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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4 (Read 4440 times)
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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #12 - 06/30/06 at 00:45:20
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I'd like to throw in the possibility of 7.Bg5 h6 8.Bd2!?

The idea is to get into the normal Bd2-lines with an extra ...h6 thrown in - this weakening of the black king side often favors White.


This seems quite accurate; thanks for the examples, OstapBender.  I guess I need to decide whether I can deal with this weakening, or should find another 7th move for Black...
  
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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #11 - 06/24/06 at 13:33:17
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I'd like to throw in the possibility of 7.Bg5 h6 8.Bd2!?

The idea is to get into the normal Bd2-lines with an extra ...h6 thrown in - this weakening of the black king side often favors White.


Black's ...h6 makes it more difficult to counter the long diagonal Q+B battery (since the typical  ...g6 resource is compromised).  This is a feature of the following games:

Wisnewski-Polushkina, Dresden 2001

1. e4 c6 2. d4 d5 3. exd5 cxd5 4. c4 Nf6 5. Nc3 e6 6. Nf3 Bb4 7. Bg5 h6 8. Bd2 O-O 9. cxd5 Nxd5 10. Bd3 b6 11. a3 Be7 12. Qe2 Bb7 13. Qe4 g6 14. Bxh6 Re8 15. Qg4 Nf6 16. Qh3 Nc6 17. Be3 e5 18. Bc4 Nxd4 19. Nxe5 Nc2+ 20. Ke2 Nxe3 21. fxe3 Bd5 22. Nxd5 Nxd5 23. Qf3 Bf6 24. Bxd5 1-0

Priborsky-Vinklarek, Klatovy 2001

1. e4 c6 2. d4 d5 3. exd5 cxd5 4. c4 Nf6 5. Nc3 e6 6. Nf3 Bb4 7. Bg5 h6 8. Bd2 O-O 9. cxd5 Nxd5 10. Bd3 Nc6 11. O-O Be7 12. Re1 Nf6 13. Be3 Nb4 14. Bb1 b6 15. a3 Nbd5 16. Qd3 Bb7 17. Ne5 Rc8 18. Ng4 Re8 19. Nxh6+ gxh6 20. Bxh6 Bd6 21. Re5 Bxe5 22. dxe5 Rxc3 23. bxc3 Ne3 24. Bxe3 Qd5 25. Qxd5 Nxd5 26. Bd4 Nf4 27. f3 Rc8 28. Kf2 Ba6 29. Be4 Ne2 30. Rd1 Nxc3 31. Bxc3 Rxc3 32. Rd7 Rxa3 33. Rxa7 Ra2+ 34. Kg3 Kg7 35. Bd3 Bc4 36. Rxa2 Bxa2 37. Kf4 Kh6 38. g3 Bb3 39. Bb5 Kg6 40. h4 Kh5 41. Be8 Kg6 42. g4 Bc4 43. h5+ Kg7 44. Kg5 b5 45. h6+ Kh8 46. Kf6 b4 47. Bxf7 b3 48. g5 Bd3 49. g6 Bxg6 50. Bxg6 b2 51. Kxe6 1-0

  

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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #10 - 06/24/06 at 09:23:24
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I'd like to throw in the possibility of 7.Bg5 h6 8.Bd2!?

The idea is to get into the normal Bd2-lines with an extra ...h6 thrown in - this weakening of the black king side often favors White.
  

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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #9 - 06/24/06 at 05:20:10
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HgMan wrote on 05/10/06 at 11:37:08:
[Event "FIDE-Wch"]
[Site "Elista"]
[Date "1996.06.??"]
[Round "4"]
[White "Kamsky,Gata"]
[Black "Karpov,Anatoly"]
[Result "0-1"]
[Eco "B14"]
1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.exd5 cxd5 4.c4 Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4 7.cxd5 Nxd5 8.Bd2 Nc6 9.Bd3 Be7 10.0-0 0-0 11.Qe2 Nf6 12.Ne4 Qb6 13.a3 Bd7 14.Rfd1 Rad8 15.Nxf6+ Bxf6 16.Qe4 g6
17.Be3 Ne7 18.Ne5 Nf5 19.Nc4 Qa6 20.a4 Bc6 21.Qf4 Bd5 22.Ne5 Qb6 23.Bxf5 exf5 24.Rd2 Bg7 25.h4 Rfe8 26.Qg3 Rc8 27.Nd7 Qc6 28.Nc5 b6 29.Nd3 Qd7 30.a5 Re4 31.Nf4 b5 32.Rdd1 Bc4 33.Rac1 h6 34.Rc3 b4 35.Rc2 Rc6 36.Rdc1 Bb5 37.Kh2 Kh7 38.Rxc6 Bxc6 39.Rc4 Bf8 40.Nd3 Qe6 41.d5 Bxd5 42.Rxe4 Bxe4 43.Bxa7 Bd6 44.Nf4 Qe5 45.Nh3 Qe7 0-1

In Starting Out: The Caro-Kann, Joe Gallagher claims that White would have been better with 14 Be3 Nd5 15 b4 with Rfc1 and Nc5 to follow...


I agree.  Black can try, instead of continuing the Karpovian retreats, 11...Ndb4 12.Be4 f5!? or even 12...Nxd4, but things for Black do look a bit dicey.  There are lots of forcing lines to check, but one of the critical ones must be 12...f5 13.Bxc6 Nxc6 14.Rfd1 Nxd4 15.Nxd4 Qxd4 16.Bg5 Qc5 17.Na4 Qb4 18.a3 Qxa4 19.Bxe7 Re8 20.Rac1 Rxe7 21.Rd8+ Re8 22.b3 Rxd8 23.bxa4.  I think White is a bit better...
  
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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #8 - 06/24/06 at 04:42:34
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Ivanchuk,V (2740) - Dreev,A (2650) [B14]
Linares 14th Linares (3), 06.02.1997

1.c4 c6 2.e4 d5 3.exd5 Nf6 4.Nc3 cxd5 5.d4 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4 7.Bg5 h6 8.Bxf6 Qxf6 9.Qb3 Qe7 10.c5 Ba5 11.Bb5+ Bd7 12.Ne5 Nc6 13.Bxc6 Bxc6 14.0-0 Bc7 15.f4 0-0 16.Rae1 Bxe5 17.fxe5 b6 18.cxb6 Rab8 19.Qd1 Rxb6 20.b3 f5 21.exf6 Rxf6 22.Rxf6 Qxf6 23.Qd2 Bd7 24.Nd1 Be8 25.Nf2 Rc6 26.h3 Bh5 27.a4 Kh7 28.Rf1 Qh4 29.Kh2 Bg6 30.Ng4 Bf5 31.Ne3 Qg5 32.Rf2 Be4 33.b4 e5 34.b5 exd4 35.Qxd4 Rc1 36.Ng4 h5 37.Qe5 Qxe5+ 38.Nxe5 Ra1 39.g4 hxg4 40.hxg4 Rxa4 41.Nc6 d4 42.Kg3 d3 43.Ne7 Kh6 44.Kh4 g5+ 45.Kg3 Kg7 46.Nf5+ Kf6 47.Nd6+ Ke5 48.Nf7+ Kd4 49.Nxg5 Ke3 50.Nf3 Bxf3 51.Rxf3+ Ke2 52.Rf2+ Ke1 53.Kf3 Rf4+ 0-1

is, I think one of the critical lines, prematurely (in my opinion) judged as equal in NCO after Black's 14th move, when White's position seems to improve quite a bit and the final result is mostly irrelevant.

I think that Black needs to deviate at move 9 -- 9...Bxc3+ seems like a good move, with one point being that 10.bxc3 0-0 11.cxd5 exd5 12.Qxd5 Re8+ looks like a very promising gambit for Black.
  
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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #7 - 05/12/06 at 01:04:40
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I would be happy to discuss the anti-Benoni aspects of Black's choices here http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1114504280/15#19, where I have also provided the move order that I expect to see this line arise from.
  
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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #6 - 05/11/06 at 15:22:03
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I know you said you weren't interested in earlier deviations but I am interested in the Anti-Benoni move order to which the original post refers.  Roll Eyes

After 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 c5 3.e3 Black should be in no hurry to play ...cxd4 and ...d5.  3...g6! looks best keeping the idea of ...d5 in reserve.

Presumably you are getting there from 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 c5 4.e3 then?
  

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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #5 - 05/11/06 at 11:48:41
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sounds like nice co-operative play from White  Wink
  
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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #4 - 05/10/06 at 19:05:31
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In my opinion, the Panov is nothing Black has to fear, Black just has to play accurately to neutralise White's initiative, and after exchanging pieces he has a clear engame advantage. But that's just my opinion  Wink

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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #3 - 05/10/06 at 19:03:20
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[Date "1973.??.??"]
[White "Taimanov,Mark"]
[Black "Karpov,Anatoly"]
[Result "0-1"]
1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.ed5: cd5: 4.c4 Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4 7. Bd3 dc4: 8. Bc4: 0-0 9 0-0 b6 10. Qe2 Bb7
11. Rd1 Nbd7 12. Bd2 Rc8 (Black already has a satisfying position) 13. Ba6? (eliminating one of White's most important pieces!) Ba6:! 14. Qa6: Bc3: 15. bc3: Rc7! 16. Rac1 Qc8 17. Qa4 Rc4 (preventing c4 is worth a pawn!) 18. Qa7: Qc6 19. Qa3 Rfc8 20. h3 h6 21. Rb1 Ra4 22. Qb3 Nd5
23. Rdc1 Rc4 24. Rb2 f6 (Karpow rather wants to increase the pressure than winning back the pawn with ...Nc3:) 25. Re1 Kf7 26. Qd1 Nf8 27. Rb3 Ng6 28. Qb1 Ra8 29. Re4 Rca4 30. Rb2 Nf8 31. Qd3 Rc4
32. Re1 Ra3 33. Qb1 Ng6 34. Rc1 (better is 34. Qd3, hoping for 34. ... Nc3:?? 35. Tb3 winning) Nc3:
35. Qd3 Ne2+ 36. Qe2: Rc1:+ 37. Bc1: Qc1:+ 38. Kh2 Rf3: 39. gf3: Nh4 (White lost on time, but his position is lost anyway)
  

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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #2 - 05/10/06 at 11:37:08
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[Event "FIDE-Wch"]
[Site "Elista"]
[Date "1996.06.??"]
[Round "4"]
[White "Kamsky,Gata"]
[Black "Karpov,Anatoly"]
[Result "0-1"]
[Eco "B14"]
1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.exd5 cxd5 4.c4 Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4 7.cxd5 Nxd5 8.Bd2 Nc6 9.Bd3 Be7 10.0-0 0-0 11.Qe2 Nf6 12.Ne4 Qb6 13.a3 Bd7 14.Rfd1 Rad8 15.Nxf6+ Bxf6 16.Qe4 g6
17.Be3 Ne7 18.Ne5 Nf5 19.Nc4 Qa6 20.a4 Bc6 21.Qf4 Bd5 22.Ne5 Qb6 23.Bxf5 exf5 24.Rd2 Bg7 25.h4 Rfe8 26.Qg3 Rc8 27.Nd7 Qc6 28.Nc5 b6 29.Nd3 Qd7 30.a5 Re4 31.Nf4 b5 32.Rdd1 Bc4 33.Rac1 h6 34.Rc3 b4 35.Rc2 Rc6 36.Rdc1 Bb5 37.Kh2 Kh7 38.Rxc6 Bxc6 39.Rc4 Bf8 40.Nd3 Qe6 41.d5 Bxd5 42.Rxe4 Bxe4 43.Bxa7 Bd6 44.Nf4 Qe5 45.Nh3 Qe7 0-1

In Starting Out: The Caro-Kann, Joe Gallagher claims that White would have been better with 14 Be3 Nd5 15 b4 with Rfc1 and Nc5 to follow...
  

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John Simmons(Guest)
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Re: Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
Reply #1 - 05/10/06 at 09:38:08
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Hello,

  I can end up playing this line by transpostion too. Was browsing the book on Nadjorf games, and came across this game.

[Event "Varna ol (Men) fin-A"]
[Site "Varna"]
[Date "1962.09.16"]
[Round "3"]
[White "Najdorf,Miguel"]
[Black "Portisch,Lajos"]
[Result "1-0"]
[Eco "B14"]
1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Nf3 c5 5.cxd5 Nxd5 6.e3 cxd4 7.exd4 Bb4 8.Qc2 Nc6
9.Bd3 Nxc3 10.bxc3 Nxd4 11.Nxd4 Qxd4 12.Bb5+ Ke7 13.0-0 Qxc3 14.Qe2 Bd6 15.Bb2 Qa5 16.Rfd1 Rd8
17.Qh5 f6 18.Qxh7 Kf7 19.Be2 Qg5 20.Bc1 Bxh2+ 21.Kxh2 Qe5+ 22.f4  1-0

This line is still topical, played in a recent Dreev  game. Think 8Qc2 is probably more dangerous than 8Bd2, which can lead to standard IQP positions where Bd2 not well placed. The line is recommended in Sam Collins book "Attacking Rep for white" too, so will check it out further later.

Bye John S
  
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Panov: 4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4
05/10/06 at 01:53:25
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I'm interested in hearing everyone's thoughts on:

1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.exd5 cxd5 4.c4 Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.Nf3 Bb4

I'm usually entering this line as Black from an 'anti-Benoni' move order, so I'm not particularly interested in earlier deviations, and it seems like this is often mentioned but never really analyzed in other threads here.

I don't have much to say about this at the moment, but I will soon, and I figured that this would at least start to collect the relevant opinions in one place.
  
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