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Normal Topic Nimzoeque System (Read 3506 times)
LeeRoth
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Re: Nimzoeque System
Reply #6 - 10/07/07 at 17:08:45
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After 1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4, a simple way for White is 4.cxd5 exd5 5.Bf4 Nf6 6.e3 c5 7.Bd3 Nc6 8.Nge2.

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Smyslov_Fan
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Re: Nimzoeque System
Reply #5 - 10/07/07 at 09:39:01
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err, 

scratch "consise" and read "concise" please.
  
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Smyslov_Fan
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Re: Nimzoeque System
Reply #4 - 10/07/07 at 09:38:02
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I've noticed that sometimes readers write past each other and don't really pay close attention to what others have said already.


Inn2's comments either directly or indirectly answer most of the questions that were asked in later remarks.  Thanks Inn for your consise yet systematic handling of the quetion!
  
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Deepthought
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Re: Nimzoeque System
Reply #3 - 10/07/07 at 07:46:19
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I guess this system is better than the nimzo if you want to achieve a draw,
but not for winning against white's setup. On Super GM Level you have to know if they use the opening for achieving a draw or actually want to have some winning chances with black, look at Kramnik in the Wch, he played the petroff against everyone and was satisfied with a draw ...
  
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exigentsky
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Re: Nimzoeque System
Reply #2 - 10/07/07 at 06:35:22
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I'm aware of 4. e3, but that just transposes to the d5 Nimzo, doesn't it? I even play the d5 Nimzo and don't see any real problems. Michael Adams also seems to like it too. So again, what are the problems with playing this way as compared to the Nimzo move order with 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 e6? Are there any disadvantages to not using the Nimzo move order? This seems to allow very few choices for White as anything other than c4 is pretty much guaranteed equality and systems like the Trompowsky just don't factor in. Is this simple a Nimzo with 1/10 of the theory and potential for White? I'm not asking what opening this is, only why this isn't more popular and if there is something wrong with it compared to the Nimzo/QID? Would I have any advantage in going for the Nimzo/QID when this is available?
  
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lnn2
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Re: Nimzoeque System
Reply #1 - 10/07/07 at 03:10:19
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(i)  1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nc3 Bb4 4. e3! gives White a Nimzo-Rubinstein Botvinnik-pawn-roller system. White intends Bd3, Nge2, f3 and so on.  One point is that after a3, Bxc3 White can always dissolve his doubled c-pawns with cxd5. This line is good for White (and that's why you don't see players nowadays going for 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 e6 3. Nc3 Bb4 4. e3 d5?!)
In Ward's QG book, Ward surprisingly acquisced to a transposition to the Ragozin with 4. Nf3, this is surprising because his main anti-QG weapon is the exchange with Nge2, and one would have thought 4. e3 is more thematic.

(ii) 1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 Nf6 4. Nc3 Bb4 (QGD Ragozin) 5. cxd5 (5. Qa4+ is also possible) ed5 6. Bg5 is the main line of the Ragozin, check Ruslan's ebook. 

(iii) 1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 Nf6 4. Bg5 tends to be a move-order to avoid the Ragozin, White usually intends 4... Bb4+ 5. Nbd2.

(iv) The purpose of 1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 Nf6 4. g3 Bb4+ 5. Bd2 Be7 is to avoid the main line Closed Catalan where White puts his knight directly on d2 and plays for e2-e4: e.g. 1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 Nf6 4. g3 Be7 5. Bg2 0-0 6. 0-0 c6 7. Qc2 Nbd7 8. Nbd2. White can block the check with 4. g3 Bb4+ 5. Nbd2 but 5... dxc4 is unclear and i seem to recall Markovich saying White has good practical compensation if Black tries to hold on to his pawn, there was a series of articles in NIC yearbooks on this but I've not read them closely yet.
 
The Ragozin is a respectable opening as any other. But White need not allow it, and Black seems too passive for my taste in lines (i) and (iii).
  
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exigentsky
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Nimzoeque System
10/07/07 at 02:13:37
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Is there anything wrong with this Nimzoeque system:

1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nc3 Bb4 

or if Nf3 first:

1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 Nf6 4. Nc3 Bb4 or 4. Bg5 Bb4 (or h6 first) or 4. g3 Bb4 5. Bd2 Be7 

Are there any disadvantages to playing this compared to the real Nimzo/QID combination? It's certainly less theory. Is this  objectively weaker?

BTW: I originally thought of putting it in the d4 d5 section, but I think people here will be more knowledgeable as to how it compared to the real Nimzo/QID.
  
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