(3025) Estimo,S - Balinas,R [C58]
Manila Manila, 1968
[Gligoric,S]
5/244  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3 [8.Be2] 8...cxb5!? [8...Qc7] 9.Qxa8 h6 N [9...Bc5 10.0–0 0–0 11.b4 Bxb4 12.Nc3!] 10.Ne4 Nd5 11.Qb8 Nc6!µ 12.Qxb5 Ndb4 13.Na3 [13.Qa4 Bd7] 13...Ba6 14.Qa4 Qd4!–+ 15.Nc3 [15.d3? Nxd3+] 15...Bc5 16.d3 Qxf2+ 17.Kd1 0–0 18.Re1 Qxg2 19.Bd2 Bf2 20.Ne2 Bxe1 21.Bxe1 Bc8! 22.Bxb4 Bg4 23.Kd2 Qxe2+ 24.Kc3 Rc8 25.Nc4 Nd4 26.Be7 Be6 0–1

(13390) Taruffi,D - Rajna,Gy [C58]
Espana, 1974
[Keres,P]
19/(235)  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 * 5...Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3 h6 9.Ne4 Nd5 N 10.Be2?! [10.Nbc3!?] 10...Be7 11.Qg3 0–0 12.d3 Bh4µ Line

(22310) Van der Wiel,J - Gligoric,S [C58]
Baden Baden, 1980
[Parma,B]
30/256  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3 Qc7 [8...Rb8 - 30/(256)] 9.Bd3 h6 [9...Bd6 - 30/(256)] 10.Ne4 Nd5 11.Nbc3 [11.Ng3 g6!²] 11...Nb4?! [11...Nf4 12.Bf1 f5²] 12.Ng3 Nxd3+ 13.Qxd3 Nb7 14.0–0 Bc5 15.Nce4 Be7 16.Qf3² Qd7 17.Qh5 Qe6 18.d3 0–0 19.f4 f5 20.Nc3 Bd6 21.Kh1 Bd7 22.fxe5 Bxe5 23.Bf4 Bxf4 24.Rxf4 Nd6 25.Raf1 c5 26.R4f2 c4 27.Re2 Qf7 28.Qxf7+ Rxf7 29.dxc4 Nxc4 30.b3 Nb6 31.Rd2 Re8 32.a4?! [32.Kg1!?] 32...Re5 33.Nge2 g5 34.Nd4 Rfe7 35.Kg1 f4© 36.h3 Kg7 37.Rd3 Be8 38.Nf3 Rc5 39.b4 Rc4 40.Nd2 Rc8 [40...Rxb4? 41.a5 … ¤d5] 41.a5 Bg6 42.Rdf3 Nc4 43.Nxc4 Rxc4 44.g3 fxg3 [44...Bh5÷; 44...Re3!?] 45.Rxg3 Rec7? [45...Bxc2÷] 46.Nb5 Rd7 47.c3 Re4 48.Nd4+- a6 49.Kh2 Re5 50.Rf2 Re1 51.Rg1 Re3 [51...Re5] 52.h4! Rxc3 53.Ne6+ Kg8 54.hxg5 Rdd3 55.Nf4 Rd6 56.gxh6 Kh7 57.Nxg6 Rxg6 58.Rxg6 Kxg6 59.Rf4 Rc6 60.Rh4 Kh7 61.Kg3 Rf6 62.Kg4 1–0

(22852) Van der Wiel,J - Torre,E [C58]
Sochi Sochi, 1980
[Parma,B]
30/(256)  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3 * 8...Rb8 9.Bd3 h6 10.Ne4 Nd5 11.b3?! g6 12.Qg3 Bg7 13.Ba3 Nb4 14.Ke2? 0–0 15.c3 Bg4+!–+ Line

(22853) Van der Wiel,J - Beliavsky,A [C58]
Baden Baden, 1980
30/(256)  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3 Qc7 9.Bd3 * 9...Bd6 10.Nc3 Bg4 11.Nb5 Bxf3 12.Nxc7+ Bxc7 13.gxf3 Nd5 14.h4 h6 15.Nh3 0–0 16.b3 Rad8 17.Ba3 Bd6 18.Bxd6 Rxd6 19.a3 ½–½

(24402) Van der Wiel,J - Timman,J [C58]
Nederland (ch), 1981
[Van der Wiel,J]
32/420  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3!? Rb8 [8...Be7!? 9.Bd3 0–0 10.Nc3 h6 11.Nge4 Nd5 12.Ng3 g6©] 9.Bd3 h6 10.Ne4 Nd5 11.b3! g6 12.Qg3 Nf4 13.Bb2 Bg7 14.Ba3 [14.Qxf4?! exf4 15.Bxg7 Kd7! … f5µ] 14...Nb7 15.Nbc3?! [15.Ba6 c5 16.f3!²] 15...f5 16.Ne2 g5? [16...fxe4 17.Nxf4 Qg5 18.Nxg6 exd3 19.Nxh8 Bf5! 20.cxd3 Bxh8 21.Rc1÷; 16...Nxd3+! 17.cxd3 Kf7³] 17.Nxf4 exf4 18.Qf3 Qa5!? [18...Bxa1?? 19.Qh5++-; 18...Be6 19.Nc3±] 19.Nd6+ [19.Qh5+? Kd8 20.Qf7 Qe5!] 19...Nxd6 20.Qxc6+! [20.Bxd6 Kd7! 21.Bxb8 Re8+÷] 20...Kf7 21.Bxd6 Re8+ 22.Kd1 Bxa1 23.Bc4+? [23.Bxb8 Qxa2 24.Bc4+ Be6 25.Qd7+ Re7 26.Bxe6+ Kf6 27.Qd8! Qb1+ 28.Ke2 Qxh1 29.Bd6+-] 23...Be6 24.Re1? [24.Bxb8 Bxc4 25.Qxc4+ Kf6 26.Qc6+! Re6 27.Qa4±] 24...Bxc4! ™ 25.Qxc4+ [25.Qd7+? Kg6! 26.Rxe8 Rxe8 27.Qxe8+ Bf7–+] 25...Kg6 26.Bxb8 Rxb8 27.c3 Qxa2! 28.Re6+! [28.Qe6+? Kh5 29.Qf7+ Kh4] 28...Kh5 29.Rxh6+ ½–½

(93171) Van der Wiel,J (2490) - Ernst,S (2520) [C58]
Groningen Groningen, 2004
[Van der Wiel,J]
92/319  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3 Rb8?! [8...Be7; 8...Bg4!?] 9.Bd3 h6 10.Ne4 Nd5 11.b3 g6 12.Qg3 [12.0–0 f5 13.Re1 Bg7 (13...fxe4 14.Qxe4‚) 14.Ba3 fxe4 15.Bxe4 Be6! 16.Bxg6+ Kd7÷; 12.Bb2!?] 12...Bg7 13.Bb2 [13.Ba3?! Nb4©] 13...Nf4 [13...0–0?! 14.Bxe5 Bxe5 15.Qxe5 Bf5 16.0–0 Re8 17.Qd4 Bxe4 (17...Rb4 18.c4 Nf4 19.Nf6+) 18.Bxe4 Nb4 19.Qxd8 Rbxd8 20.a3!+-; 13...Qc7 14.Ba3! Bf8 (14...Nb4 15.c3) 15.0–0±] 14.Qxf4! [14.Ba3?! - 32/420] 14...exf4 15.Bxg7 Kd7 [15...Rg8 16.Nf6+ Ke7 17.Nxg8+ Qxg8 18.Be5±; 15...Rf8 16.Nf6+ Ke7 17.Nh7! Re8 18.0–0 Qb6 19.Bxh6±; 15...f5 16.Bxh8 fxe4 17.Bxe4 Qe7 18.Nc3±] 16.Bf6!± [16.Bxh8? Qxh8„] 16...Qe8N [16...Qf8 17.Nbc3] 17.0–0 [17.Kd1!?] 17...Kc7 18.Re1 Bf5 [18...Be6? 19.Be5+ Kb6 20.Nbc3‚ …Rd8 21.b4+-] 19.Na3! [19.Nbc3? Qe6! 20.Bg7 Rbe8 21.Bxh8 Rxh8 22.Ng3 Qf6 23.Nxf5 gxf5²; 19.Bc3 Nb7 20.Na3 Rd8±] 19...Qe6?! [19...Rd8?! 20.Nc5+-; 19...Nb7!? 20.Nc4 Rd8!±] 20.Bc3 Qd5 [20...Nb7 21.Nf6+- … ¥e5] 21.Nc4+- [… ¥e5] 21...Nxc4 22.bxc4! [22.Bxc4?! Qxe4±] 22...Qd8?! [22...Qd7?! 23.Be5+; 22...Qe6™ 23.Nc5! (23.Nf6?! Qc8 24.Re7+ Kd6! 25.Bxf5 gxf5 26.Rd7+ Qxd7 27.c5+ Ke7 28.Nxd7 Kxd7 29.Bxh8 Rxh8 30.Rb1±) 23...Qc8 24.Be5+ (24.Bxh8!?) 24...Kb6 25.Bd6! Ka5 26.Reb1!] 23.Ba5+ [23.Ba5+ Rb6 24.c5]  1–0

(95760) Van der Wiel,J (2500) - Van Leent,D (2305) [C58]
Hoogeveen (open) Hoogeveen, 2005
[Van der Wiel,J]
95/231  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3 h6 9.Ne4 Nd5 10.Ba4!? [10.Be2 Ü 19/(235); 10.Nbc3 cxb5 11.Nxd5 Bb7 12.Ne3 Qd7© (12...Qd4?! 13.d3 Bb4+ 14.Ke2!²) ] 10...Be7 [10...g6 11.Nbc3; 10...Nb6!?] 11.d3 [11.Nbc3?! 0–0 12.Bxc6 Nxc6 13.Nxd5 Nd4 14.Nxe7+ Qxe7© …15.Qd1 (15.Qd3? Ba6) 15...Bb7] 11...0–0 12.0–0 f5 13.Ng3!?N Be6 [13...f4 (… g5ƒ») 14.Ne4 Bf5 (14...g5 15.Qh5) 15.Nbc3 Nb6 16.Re1²] 14.Bd2 [14.Re1 Nb6 (14...Bd6!?) 15.Bb3² (15.Rxe5?! Bd5÷) ] 14...Rb8 [14...Qb6 15.Nc3 (15.Bxa5!?) 15...Qxb2 16.Nxd5! Bxd5 17.Qh5± פa5, f5; 14...Qc7!? … ¤b7] 15.Re1! [15.Bb3 Nxb3 16.axb3 Qd7÷ … f4] 15...Bd6 [15...Bf6 16.Nh5] 16.Na3² Nb4 [16...Rxb2 17.Bxa5 Qxa5 18.Nc4 Qxa4 19.Nxb2 (19.Nxd6!?) 19...Qxc2 20.Nc4 e4 21.Qd1!±] 17.c3 Nd5 18.b4 Qh4! 19.Qh5 [19.Nc2? f4 20.Qh5 Qxh5 21.Nxh5µ Ü 21.¤c2] 19...Qxh5 20.Nxh5 f4! [פh5] 21.bxa5 [21.Nc2? Nb6! (21...Bg4 22.bxa5 Bxh5 23.Bxc6 Ne7 24.Ba4 Bg6 25.Nb4!±) 22.Nxf4 Bf5 23.bxa5 Nxa4µ פc2, ¥d2; 21.Nc4 Nxc4 22.dxc4 Nb6 23.c5! Nxa4 24.cxd6 Bg4 25.Rxe5 g5!÷] 21...Bxa3 22.Rxe5 Bb2 [22...Bf7 23.Bxc6! a) 23.Bb3? Bd6! 24.Rf5 g6 25.Nf6+ Kg7³; b) 23.Nxf4!? Bb2 (23...Nxf4 24.Bxf4 Bb2 25.Rf1±; 23...Rb2 24.Bc1 Nxf4 25.Bxf4±) 24.Nxd5! Bxa1 25.Bxc6²; 23...Bb2 24.Rae1 Nxc3 25.Rc5± (25.Nxf4? Nb1?³) ] 23.Rae1 Bxc3 [23...Bf7 24.Bxc6!± Ü 22...¥f7] 24.Bxc3 Nxc3 25.Rxe6 Nxa4 26.Re7ƒ Rf7 [26...Rb5 27.Nxg7 Rf7 28.Rxf7 Kxf7 29.Ne6±] 27.Rxf7 Kxf7 28.Nxf4 Rb2“ [28...Rb5!?] 29.h4 Rxa2 30.Rb1 Nb2? [30...Rb2! 31.Rxb2 (31.Rc1 c5²) 31...Nxb2 32.Kf1 g5 33.hxg5 hxg5 34.Nh3 Kf6²] 31.d4 [¹31.h5±] 31...g5! 32.hxg5 hxg5 33.Nh3 Kf6 34.Rc1 Rxa5 35.Rxc6+ Kf5 36.f3 Nd3?? [36...g4™ 37.fxg4+ Kxg4 38.Rg6+ Kh4 39.Kf2! (39.Nf4?! Rg5 40.d5 Nc4 41.d6 Nb6²) 39...Ra3 (39...Rf5+ 40.Ke3 Nc4+ 41.Ke4 Rf8 42.d5±) 40.d5!±] 37.g4# # 1–0

(95761) Shanava,K (2490) - Gaprindashvili,V (2440) [C58]
Baku Baku, 2005
[RR]
95/(231)  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3 h6 9.Ne4 Nd5 10.Ba4!? Be7 11.d3 0–0 12.0–0 f5 * 13.Nec3 Be6!?N [13...Bb7; 13...Kh7!?; 13...Nb6!? …14.Bxc6? e4 Van der Wiel,J] 14.Re1 Bf6 15.Bb3 Nxb3 16.axb3 Nb4 17.Na3 Re8© ©

(98502) Short,N (2676) - Hebden,M (2532) [C00]
Liverpool Liverpool, 2006
[Short,N]
Inf 98/236 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 d5 5.exd5 Na5 6.Bb5+ c6 7.dxc6 bxc6 8.Qf3 h6 9.Ne4 Nd5 10.Ba4 Be7 11.d3 0–0 12.0–0 f5 13.Ng3 Be6 14.Re1!?N [14.Bd2 — 95/231] 14...Bd6 [14...Nb6 15.Bb3 Nxb3 16.axb3 Bd6 17.Nd2±; 14...Qd7!? 15.Nd2!? a) a) 15.Rxe5 Bf6 16.Re1 (16.Rxf5 Bd4!µ) 16...f4 17.Ne4 Bg4 18.Nc5 (18.Nxf6+? Rxf6 19.Qe4 Re6–+) 18...Qf5 19.Qe4 Qh5‚; b) b) 15.c4 Nb6 (15...Nb4? 16.Rxe5 f4 17.Ne4± …Bg4? 18.Rxe7+-) 16.Bd1 Rad8 17.Nc3 f4 18.Nge4 Qxd3 19.Qxd3 Rxd3 20.b3²; ] 15.c4 [15.Bd2²] 15...Ne7 16.Bd2 c5 17.Nc3 a6 [17...e4 18.dxe4! Bxg3 19.Qxg3 Qxd2 20.Qe5! Rf6 21.Qxc5 Nxc4 22.Qxe7 Nxb2 23.Bc6+-] 18.Nd5 [¹18.Nh5 Ng6 (18...f4 19.Nxf4) 19.Qh3 (… ¤g7) 19...Rf7 20.Rad1±] 18...Nac6 19.Bxc6?! [19.Nh5! e4 (a) 19...Nd4 20.Qg3 Rf7 21.Be8!!+- (*) 21.Bxh6? Nxd5 22.cxd5 (22.Bxg7 Kh7!) 22...f4µ) ) 20.Qh3 (20.dxe4 Nd4 21.Qd3 fxe4 22.Qxe4 Nxd5 23.cxd5 Bf5 24.Qe3 Bg4 25.Ng3 Bf4 26.Qd3 Bxd2 27.Qxd2 Qxd5 28.Qc3!±) 20...Nd4 21.Nxg7 Kxg7 22.Bxh6+ Kg8 23.Qh5 Rf7 24.dxe4±] 19...Nxc6 20.Bc3² Qe8 21.h3 [21.Ne2 f4!; 21.Re2!?] 21...Rd8 22.Re2 Bb8 23.Rae1 a5 24.a3 [24.Nh5 Qf7 25.Ne7+!? Nxe7 26.Bxe5 Bxe5 27.Rxe5 Rd6! 28.Rxc5÷ (28.Nf4 Nc6! …29.Rxe6 Nd4³) ] 24...Nd4 25.Bxd4 cxd4 26.Nb6 [26.Rxe5 Bxe5 27.Rxe5 Bxd5 28.Rxd5 f4 29.Rxd8 (29.Nf5 Rxd5 30.Qxd5+ Kh7 31.Nxd4 Qe1+ 32.Kh2 Qxf2„) 29...Qe1+! (29...Qxd8 30.Ne2 a4²) 30.Nf1 Rxd8 31.Qxf4 Qb1„] 26...e4 27.dxe4 [27.Nxe4!? fxe4 28.Qxe4 Bd7™ (28...Bf7? 29.Qb7+-) 29.Qxd4 Qf7 30.Re7 Rde8! (30...Bf5 31.Nd5 Qg6 32.Rb7 Kh8 33.Ree7²) 31.Rxe8 (31.Nd5 Bd6!) 31...Rxe8 (31...Bxe8 32.Nd5 Kh7 33.b4±) 32.Rxe8+ Qxe8 33.Kf1 Bc6 34.b4 axb4 35.axb4 Qh5!„] 27...f4 28.Nf1 Qc6 29.Nd5 Qxc4 30.Nd2 [30.Ne7+! Kh7 (30...Kf7 31.Nf5 d3 32.Rd2) 31.Nd2 Qc5 32.Nd5 Bxd5 33.exd5 Qxd5 34.Qd3+ Qf5 35.Re4²] 30...Qb5 31.Qb3 Qxb3 32.Nxb3 Bxd5 33.exd5 Rxd5 34.Rd2 Be5 35.Nc1 a4? [× a4] [35...Rc8! 36.Nd3 Bd6 37.Kf1 Kf7÷] 36.Nd3 Bd6 37.Rc2² f3 [37...g5! 38.Rc4 Ra8 39.Re4 Bf8!² …40.Rexd4 Rxd4 41.Rxd4 Bg7„] 38.g3 h5? [38...Rb8] 39.Rc4± h4 40.g4 Ra5 41.Rxd4 [¹41.Re4] 41...Rf6 42.Ree4 Bc7 43.Kf1! Rc6 [43...Bb6 44.Rd7!± (44.Rxa4? Rxa4 45.Rxa4 Rd6 46.Ne1 Rd2–+) ] 44.Rxa4 Rxa4 45.Rxa4 Rd6 46.Ne1 Rd1 47.Re4+- Rb1 48.Re8+ [48.b4!?] 48...Kh7 [48...Kf7 49.Re3] 49.Rf8 Bd6 50.Rxf3 Rxb2 51.Rc3! Be5 [51...Ra2 52.Nc2 Kg8 53.Kg2 Kf7 54.Kf3] 52.Rd3 Bb8 53.Nf3 Ba7 54.Rd2 Rb3 55.Kg2 Rxa3 56.Nxh4 Bb8 57.Nf3 Bf4 58.Rd4 g5?! 59.h4 1–0

LeeRoth wrote on 08/09/08 at 21:57:10:


Oops, sorry! I thought Davies recommended 8...Rb8 but you are right, it is 8...h6.

Quote:


Actually, he doesn't.  He recommends 8..h6, which he says seems like the most reliable continuation.

Nigel Davies recommends 8...Rb8 in his book, Play 1 e4 e5!

what line of rb8 would you like us to be discussing?

why play 2 knights when you can play 3... Bc5!!    seriously though, wasn't Qf3 a favorite of Morphy? 

i know Ng5 was not popular was popular for a while because Black can have initiative and had to defend a lot.  but if Short revives Ng5 with Qf3 we will probaly see this a lot more and less 4. d4 or 4. O-O  i doubt that the 2 knights will be refuted, it looks too sound to  be refuted.

trw wrote on 06/10/08 at 01:25:32:



I like Rb8 as well, but I believe it inferior to Be7.


So, is Qf3 really !? or ?!
or just a chess move?

I personally have always liked Rb8 but I play cxb5 in blitz sometimes Be7 is definitely playable but I have always regarded 8.... h6 as awful and perhaps Short's comment is not out of place in response to 8... h6