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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Tartakower Defense (Read 10803 times)
Pingudon
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #11 - 10/13/06 at 02:36:02
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Humm... so according to what has been written The Tartakower is solid, a very good choice for black, very deep strategic problems involved... but very few people are playing it right now. It seems Nimzo/queen indian, slav/semislav are the fashion. My question is... is it only fashion or Bf4 and exchange variations had taking all the fun fron the Tartakower? Has it been  analized to death and white is all the time  plus-over- equals? Undecided
  
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Markovich
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #10 - 09/25/06 at 17:32:49
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Dji wrote on 09/20/06 at 18:14:36:
  The name of the georgian GM is Lasha Janjgava and the book
   The Queen's gambit and Catalan for black.
                     Ecxellent book!


I agree that it's a good book.  It gives a complete, rather detailed repertoire for Black.  It is sometimes a bit glib in its persistent claim that Black is OK, but that's a characteristic of many repertoire books.
  

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ErictheRed
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #9 - 09/21/06 at 15:36:36
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Speaking of 5.Bf4, I'd recommend looking into the immediate 5...dxc4, which Colin Crouch recommended in his excellent book on the 5.Bf4 QGD.  I'm not sure if it's any better than the other lines, but for some reason it's almost never played and I think some independent research would pay off.  That's what I'd play, at least.  I don't think the Bishop really belongs on f4 in these lines, though there are very few games so it's hard to say.

Just a quick glance:
1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Nf3 Be7 5.Bf4 dxc4 6.e3 Nd5! looks OK for Black.  So,

1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Nf3 Be7 5.Bf4 dxc4 6.e4 is probably better, but then Black could try something like 6...a6 7.Bxc4 b5 8.Bd3 Bb7, with interesting play.  Notice that the Bishop on f4 isn't exactly ideally placed (an e4-e5 push will allow ...Nd5 with tempo), though I'm sure White can't be worse.  Also note that after 6...a6 7.a4 Black has 7...Bb4!

Conclusion: 5...dxc4 is definitely worth more investigation!




  
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ANDREW BRETT
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #8 - 09/21/06 at 11:41:29
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Buzz,

The tartakower is fundamentally a sound line where White has not found it easy to prove an edge over the years. I'd recommend that you take a serious look at how to combat 5 Bf4 since this is the move of the moment.

Andrew
  
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #7 - 09/21/06 at 09:53:46
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Buzz all of thise lines are still relevant today - the Tartakower is not as subject to dramatic twists and turns as other openings are, which depending on your tastes may be a good thing. Of course there are new moves and games in all of these lines, but I imagine if you are starting out that book may still be worthwhile (especially if it has some good analysis or ideas to present - do you like the book?). If so you could get by by studying this book and then cross-referencing each chapter with the games of 2600+ GM´s like Vaganian, Lputian etc. from a database. That should be enough to get you playing it - try a few blitz games on the Internet to get a feel for it and you should be ready to go. As always with openings it is a question of style and taste, so you will soon find out if this is the opening for you...
  
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Buzz
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #6 - 09/20/06 at 18:44:22
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The book gives pretty good coverage to several lines along with a collection of illustrative games. I'M wondering which lines are still relevant today given this work was published back in '83.  The lines covered are as follows:

1 d4 d5 2 c4 e6 3 Nc3 Nf6 4 Bg5 Be7 5 e3 0-0 6Nf3 h6 7 Bh4 b6

chapter 1

A) 8...Nxd5 9 Bxe7 Qxe7

a) 10 Nxd5 exd5
  a1) 11 Rc1 Be6 12 Qa4 c5 13 Qa3 Rc8 14 Be2
   a11) 14...Kf8
    a12)14...Qf8
    a13)14...Qb7
    a14)14...a5
   a2) 11 Be2
   a3) 11 Bd3
  b)10 Rc1
B) 8...exd5

chapter 2
8 Qc2 Bb7 9 Bxf6 Bxf6 10 cxd5 exd5 11 0-0
A 11...c5
  a) 12 g4
  b) 12 dxc5
B 11...Nd7
  a) 12 g4
  b)12 h4
C 11...Bc8
D 11...Nc6
a)12 Kb1
b) 12 a3
c) 12 h4
E 11...Qd6

chapter 3
8 Qb3 Bb7 9 Bxf6 Bxf6 10 cxd5 exd5 11 Rd1

A 11...c6
B 11...Re8

chapter 4
8 Rc1 Bb7

A 9 Be2 Nbd7 10 cxd5 exd5 11 0-0 c5
a) 12 Qc2 Rc8 13 Rfd1 Ne4 14 Bxe7 Qxe7
  a1) 15 dxc5
  a2) 15 Qa4
b) 12 Bb5 Rc8 13 dxc5 bxc5 14 Re1! Nb6 15 Qe2 Ne4 16 Nxe4 dxe4 17 Bxe7 Qxe7 18 Nd2
   b1) 18...Bd5
   b2) 18...Rfd8
  c) 12 dxc5 bxc5 13 Qa4
B 9 Bd3 Nbd7
C 9 Bxf6 Bxf6 10 cxd5 exd5 11 b4
a) 11...c6
  a1 12 Be2
  a2 12 Bd3
  b) 11...c5

chapter 5
8 Be2

A 8...Bb7 9 Bxf6 Bxf6 10 cxd5 exd5 11 0-0
a) 11...Qe7 12 Qb3
  a1) 12...c6
  a2) 12...Rd8
b) 11...Re8
  b1 12 Qb3
  b2 12 b4
  b3 12 Rc1
c) 11...Qd6
d) 11...c5
e) 11...Nd7
f) 11...Nc6
g) 11...c6
B 8...Nbd7 9 cxd5

Chapter 6
8Bd3

Chapter 7
8 Bxf6 Bxf6 9 cxd5 exd5

Chapter 8
1 d4 d5 2 c4 e6 3 Nc3 Nf6 4 Bg5 Be7 5 Nf3 0-0 6 Rc1 h6 7 Bh4 b6

A 8 Bxf6 Bxf6 9 cxd5 exd5 10 g3
B 8 cxd5 Nxd5 9 Nxd5 exd5 10 Bxe7 Qxe7 11 g3
a) 11...Re8 12 Bg2 Ba6 13Ne5 Nd7!
  a1 14 Rxc7 Rac8!
  a2 14 f4! Nxe5 15 dxe5
b) 11...Be6 12 Bg2 c5 13 Ne5!
c) 11...Ba6 12 e3! c5 13 dxc5
d) 11...Bf5 12 Bg2 Be4 13 0-0
e) 11...Bb7 12 Bg2 c5 13 0-0

Chapter 9
1 d4 d5 2 c4 e6 3 Nc3 Nf6 4 Bg5 Be7 5 e3 0-0 6 Rc1 h6 7 Bh4 b6

A 8 Bxf6 Bxf6 9 cxd5 exd5 10 Qf3
B 8 cxd5 Nxd5 9 Nxd5 exd5 10 Bxe76 Qxe7
a) 11 Ne2
b) 11 Be2
c) 11 Qc2


  
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Dji
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #5 - 09/20/06 at 18:14:36
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  The name of the georgian GM is Lasha Janjgava and the book
   The Queen's gambit and Catalan for black.
                     Ecxellent book!
  

Eternity it's very long especially towards the end!
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Markovich
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #4 - 09/20/06 at 13:06:04
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Buzz wrote on 09/20/06 at 04:40:26:
I was at a used book shop and came across a work by a J. Konikowski entitled Queens Gambit Tartakower System. A rather old work but I picked it up since this defense has always intrigued me. I'M rather shocked to see that works geared towards this defense are sparse! What gives? I'M considering on taking up this defense and I'M just wondering where the Tartakower stands in modern practice? Are there any works one can steer me toward that deal with the Tartakower in modern practice?


I think this is a perfectly sound defense.  You have to know how to play with the hanging c- and d-pawns, however. 


  

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Keano
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #3 - 09/20/06 at 11:42:43
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Check games from the Armenian group of GM´s Vaganian, Lputian, etc. Also old games from Geller who eventually gave up his Kings Indian to play Tartakower.
My own opinion is that it is a very rich system and will reward anybody who studies it in-depth.
What is that old book you found like? Modern books you need to look at are Lalics book on QGD with Bg5. and also one by that Georgian GM who I can never pronounce his name never mind write it.

John - I agree the Bf4 stuff the way it play it now with the boring exchange line (rather than the exciting Kasparov line that seems now to be analysed to a draw by force!) is something prospective Black players have to be ready for
  
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #2 - 09/20/06 at 11:41:29
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One might say actually that it was White who was out of ideas against the Tartakover at highest levels. Kramnik played the Orthodox QGD in Brissago, and two players (Morozevich being one, maybe Kasimdzhanov the other) played it against Topalov in San Luis, and in each case White replied 5 Bf4. To be sure the QID is more popular, but I’d bet we see more QGDs than QIDs in Elista, albeit I’d bet against Bg5.
  
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Re: Tartakower Defense
Reply #1 - 09/20/06 at 05:13:06
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The TMB is considered rather too dry for modern tastes.  It's still played, but very rarely at the highest levels.  Right now, it seems that the Orthodox defense for Black is now the QID.
  
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Tartakower Defense
09/20/06 at 04:40:26
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I was at a used book shop and came across a work by a J. Konikowski entitled Queens Gambit Tartakower System. A rather old work but I picked it up since this defense has always intrigued me. I'M rather shocked to see that works geared towards this defense are sparse! What gives? I'M considering on taking up this defense and I'M just wondering where the Tartakower stands in modern practice? Are there any works one can steer me toward that deal with the Tartakower in modern practice?
  
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