Dinomike100 wrote on 08/23/06 at 05:15:33:
That is an interesting line. I've tried the Botvinnik setup or something similar several times, although it was somewhat randomly (i.e. black didn't fianchetto his KB). I think the positions I got were about equal, but I liked the general style of play that resulted. So do you think that the Botvinnik setup is significantly less effective if black doesn't fianchetto his KB?
Also, I looked into the English defense a little (though I can't find much on it). I don't know if there is a good way to avoid a mainline d4 opening like the queen's indian or nimzo indian if black plays the English defense. Do you think maybe playing in Nimzo-Larsen style is a good idea, i.e:
1. c4 b6 2. b3
As to the first, I'd say perhaps generally yes, though it depends. Of course Black can play something like 1. c4 c6 or 1...e6 and 2...d5, which rules out the Botvinnik system in the first place. Another line/position that comes to mind is 1. c4 c5 2. Nc3 Nf6 3. g3 Nc6 4. Bg2 e6 5. e4 (White should have chances for an edge with 5. Nf3) and now 5...d5 is a good pawn offer. One line that comes to mind without ...g6, but where playing for the Botvinnik is respectable for White, is 1. c4 e5 2. Nc3 Nf6 3. g3 Bb4 4. Bg2 0-0 5. e4. White basically wants to get kingside play with a later f4. Black should probably take on c3 immediately (before the knight arrives on e2), and if 6. bc (6. dc is also possible; then Black can hardly play for ...c6 and ...d5, but f4 will be iffy for White without the possibility of d3 to protect his e-pawn) c6. Now after something like 7. Ne2 d5 8. cd cd 9. ed Nxd5 the position is opening up, which should perhaps favour White's bishops, but White's structure is slightly iffy (even after he plays d4) and Black's position active and solid. More interesting, I think, is for White to try to cross Black's plans (starting on move 7) with moves like Qb3 and Ba3. Black should still be able to get a knight to c5, with the idea of enforcing ...d5. In the meantime White could try to play Ne2, 0-0 and f4.
On 1. c4 b6 2. b3 is certainly feasible, and could lead to a very strategic double-fianchetto line (there's a chapter on that in Mednis's book "From the Opening to the Endgame," which was the subject of discussion in another thread). On the other hand, I suppose somebody might end up taking on f3/f6. Compare with the game below, where Bxf6 is part of White's plan to control d5 (in connection with the fact that Black has played ...c5).
[Event "San Antonio"]
[Site ""]
[Date "1972.??.??"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Karpov, Anatoly Evgenievich"]
[Black "Browne, Walter Shawn"]
[Result "1-0"]
[NIC "EO 49.2"]
[ECO "A30"]
[PlyCount "117"]
1. c4 c5 2. b3 Nf6 3. Bb2 g6 4. Bxf6 exf6 5. Nc3 Bg7 6. g3 Nc6 7. Bg2 f5 8. e3 O-O
9. Nge2 a6 10. Rc1 b5 11. d3 Bb7 12. O-O d6 13. Qd2 Qa5 14. Rfd1 Rab8 15. Nd5 Qxd2
16. Rxd2 b4 17. d4 Rfd8 18. Rcd1 cxd4 19. exd4 Kf8 20. c5 Na7 21. Ne3 Bxg2 22. Kxg2
dxc5 23. dxc5 Rxd2 24. Rxd2 Rc8 25. Nd5 Rxc5 26. Nxb4 a5 27. Nd5 Rc6 28. Ne3 Rc5
29. Nf4 Bh6 30. Rd5 Rxd5 31. Nfxd5 Bxe3 32. Nxe3 Ke7 33. Nc4 Nc6 34. Kf3 Ke6 35.
Ke3 Kd5 36. a3 Ke6 37. Kd3 Kd5 38. f3 h6 39. Kc3 h5 40. Kd3 f6 41. f4 g5 42. Ne3
Ke6 43. h4 gxh4 44. gxh4 Ne7 45. Kc4 Ng6 46. Ng2 Kd6 47. Kb5 Kd5 48. Kxa5 Ke4 49.
b4 Kf3 50. b5 Kxg2 51. b6 Nf8 52. Kb5 Nd7 53. a4 Nxb6 54. Kxb6 Kf3 55. a5 Kxf4 56.
a6 Ke3 57. a7 f4 58. a8Q f3 59. Qe8 1-0