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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Four knights with 4. Nxe5 (Read 3981 times)
LeeRoth
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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #10 - 04/16/07 at 18:41:36
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Larry Kaufman also gives 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Nxe5 Nxe5 5.d4 Nc6 6.d5 Bb4 7.dxc6 Nxe4 8.Qd4 Qe7.  I've heard that he attributes this line to Pinski.

The opening's cheerleaders claim that 9.Be3 gives White chances, but chances for what?  It seems to me that White is fighting for a draw in this position.

Anyway, for those interested, there are materials posted here:

http://www.chessville.com/UCO/Halloween_Gambit/Part_1.htm
http://www.chessville.com/UCO/Halloween_Gambit/Part_2.htm
http://www.chessville.com/UCO/Halloween_Gambit/UON13HalloweenGambit.pdf
  
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micawber
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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #9 - 04/16/07 at 16:30:41
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The missing link to a previous Halloween post
http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1087337781
  
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MNb
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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #8 - 04/13/07 at 20:32:13
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Which White does not mind to play anyway after 4.g3.
Exclams for being clever enough to avoid all the messy stuff.
  

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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #7 - 04/13/07 at 20:22:44
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MNb wrote on 04/13/07 at 20:07:24:
Girkassa wrote on 04/13/07 at 18:03:35:
For that reason, 4.g3 Nxe4!? (known in Norway as the "Hjortås attack") is a much better version, since after 5.Nxe4 d5 White doesn't have 6.Ng3.


Yes, except that it is irrelevant because of the transposition 4.g3 Nxe4 5.Nxe4 d5 6.Nc3! d4 7.Bg2! dxc3 8.bxc3.


I don't know that it's "irrelevant" (or that the exclams are justified), since this transposition (to a 4...d5 Glek or Smyslov variation of the Vienna) only appears to produce approximate equality.
  
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MNb
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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #6 - 04/13/07 at 20:07:24
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Girkassa wrote on 04/13/07 at 18:03:35:
For that reason, 4.g3 Nxe4!? (known in Norway as the "Hjortås attack") is a much better version, since after 5.Nxe4 d5 White doesn't have 6.Ng3.


Yes, except that it is irrelevant because of the transposition 4.g3 Nxe4 5.Nxe4 d5 6.Nc3! d4 7.Bg2! dxc3 8.bxc3.
  

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Girkassa
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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #5 - 04/13/07 at 19:42:06
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kylemeister wrote on 04/13/07 at 19:08:26:
Girkassa wrote on 04/13/07 at 18:03:35:
The Halloween is regarded dubious because of 4...Nxe5 5.d4 Ng6! 6.e5 Ng8 and while White does have some play, especially in blitz games, it's not enough for a knight. After 5...Nc6? 6.e5 Ng8 7.d5, though, White's compensation is much greater.

For that reason, 4.g3 Nxe4!? (known in Norway as the "Hjortås attack") is a much better version, since after 5.Nxe4 d5 White doesn't have 6.Ng3. I can't recall Carlsen having played that, but he has played the reversed version of the Hjortås: 4.a3 g6 5.Nxe5!?


Carlsen played 4. g3 Nxe4 against Elena Sedina at St. Vincent in 2003.

After 6...Nc6, you seem to have White's central pawn pushes in the wrong order ...

The line I recall (from the post which I think was by TopNotch) was more detailed; seems to me it involved something like Black giving back the piece and coming out a pawn up with the better position.  But I suppose it may have disappeared during the big crash a while back or the more recent "disappearing threads" episode.  


Whoops, you are right of course, 6.d5 before 7.e5.

4.a3 g6 5.Nxe5 was Carlsen-Nyysti, Helsinki 2002. So apparently he has played both versions.
  
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kylemeister
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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #4 - 04/13/07 at 19:08:26
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Girkassa wrote on 04/13/07 at 18:03:35:
The Halloween is regarded dubious because of 4...Nxe5 5.d4 Ng6! 6.e5 Ng8 and while White does have some play, especially in blitz games, it's not enough for a knight. After 5...Nc6? 6.e5 Ng8 7.d5, though, White's compensation is much greater.

For that reason, 4.g3 Nxe4!? (known in Norway as the "Hjortås attack") is a much better version, since after 5.Nxe4 d5 White doesn't have 6.Ng3. I can't recall Carlsen having played that, but he has played the reversed version of the Hjortås: 4.a3 g6 5.Nxe5!?


Carlsen played 4. g3 Nxe4 against Elena Sedina at St. Vincent in 2003.

After 6...Nc6, you seem to have White's central pawn pushes in the wrong order ...

The line I recall (from the post which I think was by TopNotch) was more detailed; seems to me it involved something like Black giving back the piece and coming out a pawn up with the better position.  But I suppose it may have disappeared during the big crash a while back or the more recent "disappearing threads" episode.
  
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Girkassa
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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #3 - 04/13/07 at 18:03:35
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The Halloween is regarded dubious because of 4...Nxe5 5.d4 Ng6! 6.e5 Ng8 and while White does have some play, especially in blitz games, it's not enough for a knight. After 5...Nc6? 6.e5 Ng8 7.d5, though, White's compensation is much greater.

For that reason, 4.g3 Nxe4!? (known in Norway as the "Hjortås attack") is a much better version, since after 5.Nxe4 d5 White doesn't have 6.Ng3. I can't recall Carlsen having played that, but he has played the reversed version of the Hjortås: 4.a3 g6 5.Nxe5!?
  
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kevinludwig
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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #2 - 04/11/07 at 22:25:45
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Actually I thought it was called the Halloween something or other. I had already tried the search "Halloween" and it turned up nothing. So I assumed I was crazy and didn't mention it. Maybe I just don't know how to use the search feature well enough. Can anyone else come up with a link for the thread in question?
  
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kylemeister
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Re: Four knights with 4. Nxe5
Reply #1 - 04/11/07 at 21:45:55
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It's usually called the Halloween Attack, as far as I know.  It has been tried (e.g. by Magnus Carlsen) in a reversed version:  1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Nc3 Nf6 4. g3 Nxe4 (maybe it's better there due to the weakening effect of g3).

I recall a post (by TopNotch, maybe) giving what was perhaps a refutation; maybe you can find it by searching for "Halloween."
  
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kevinludwig
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Four knights with 4. Nxe5
04/11/07 at 21:38:47
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I have a friend who has taken up the following in blitz games 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Nc3 Nf6 4. Nxe5. I have no idea what it's called. I couldn't find it in NCO.

Play continues 4. ...Nxe5 5. d4 Nc6 6. e5 Ng8, and then I have no idea. I've only faced it once, and so I put up some kind of feeble resistance and lost. I'm hoping to avoid a similar embarassment next time. What is the known antidote for black?

Thanks,

Kevin
  
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