
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MamboVipi
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #53 - 10/10/07 at 20:30:10
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le_gars wrote on 10/10/07 at 08:04:32:
MamboVipi wrote on 10/09/07 at 21:51:50:
That line is also given in Taylor's  book but after 11.Qd3 black can play 11...Nc6 and now 12.0-0 f4 doesn't give white an advantage I think: 13.d5 Nb4 14.Qe2 fxe3 (maybe even Nxe3) but it's quite unclear. That's why I started looking for an earlier improvement for white.


Oh yes indeed, this line is Taylor's book ... At least that means I agree with him  Wink   On 11...Nc6 I play 12.c3 without any thoughts and I think the problem remains the same, Black Bishop is just misplaced on e7, don't you think ?




The bishop will perhaps go to f6 after 12...f4 13.0-0 (what else? 13.exf4 Bf5 14.Qd1 cxd4 doesn't look good for white 15.cxd4 Bc5! 16.dxc5 Qa5+ and the attack is killing) 13...Nxe3 14.Bxe3 Bf5 15.Qe2 fxe3 16.Qxe3 cxd4 17.cxd4 Bf6 and black will get the pawn back and is maybe even better with the bishop pair.

Black can also play 11...f4!? then 12.c3 is not possible because of 12...Lh4+, but white can play 12.exf4 Bf5 13.Qd2 and that might be a bit better for white. After the similar 11...Nc6 12.0-0 f4 13.exf4 Bf5 black is doing better. So maybe we can conclude that 12.c3 is indeed better than 12.0-0 but not enough  Wink
  
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le_gars
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #52 - 10/10/07 at 08:04:32
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MamboVipi wrote on 10/09/07 at 21:51:50:
That line is also given in Taylor's  book but after 11.Qd3 black can play 11...Nc6 and now 12.0-0 f4 doesn't give white an advantage I think: 13.d5 Nb4 14.Qe2 fxe3 (maybe even Nxe3) but it's quite unclear. That's why I started looking for an earlier improvement for white.


Oh yes indeed, this line is Taylor's book ... At least that means I agree with him  Wink   On 11...Nc6 I play 12.c3 without any thoughts and I think the problem remains the same, Black Bishop is just misplaced on e7, don't you think ?


Quote:
After 8.Bf4 I would suggest 8...Nc6 and now 9.Bxd6+ Qxd6 10.c3!? (10.Nc3 cxd4 11.Rd1 Qg6 looks OK for black) 10...Bd7 =+ or 9.c3 f5 10.Bxd6+ Qxd6 11.Qd3 cxd4 12.Nbd2 Ne3!? is interesting but no problem for black.
So I think my line starting with 8.d5 is more promising.


Your variations seem quite correct. You re right Kf8 may be not so bad, and your variation with 8.d5 better than mine . That's funny that this ugly move cannot be refuted.


Quote:
By the way le_gars, nice website you have on the Bird!


Thanks, I hope you understand french a little bit  Wink


I just come back to your previous thread :

Quote:
1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.Nf3 Nf6 5.d4 Ng4 6.Qd3 c5 7.Qe4+ Be6 8.Ng5 Bxh2 9.Nxe6 Qh4+ 10.Kd2 fxe6 11.Rxh2 Qg5+ 12.e3 Nxh2 13.Qxe6+ Kd8 14.Qd6+ Nd7 15.Qxh2 Rf8 16.Be2 (my opponent told me he only knew an other line: 16.Ke1 cxd4 followed by, I assume, Be2) now my opponent played 16...Rf2 
(Taylor gives 16...cxd4 17.Kd1 dxe3 18.c4 Rf2 19.Nc3 Qxg2 20.Qxg2 Rxg2 21.Bxe3 with a winning ending). My reply was 17.Qxh7?! with should have led to a draw after 17...cxd4 18.Kd1 Rxe2! 19.Kxe2 Qxg2+ 20.Kd3 Qf1+ 21.Kxd4 and black can get a perpetual check with either 21...Qf6+ or 21...Qxc1 22.Qg8 Kc7 23.Qxa8 Qxb2+ 24.Nc3 Qb4+ 25.Kd3 Ne5+ 26.Kd2 Nc4+

So a better move should be 17.dxc5. I analyzed this move a bit with rybka and came up with the following line 17...Nxc5 18.Nc3 Ke7 19.Qc7+ Kf8 20.Qd6+ Kf7 21.Ke1 Rxg2 22.Qf4+ Qxf4 23.exf4 Re8 24.Kf1 Rh2 and I think white is better, but this is quite complicated stuff!


16.Re1 was the main line before Taylor's book. Not sure if his move 16.Be2 is an improvement or not.

In my theory, I have the following statement after 16.Be2 : "if Black plays something else than 16...cxd4, then dxc5 is winning because of the material advantage". Hum, that s the kind of theorical winning game that is just unclear OTB. The problem of the main lines following  13.Qe6+ is just they are just unclear. You can spend hours on them but OTB it won t prove very useful because of the many possibilities for both sides.

Quote:
Is 5.g3 an easier way to play for an advantage for White?


It is another way to play for an advantage, but certainly not easier.

Let me suggest you something else, the almost unknown 7.Nc3!? .  Here are a few variations :

- 7…cxd4 8.Qxd4 0-0 9.Bg5 (9.Nb5!?) 9…Nc6 10.Qxg4 (10.Qd2!?) 10…Bxg4 11.Bxd8 Rfxd8 12.0-0-0 Bf4+ 13.Kb1 Rxd1 14.Nxd1, +=

- 7…Nc6 8.Bg5 (8.dxc5?! Bxc5 9.Qxd8 Txd8 10.Ne4 Bb6, =; 8.Qe4+!? Be6 9.dxc5 Bxc5 10.e3, += ) 8…f6 9.dxc5 Bxc5 10.Qxd8+ Kxd8 11.0-0-0+ Re8 12.Rd5! Bf2 (12…Nf2 13.Rxc5 Nxh1 14.Be3 et le Knight won't get out) 13.Bf4, +=.

These lines have almost never been played, but seem very interesting to me.
  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #51 - 10/10/07 at 06:38:52
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MNb wrote on 10/10/07 at 02:43:55:
It is a nice website indeed, though a few important lines are missing.
a) 1.f4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.e3 c6 4.b3 Bf5 5.Bb2 e6 6.Be2 Bd6 7.0-0 0-0 (Schlechter).
b) 1.f4 Nf6 2.Nf3 g6 3.b3?! Bg7 4.Bb2 0-0 5.e3 d6 6.Be2 e5!
c) 1.f4 Nf6 2.b3 g6 3.Bb2 Bg7 4.e4!?
d) 1.f4 Nf6 2.Nf3 g6 3.d3 Bg7 4.e4 d6 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 c5 7.Qe1 Nc6 8.Nc3 (necessary?) Nd4!
e) 1.f4 c5 2.Nf3 g6/Nc6.

f) 1.f4 d5 2.Nf3 g6 3.e3 Bg7 4.Be2 Nf6 5.0-0 0-0 6.d3 c5 7.Qe1 Nc6 8.a4 Re8 (b6 9.Ne5!? and 9.Qh4 Bb7 - much better than Ba6 - 10.Na3 Re8 11.Ne5 Nd7!)
f1) 9.d4 cxd4 10.exd4 Qb6?! 11.c3 e5? loses; with colours reversed and the a-pawn on its initial square this works nicely.
f2) 9.Ne5 Nxe5 10.fxe5 Nd7 11.d4 f6! is critical.
f3) 9.Qh4 e5 10.fxe5 Nxe5 favours Black because of the weak e3-pawn.
f4) 9.Qg3 (or 9.Nc3) e5 10.fxe5 Nxe5 11.Nxe5 Qxe5 12.Nc3 (12.Qg3) Qe7 13.Bf3 and 14.e4.
These lines are basically a Dutch Iljin-Zjenevsky; White has to prove that his extra move a2-a4 is useful.


Thanks MNb !

Can I add your variations on my site (with your name) ?
I know that all the (non-From) theory presented on my site is very poor, but I have a little time now to work on it.
Anyway, I agree that White advantage in the Iljin-Zjenevsky is far from obvious. That's why I am focusing more on Taylor's suggestion 1.f4 Nf6  2.Nf3 d5  3.e3 g6  4.Be2 Bg7  5.0-0 0-0  6.d3 c5  7.Nc3!?    
But the more I study it, the less I am sure it is a good suggestion  Wink


MNb wrote on 10/10/07 at 02:43:55:
In the bibliography LM Picket(t)'s A modern Approach to Bird's Opening (1975) and Schwarz' book on the Bird are not mentioned. I suppose they are hard to find; I own only the first.
A collection of games by an important Bird practicioner can be found at
http://www.geocities.com/drawyah/


Yes you're right, that's because they are hard to find I couldn't review them. If you have so time, I can put your comments on Picket's book.
Finally, I also give your link is on my site.

Thanks again !
« Last Edit: 10/10/07 at 08:35:44 by le_gars »  
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thibdb13
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #50 - 10/10/07 at 06:05:36
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MNb wrote on 10/10/07 at 02:43:55:
A collection of games by an important Bird practicioner can be found at

http://www.geocities.com/drawyah/

Sorry I am off topic.


Very interesting link. Thanks MNb.
I really like the idea's of the Ballogh gambit!!
  

Yusupov once said that “The problem with the Dutch Defence is that later in many positions the best move would be ...f5-f7” but he is surely wrong.
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #49 - 10/10/07 at 02:43:55
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It is a nice website indeed, though a few important lines are missing.
a) 1.f4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.e3 c6 4.b3 Bf5 5.Bb2 e6 6.Be2 Bd6 7.0-0 0-0 (Schlechter).
b) 1.f4 Nf6 2.Nf3 g6 3.b3?! Bg7 4.Bb2 0-0 5.e3 d6 6.Be2 e5!
c) 1.f4 Nf6 2.b3 g6 3.Bb2 Bg7 4.e4!?
d) 1.f4 Nf6 2.Nf3 g6 3.d3 Bg7 4.e4 d6 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 c5 7.Qe1 Nc6 8.Nc3 (necessary?) Nd4!
e) 1.f4 c5 2.Nf3 g6/Nc6.

f) 1.f4 d5 2.Nf3 g6 3.e3 Bg7 4.Be2 Nf6 5.0-0 0-0 6.d3 c5 7.Qe1 Nc6 8.a4 Re8 (b6 9.Ne5!? and 9.Qh4 Bb7 - much better than Ba6 - 10.Na3 Re8 11.Ne5 Nd7!)
f1) 9.d4 cxd4 10.exd4 Qb6?! 11.c3 e5? loses; with colours reversed and the a-pawn on its initial square this works nicely.
f2) 9.Ne5 Nxe5 10.fxe5 Nd7 11.d4 f6! is critical.
f3) 9.Qh4 e5 10.fxe5 Nxe5 favours Black because of the weak e3-pawn.
f4) 9.Qg3 (or 9.Nc3) e5 10.fxe5 Nxe5 11.Nxe5 Qxe5 12.Nc3 (12.Qg3) Qe7 13.Bf3 and 14.e4.
These lines are basically a Dutch Iljin-Zjenevsky; White has to prove that his extra move a2-a4 is useful.

In the bibliography LM Picket(t)'s A modern Approach to Bird's Opening (1975) and Schwarz' book on the Bird are not mentioned. I suppose they are hard to find; I own only the first.
A collection of games by an important Bird practicioner can be found at

http://www.geocities.com/drawyah/

Sorry I am off topic.
  

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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #48 - 10/09/07 at 21:51:50
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le_gars wrote on 10/09/07 at 16:43:19:
I think Black has to play 7...Be6 if he wants to stay in the game.

On e7 the Black bishop is far less dangerous than on d6. In his book, IM Ivanov suggests to play 7...Be7 8.e3 0-0 9.Bd3, +=. I think that s true, for exemple 9...f5  10.Bc4+ Kh8  11.Qd3 cxd4  12.exd4 Bh4+  13.g3 Re8+ 14.Kf1, with a clear advantage for white.


That line is also given in Taylor's  book but after 11.Qd3 black can play 11...Nc6 and now 12.0-0 f4 doesn't give white an advantage I think: 13.d5 Nb4 14.Qe2 fxe3 (maybe even Nxe3) but it's quite unclear. That's why I started looking for an earlier improvement for white.

Quote:
7...Kf8 is even weaker, the Rook on h8 can t come into the game. 8...Bf4 Bxf4  9.Qxf4 and where is the compensation for Black missing pawn ? A nice variation is 10...Qb6  11.e3!? Qxb2  12.Bc4 f5  13.0-0 (+-) 13...Nf6?  14.Qc7 and Black can resign.



After 8.Bf4 I would suggest 8...Nc6 and now 9.Bxd6+ Qxd6 10.c3!? (10.Nc3 cxd4 11.Rd1 Qg6 looks OK for black) 10...Bd7 =+ or 9.c3 f5 10.Bxd6+ Qxd6 11.Qd3 cxd4 12.Nbd2 Ne3!? is interesting but no problem for black.
So I think my line starting with 8.d5 is more promising.

By the way le_gars, nice website you have on the Bird!

  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #47 - 10/09/07 at 16:43:19
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MamboVipi wrote on 10/05/07 at 21:51:40:
When I was analyzing this line I wondered whether black can go for a simpeler game with 7...Be7? One line goes like 8.Bg5 Nc6 9.Bxe7 Qxe7 10.Qxe7 Kxe7 11.dxc5 Ne3 and although white is 2 pawns up, it's difficult to proceed maybe 12.Na3 Rd8 13.b3 Rd5 14.c4 Rxc5 15.Kf2 Ng4+ 16.Kg3 is a try. Any thoughts on this line?

Even 7...Kf8 might be playable, e.g. 8.d5 Nf6 9.Qh4 Be7 10.e4 Nxd5 11.Qf2 an I like white's position a bit better, but it isn't that much of an advantage


I think Black has to play 7...Be6 if he wants to stay in the game.

On e7 the Black bishop is far less dangerous than on d6. In his book, IM Ivanov suggests to play 7...Be7 8.e3 0-0 9.Bd3, +=. I think that s true, for exemple 9...f5  10.Bc4+ Kh8  11.Qd3 cxd4  12.exd4 Bh4+  13.g3 Re8+ 14.Kf1, with a clear advantage for white.

7...Kf8 is even weaker, the Rook on h8 can t come into the game. 8...Bf4 Bxf4  9.Qxf4 and where is the compensation for Black missing pawn ? A nice variation is 10...Qb6  11.e3!? Qxb2  12.Bc4 f5  13.0-0 (+-) 13...Nf6?  14.Qc7 and Black can resign.

  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #46 - 10/08/07 at 20:30:01
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No, then he would have told us if and where Hans AW Lindehn has shown his gambit to From.
  

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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #45 - 10/08/07 at 19:40:51
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Dragonslayer wrote on 10/08/07 at 19:25:28:
MNb wrote on 09/21/07 at 01:37:07:
Markovich wrote on 09/20/07 at 12:35:08:
Unrelatedly, I believe that this From is the very Dane for whom the Danish Gambit is named.  Is that correct?

Well, one of the Danes. From might have been kibitzing when Lindehn-Maczuski was played in Paris 1863, as he has lived there. Otherwise Lindehn has told him in Kopenhagen 1862.
Other Danish connections are the corr games Kopenhagen-Uppsala,1875 (From probably was involved), Nielsen-Van der Linde,1875 and Sörensen-Leffler, 1875. I have read somewhere that the Danish wrote one or more articles on this gambit.


I believe Greco mentioned the gambit 1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 Qh4+ as early as the 17th century. See e.g.:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1272149

One also finds an amusing game from 1802:
NN - Du Mont
Paris 1802
1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.g3 Qg5 5.Nf3 Qxg3+6.hxg3 Bxg3#

Martin Severing Janus From (1828-1895) was indeed Danish. He played 1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.Nf3 Nh6 in this game:

Møllerstrøm,M - From,S [A02]
Copenhagen 1862
1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.Nf3 Nh6 5.e4 Ng4 6.g3 Nxh2 7.Rxh2 Bxg3+ 8.Ke2 Bxh2 9.Nxh2 f5 10.Bg2 fxe4 11.Bxe4 Qh4 12.Qh1 0-0 13.Bd5+ Kh8 14.Qg1 Qh5+ 15.Bf3 Rxf3 16.Nxf3 Bg4 17.d3 Nc6 18.Bf4 Rf8 19.Bg3 Rxf3 20.Ke1 Qh6 21.Nc3 Nb4 0-1

The game was published in Deutsche Schachzeitung july-august 1862. Not often mentioned is the fact that this game was played by mail.

From was later invited to the international tournament in Paris 1867.

The chessplayers in Copenhagen also analyzed the Nordic (Danish) gambit 1.e4 e5 2.d4 exd4 3.c3 and 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 f5 3.Nxe5 Nc6 in the 1860ies and 70ies.


Hmmm, you wouldn't be Edward Winter, would you?
  

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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #44 - 10/08/07 at 19:25:28
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MNb wrote on 09/21/07 at 01:37:07:
Markovich wrote on 09/20/07 at 12:35:08:
Unrelatedly, I believe that this From is the very Dane for whom the Danish Gambit is named.  Is that correct?

Well, one of the Danes. From might have been kibitzing when Lindehn-Maczuski was played in Paris 1863, as he has lived there. Otherwise Lindehn has told him in Kopenhagen 1862.
Other Danish connections are the corr games Kopenhagen-Uppsala,1875 (From probably was involved), Nielsen-Van der Linde,1875 and Sörensen-Leffler, 1875. I have read somewhere that the Danish wrote one or more articles on this gambit.


I believe Greco mentioned the gambit 1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 Qh4+ as early as the 17th century. See e.g.:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1272149

One also finds an amusing game from 1802:
NN - Du Mont
Paris 1802
1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.g3 Qg5 5.Nf3 Qxg3+6.hxg3 Bxg3#

Martin Severing Janus From (1828-1895) was indeed Danish. He played 1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.Nf3 Nh6 in this game:

Møllerstrøm,M - From,S [A02]
Copenhagen 1862
1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.Nf3 Nh6 5.e4 Ng4 6.g3 Nxh2 7.Rxh2 Bxg3+ 8.Ke2 Bxh2 9.Nxh2 f5 10.Bg2 fxe4 11.Bxe4 Qh4 12.Qh1 0-0 13.Bd5+ Kh8 14.Qg1 Qh5+ 15.Bf3 Rxf3 16.Nxf3 Bg4 17.d3 Nc6 18.Bf4 Rf8 19.Bg3 Rxf3 20.Ke1 Qh6 21.Nc3 Nb4 0-1

The game was published in Deutsche Schachzeitung july-august 1862. Not often mentioned is the fact that this game was played by mail.

From was later invited to the international tournament in Paris 1867.

The chessplayers in Copenhagen also analyzed the Nordic (Danish) gambit 1.e4 e5 2.d4 exd4 3.c3 and 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 f5 3.Nxe5 Nc6 in the 1860ies and 70ies.
  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #43 - 10/06/07 at 04:01:52
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Quote:
Is 5.g3 an easier way to play for an advantage for White?


I'm no expert on this but right now I think it probably is against 4...Nf6 (and 4...g5 too of course).  Taylor's variation after 5.g3 looks improvable for both sides, but I think White can maintain an edge.
  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #42 - 10/05/07 at 21:51:40
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Dragonslayer wrote on 03/24/06 at 16:11:56:
I do not have Taylor's book but IMO the From is playable.

After 1.f4 d6 2.e4 Nf6 White has 3.Nc3 with either a good King's Gambit (3...e5) a good Grand Prix attack (3...c5) or a mainline Pirc (3...g6 4.d4).
After 1.f4 d6 2.Nf3 e5 White can still enter the King's Gambit with 3.e4 which alomst forces Black to play the Fischer defence with 3...exf4. Uberdeker's line 3.fxe5 g5!? transposes to the line 1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.Nf3 g5!? This is probably ok for Black. According to Danish cc-GM Ove Ekebjærg White's best is the Polerio style sacrifice 4.e4 g4 5.Bc4 gxf3 6.Qxf3.

In the main line From:
1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.Nf3 g5 5.g3 g4 6.Nh4 Ne7 7.e4!? Ng6 8.Nf5 Bxf5 9.exf5 Ne5 10.Bg2 Nbc6 11.0-0 looks dangerous for White, but with accurate play he should have the better chances.

4...Nf6 seems the better choice. After 5.d4 Black can choose between a dead even game after 5...0-0 6.Bg5 Re8 7.Qd3 Nc6 8.a3 (or 8.c3) h6 9.Bxf6 Qxf6 10.e4 Bf5 11.Nc3. Black wins the pawn on e4 with Qe7 or Qg6.
More complicated is 5...Ng4 6.Qd3! c5 7.Qe4+ Be6 8.Ng5 Bxh2
and here White must decide between the draw with 9.Rxh2 Nxh2 10.Nxe6 fxe6 11.Qxe6+ Qe7 12.Qc8+ Qd8!=
or playing for more with 9.Nxe6 Qh4+! 10.Kd2 fxe6 11.Rxh2 (11.Qxe6+ Kd8 is also unclear) 11...Qg5+ 12.e3 Nxh2 13.Qxe6+ Kd8 14.Qd6+ Nd7 15.Qxh2 which is very unclear.


Last week I had a game in which I followed the last mentioned line which I knew from Timothy Taylor's book:

1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.Nf3 Nf6 5.d4 Ng4 6.Qd3 c5 7.Qe4+ Be6 8.Ng5 Bxh2 9.Nxe6 Qh4+ 10.Kd2 fxe6 11.Rxh2 Qg5+ 12.e3 Nxh2 13.Qxe6+ Kd8 14.Qd6+ Nd7 15.Qxh2 Rf8 16.Be2 (my opponent told me he only knew an other line: 16.Ke1 cxd4 followed by, I assume, Be2) now my opponent played 16...Rf2
(Taylor gives 16...cxd4 17.Kd1 dxe3 18.c4 Rf2 19.Nc3 Qxg2 20.Qxg2 Rxg2 21.Bxe3 with a winning ending). My reply was 17.Qxh7?! with should have led to a draw after 17...cxd4 18.Kd1 Rxe2! 19.Kxe2 Qxg2+ 20.Kd3 Qf1+ 21.Kxd4 and black can get a perpetual check with either 21...Qf6+ or 21...Qxc1 22.Qg8 Kc7 23.Qxa8 Qxb2+ 24.Nc3 Qb4+ 25.Kd3 Ne5+ 26.Kd2 Nc4+

So a better move should be 17.dxc5. I analyzed this move a bit with rybka and came up with the following line 17...Nxc5 18.Nc3 Ke7 19.Qc7+ Kf8 20.Qd6+ Kf7 21.Ke1 Rxg2 22.Qf4+ Qxf4 23.exf4 Re8 24.Kf1 Rh2 and I think white is better, but this is quite complicated stuff!

When I was analyzing this line I wondered whether black can go for a simpeler game with 7...Be7? One line goes like 8.Bg5 Nc6 9.Bxe7 Qxe7 10.Qxe7 Kxe7 11.dxc5 Ne3 and although white is 2 pawns up, it's difficult to proceed maybe 12.Na3 Rd8 13.b3 Rd5 14.c4 Rxc5 15.Kf2 Ng4+ 16.Kg3 is a try. Any thoughts on this line?

Even 7...Kf8 might be playable, e.g. 8.d5 Nf6 9.Qh4 Be7 10.e4 Nxd5 11.Qf2 an I like white's position a bit better, but it isn't that much of an advantage

Is 5.g3 an easier way to play for an advantage for White?
  
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thibdb13
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #41 - 09/30/07 at 18:04:35
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Black_Widow wrote on 09/30/07 at 11:43:50:
By the way, Mechelen is a very nice place to live in.


Thanks for the compliment. It does not happen so often that people know this city...
  

Yusupov once said that “The problem with the Dutch Defence is that later in many positions the best move would be ...f5-f7” but he is surely wrong.
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Black_Widow
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #40 - 09/30/07 at 11:43:50
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I had some disappointing results also with white in the beginning. If you make one weaker move, the burden of defense becomes very high for white. Until I went studying the From, and then things drastically changed for the better. From is nice for white, but only if you know your lesson.

By the way, Mechelen is a very nice place to live in.
  
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