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Normal Topic Colle-Z Main line bust? Not according to Fritz! (Read 4370 times)
MarinFan
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Re: Colle-Z Main line bust? Not according to Fritz
Reply #4 - 03/14/07 at 13:16:20
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Hello,

I don't trust this Qe7-Qc7 idea, Capablanca's p*p followed by Ba3 looks a lot more natural to me. Maybe if black wants an interesting game, or looking for trouble depending on point of view, could try 
Lasker's 9... Rd8 followed by Bd7-e8 and f6, after Nd7-f8 worth  a try. 
                     This is all motivated because Anand lost a game after 8... b6? This line is covered in the "Winning against 1d4" book, based around QGA.  Sometimes more difficult lines than strictly necessary where choosen in this book. Think black could get an easier life with slav style lines, but suppose had to justify "winning" in title somehow.

Bye John S
  
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kylemeister
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Re: Colle-Z Main line bust? Not according to Fritz
Reply #3 - 03/13/07 at 05:49:08
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Well, I noticed that Yusupov didn't avoid the ...cd and ...Qc7 thing the other day, in the Dutch league.


[Event "Meesterklasse"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2007.03.03"]
[Round "6"]
[White "Jussupow, A."]
[Black "De Boer, S."]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "D05"]
[WhiteElo "2617"]
[BlackElo "2353"]
[PlyCount "93"]
[EventDate "2007.03.03"]
[SourceDate "2007.03.03"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 e6 3. e3 c5 4. Bd3 d5 5. b3 Nc6 6. O-O Bd6 7. Bb2 O-O 8. Nbd2
Qe7 9. Ne5 cxd4 10. exd4 Qc7 11. f4 Nb4 12. Rf3 Nxd3 13. cxd3 Qe7 14. a3 Bd7
15. Rh3 Rfd8 16. Nf1 Be8 17. Ne3 g6 18. g4 Nd7 19. g5 f5 20. gxf6 Nxf6 21. Kh1
Rac8 22. Qg1 Kh8 23. Rf1 Rc7 24. Nxg6+ Bxg6 25. Qxg6 Rg8 26. Qh6 Qd8 27. f5
Rcg7 28. fxe6 Rg6 29. Qh4 Qe7 30. Nf5 Qxe6 31. Nxd6 Qxd6 32. Bc1 Qe6 33. Re3
Qf5 34. Qe1 Qh5 35. Qe2 Ng4 36. Ref3 Re6 37. Qc2 Nxh2 38. Rf5 Qh3 39. Qxh2 Qxf5
40. Bf4 Rg4 41. Be5+ Rxe5 42. Qxe5+ Qxe5 43. dxe5 Kg7 44. Kh2 Rg5 45. d4 Rg4
46. Rg1 Rxg1 47. Kxg1 1-0
  
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dmp4373
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Re: Colle-Z Main line bust? Not according to Fritz
Reply #2 - 03/13/07 at 03:25:31
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In an earlier post on the Colle-Z, IM John Cox recommends going to a database and a search for "White-Jussupow". Well, that's what I did and here's what I found:

1) Jussupov uses the Colle-Z as an anti-Nimzo/Queen's Indian.

2)Against Black's Nc6 + Bd6 setup - 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 e6 3.e3 c5 4.Bd3 Nc6 5.0-0 d5 6.0-0 Bd6 7.Bb2 0-0 
(Here both S. Polgar and A. Summerscale give 8.Nbd2. Yussupow doesn't play that.)

8.a3 Twice, blitz + rapid scoring 0-2
8.c4 Once in a Bundesliga match scoring 1-0

Did Yussupow avoid 8.Nbd2 Qe7 9.Ne5 because he knew of 9... cxd4 10.exd4 Qc7? And more inportantly, did Polgar and Summerscale look at Yussupow's games and wonder why he avoided the main line? Since he is the strongest player in the world using that opening, you'd think so.  Undecided
  
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MNb
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Re: Colle-Z Main line bust? Not according to Fritz
Reply #1 - 03/04/07 at 20:36:10
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Black also may try 9...cxd4 10.exd4 Qc7 with the same idea. This version looks at least as annoying for White.
  

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dmp4373
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Colle-Z Main line bust? Not according to Fritz!
03/04/07 at 19:19:20
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GM Tony Kosten's article on the Colle-Z is a welcome and long overdue addition to this site. So many of us club players play it yet E. Prie really wasn't interested and admits in the Forum that even if he did do something on it, he would just be going through the motions. Keano's commit that it had "Fallen into a type of no-mans land" (on this site) is right on the money.

Kosten says he looked long and hard for something against the Colle-Z and found; 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 e6 3.e3 d5 4.Bd3 c5 5.b3 Nc6 6.Bb2 Bd6 7.0-0 0-0 8.Nbd2 Qe7 9.Ne5 Qc7!?. Well, he found it right here in the Forum, which is a remarkably rich source of information.

9.Ne5 has been the main move for some sixty years or more and now appears to be outright dubious. Fritz 10 doesn't like it either and says White can get an advantage with 9.dxc5 Bxc5 10.a3 e5 11.b4 Bd6 12.c4
a)12... dxc4 13.Nxc4 Bc7 14.Ncd2 Bg4 15.b5 Na5 +=
b)12... e4 13.Bxf6 Qxf6 14.Bxe4 dxe4 15.Nxe4 Bxh2+ +=

Whether Fritz is right or not, it seems 9.Ne5?! is out of business and the books and video's on the Colle-Z are now out of date.
  
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