Latest Updates:
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 
Topic Tools
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Radjabov's Jaenisch (Read 72894 times)
Fernando Semprun
Senior Member
****
Offline


Be nice to others. Life
is to be enjoyed!

Posts: 402
Location: Madrid
Joined: 04/29/03
Gender: Male
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #40 - 02/20/08 at 13:00:18
Post Tools
4.d3 is a second rate move. So is 2.c3 in the Sicilian, even though many players win with it.

Although theory in old lines can be very dogmatic (based in old views with zero comp. analysis), so it surely pays to do some analysis. One would be ahead (same as Kaspy in the Evans: Move is no good, but if you are ahead...)
  

Fernando Semprun
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Raphael
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


If you have been checkmated
you missed something.

Posts: 5
Joined: 02/06/08
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #39 - 02/20/08 at 10:17:56
Post Tools
Just amazing!

The venerable Ruy Lopez is tamed by a youngster playing a allegedly dubious gambit against the world elite.

Interestingly it seems that both Vishy and Judith do not trust the d3 followed by qd3-qc4 ideas.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Alias
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1512
Location: East of the river Svartĺn
Joined: 11/19/04
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #38 - 02/20/08 at 09:37:59
Post Tools
Radjabov got a 22 move draw vs Anand in the Jänisch/Schliemann. Not too bad. (Aronian managed to win with the Marshall. Even better.  Cheesy )
  

Don't check me with no lightweight stuff.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Markovich
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 6099
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Joined: 09/17/04
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #37 - 12/11/07 at 21:19:09
Post Tools
Holbox wrote on 12/11/07 at 14:35:21:
Quote:
I think you really have to look to 3...a6 against the Spanish.


I left my beloved pirc and my kid following some of your recomendations anywhere in the forum, and changed to a Chigorin against 1.d4, which was also in my repertoire but I hadn't worked it too much, and 1...e5 against 1.e4. My results are even being slightly better, even without hard preparation, which make feel I'm in the correct way. I'm following basically Davies repertoire book Play 1.e4 e5!, but I don't like the spanish exchange, and that's the reason which make me think in avoiding 3...a3 which, of course, must be the strongest, the richest and the most complex move.

As white I haven't defined yet my repertoire but at the moment, I'm studying Paul Morphy games which I hope it could give some ideas about where to go.

Thx for your attention.


Well, only the Berlin is widely considered good among the alternatives to 3...a6.  For whatever it's worth, the theoretical stock of the Exchange seems to have fallen in recent years.  You could also consider the transposition to the Open that I suggest up higher.
  

The Great Oz has spoken!
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10756
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #36 - 12/11/07 at 20:38:58
Post Tools
Holbox wrote on 12/11/07 at 14:35:21:
but I don't like the spanish exchange


Already looked at

http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1195530096

?
I am having fun as Black. Ignore TN's remark though, as it is as off the point as usual.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Willempie
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing
.com!

Posts: 4312
Location: Holland
Joined: 01/07/05
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #35 - 12/11/07 at 14:59:05
Post Tools
Markovich wrote on 12/11/07 at 13:31:38:
In the past I've recommended 3...Nf6 4.0-0 Bc5.  More recently however, I've begun to wonder whether Black can hold his end up after 5.Nxe5!  If I knew that Black were O.K. there, I would continue to recommend it, since I think the other lines are at least palatable for Black.

I am not sure about the details, but isnt 5..Nd4 a good option?
Being a closet Traxler addict I like the looks of 6.Bc4 Nxe4 7.Nxf7 Qh4
  

If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Holbox
Senior Member
****
Offline


Saigón Café

Posts: 369
Joined: 02/08/05
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #34 - 12/11/07 at 14:35:21
Post Tools
Quote:
I think you really have to look to 3...a6 against the Spanish.


I left my beloved pirc and my kid following some of your recomendations anywhere in the forum, and changed to a Chigorin against 1.d4, which was also in my repertoire but I hadn't worked it too much, and 1...e5 against 1.e4. My results are even being slightly better, even without hard preparation, which make feel I'm in the correct way. I'm following basically Davies repertoire book Play 1.e4 e5!, but I don't like the spanish exchange, and that's the reason which make me think in avoiding 3...a3 which, of course, must be the strongest, the richest and the most complex move.

As white I haven't defined yet my repertoire but at the moment, I'm studying Paul Morphy games which I hope it could give some ideas about where to go.

Thx for your attention.
  

"Ladran, luego cabalgamos", NN
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Markovich
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 6099
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Joined: 09/17/04
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #33 - 12/11/07 at 13:31:38
Post Tools
Holbox wrote on 11/29/07 at 11:05:59:
Nigel Davies says in Gambiteer II that 4.d3 lines are not a problem for black as many other writers have proclaimed. I haven't studied the recomended lines yet, but the idea is to avoid that white's queen arrives to c4, then black should wait to take on e4, I mean 4.d3 Nf6 5...Bc5 6...0-0. I'm really interested in learning the Schliemann which I think would be a good weapon at my level (2100). 

Pd. Markovich, if you ever read this,  what do you prefer for a new 1..e5 player 3...Bc5, or 3...f5 in the Spanish game?



In the past I've recommended 3...Nf6 4.0-0 Bc5.  More recently however, I've begun to wonder whether Black can hold his end up after 5.Nxe5!  If I knew that Black were O.K. there, I would continue to recommend it, since I think the other lines are at least palatable for Black.

The Schliemann is a very interesting proposition, as are many lines that sacrifice time in exchange for space.  (Because it gives up time, I don't think it really belongs in a "gambiteer" repertoire.)  But as you will know, I think it's a losing proposition.  I would never recommened that a line known to be unsound be played at any level; at least as a part of anyone's regular repertoire.

If you don't want to play the Berlin or transpose into an Open via 3...Nf6 4.0-0 Nxe4 5.d4 a6 (and there are those who think you can't do that), I think you really have to look to 3...a6 against the Spanish.
  

The Great Oz has spoken!
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
rossia
Senior Member
****
Offline


Saw: "Game Over!"

Posts: 334
Location: Irkutsk
Joined: 09/17/07
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #32 - 12/11/07 at 11:30:32
Post Tools
[/quote]

The problem is that if Informator decide to sue anyone, it will probably be me! Sad

[/quote]

Don't worry, I'm the lawyer  Cool
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
GMTonyKosten
YaBB Administrator
*****
Offline


Mr Dynamic?

Posts: 3152
Location: Clermont-Ferrand
Joined: 12/19/02
Gender: Male
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #31 - 12/10/07 at 22:15:32
Post Tools
Alias wrote on 11/30/07 at 17:26:22:
I don't think Tony likes that you do that.


Yes, you're right I don't! The problem is that if Informator decide to sue anyone, it will probably be me! Sad
However, this day and age the disrespect for intellectual copyright seems to be pretty general - a strong Ukranian GM complimented me on my Najdorf book a few months ago, and then added: "Of course, I didn't buy it, I downloaded it from ***!" (I am not putting the name just in case the reader thinks this is a good idea Wink)
Regarding the long posts containing games - I would prefer if people simply attach the games in a PGN file, then we can all download it and simply open it in ChessBase. Smiley
« Last Edit: 12/11/07 at 11:35:48 by GMTonyKosten »  
Back to top
IP Logged
 
Dragan Glas
Senior Member
****
Offline


"If I, like Solomon, ...
could have my wish -
"

Posts: 424
Location: Ireland
Joined: 06/25/06
Gender: Male
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #30 - 12/01/07 at 23:49:12
Post Tools
Greetings,

I did look at 7. Bxc6, dc; 8. Nxe5, Bxf5.

The idea was to get the long-term advantage of pawn majorities on both sides of the board with the intention of exchanging off to an advantageous endgame as soon as possible. The only problem is that Black gets a good middlegame attack due to White's lack of development. For those who like living dangerously, it might be worth further study!  Wink

Edit:
Further to the above, I'm giving the following line, which is a result of my analysis (along with my old version of Crafty-20.14). This by no means represents "best play" - I'm sure those here can find improvements for both sides. Any flaws in this line are my own.

9. Be3, Qe7; 10. Nc4, Rae8; 11. Nbd2, Ng4; 12. Bxc5, Qxc5; 13. Nb3, Qe7; 14. h3, Ne5; 15. Re1, Qf6; 16. Nxe5, Rxe5; 17. Rxe5, Qxe5; 18. c3, Re8; 19. Nd4, Be6; 20. Nxe6, Rxe6; 21. d4, Qe2; 22. Qxe2, Rxe2; 23. Rb2, Kf6; 24. g4, Rc2; 25. Kg2, Ke6; 26. Kf3, Kd6; 27. h4, h6; 28. Ke3, c5; 29. dc+, Kxc5; 30. f4, Kc4; 31. Ke4, Rh2; 32. h5, a5; 33. Kf5, Rd2; (+=/+- on the basis of the k-side pawn majority.)

Kindest regards,

Dragan Glas
« Last Edit: 12/02/07 at 05:36:25 by Dragan Glas »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10756
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #29 - 11/30/07 at 20:44:11
Post Tools
rossia wrote on 11/30/07 at 07:39:04:

(20551) Banas,J - Ivanovic,B [C63]
Stip Stia, 1979
[Banas,J]
28/262  1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 f5 4.d3 [4.Nc3 - 28/(262)] 4...Nf6?! [4...fxe4] 5.exf5 Bc5 6.0–0 0–0 7.Be3 Nd4 8.c3 [8.Nxe5? Qe7–+] 8...Nxf3+ 9.Qxf3 Be7 10.Nd2 c6 11.Ba4 d5 12.d4 e4 13.Qh3˛ g6 14.g4 h5 [14...gxf5 15.gxf5 Qd7 16.f3˛] 15.f3 exf3 16.gxh5 Bxf5 17.Qxf3 Ng4?! [17...Nxh5 18.Qg2˛] 18.Bf4± g5 19.Bg3 Qd7 20.Rae1 Rae8 [20...Bc2? 21.Qe2+-] 21.Bd1 Nh6 22.Qg2 Rf7 23.Be5 Ref8 [23...Bh3 24.Rxf7! Bxg2 25.Rg7+ Kf8 26.Kxg2+-] 24.Qg3 Bh3 25.Rxf7 Rxf7 26.Bc2 g4? [26...Bf5 27.Bxf5 Qxf5 28.Nf1 Qc2 29.Qg2±] 27.Bg6+- Rf8 28.Qe3 Nf5 [28...Nf7 29.Bxf7+ … Łh6+-] 29.h6! Rf7 30.Qf4! g3 31.Bxf7+ Kh7 32.hxg3 Bf8 33.Bh5 Bxh6 34.Qf2 c5 35.Bf4 cxd4 36.cxd4 Qg7 37.Kh2 Bg4 38.Bxg4 Qxg4 39.Bxh6 Nxh6 40.Qf4 1–0


@ Rossia: dear friend, if you had read my previous post, you would have known that 13.Qh3 += is somewhat doubtable because of g6 14.g4 gxf5 15.gxf5 Ne8! I had found this move more than 10 years ago and also saw it in Harding's last Kibitzer column. 15...Ne8 is one of those developments since 1979 TN wrote about.

To make life easier for those who want to delve a little I quote:

TopNotch wrote on 11/30/07 at 16:14:52:
Further to my and Mnb's previous posts, I am not convinced that Black has gained equality after Davies and Harding's suggested line: 4.d3 Nf6 5.0-0 Bc5 6.exf5 0-0 7.Be3 [Serious thought should also be given to 7.Nxe5!?] Nd4 8.c3 Nxf3+ 9.Qxf3 Be7 10.Nd2 c6 11.Ba4 d5 12.d4 e4 13.Qh3 g6 14.f3 reaching a position I consider better for White but requiring practical tests.

If only everyone would play the Schliemann then life would be so much simpler and enjoyable for White.

Toppy Smiley



With the last statement I certainly agree.
I also find it nice to read that TN's assessement has been modified from "6.exf5 winning" to "I consider 14.f3 better for White."
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TopNotch
God Member
*****
Offline


I only look 1 move ahead,
but its always the best

Posts: 2211
Joined: 01/04/03
Gender: Male
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #28 - 11/30/07 at 19:44:27
Post Tools
rossia wrote on 11/30/07 at 16:33:36:
TopNotch wrote on 11/30/07 at 16:14:52:
How do you copy chess games from the Chessbase program, to the forum, I have tried to do this before without any luck.


It's easy:

1. select desired games in Chessbase 9.0 or Fritz
2. Output - Textfile
3. select: txt. or rtf.
4. copy notation into forum


Sweet.... Although I am still using Chessbase 7 which does not have this Output feature,I have managed to find a satisfactory work around.

Posting ideas here should be a lot easier for me from now on. As a test to make sure I've got, I will post two of my recent efforts from a half hour team tournament that I accepted to play in after much trepidation due to a long competitive lay off:



TopNotch vs. An, International Master [B52]
Team Tourney, 24.11.2007 Time 30/30
[TopNotch]

1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.Bb5+ [Avoiding any nasty surprises in the Open Sicilians such as the Najdorf for instance, is usually a good policy in Rapid chess] Bd7 4.Bxd7+ Qxd7 5.0-0 Nf6 6.Re1 Nc6 7.c3 e6 8.d4 cxd4 9.cxd4 d5 10.e5 Ne4 11.Nbd2 Nxd2 12.Bxd2 Be7 13.Rc1 0-0 14.Rc3 [In my opinion the text move is the only good plan for White in this position. The main idea of this rook lift is to eventually swing it to the kingside to participate in a King hunt] Rfc8 15.a3 b5 16.Rd3 [An important preparatory move, which frees my Knight from the defence of the d pawn and buys me time to organise a Kingside raid.] 16...a5 [Very cold blooded. Black is in no way intimidated by my aggressive intentions ] 17.Ng5 [Worth investigating is 17.h4!?] 17...Bxg5 18.Bxg5 Ne7 19.Qh5 Ng6 20.Rh3 h6 21.Bxh6!? [In for a penny, in for a pound. My opponent admitted after the game that he considered this rubbish, while I on the otherhand did not see a clear way for Black to unravel after the sac. It turns out that we were both wrong.] gxh6 22.Qxh6 Rc4 23.Rg3 Rxd4 24.h4 Qe7 25.h5 Rh4? [He should have played 25...Qh4! 26.Rxg6+ fxg6 27.Qxg6+ Kf8 28.Qh6+ Kg8 29.Qg6+ Kf8 30.Qh6+ Kg8 31.Qg6+= and White is obliged to take the perpetual check] 26.Rc1?! [26.Ree3! Qf8 (26...Rc8 27.Ref3+- This is what I momentarily missed during the game, as I forgot my distant Queen is still covering the critical c1 square) 27.Qg5 Qd8 28.hxg6 Qxg5 29.Rxg5±] 26...Rd8?? [Better was 26...d4 but Black would still have big problems to solve after 27.Rd1 Ra7 (27...b4 28.Rdd3 bxa3 29.Rxa3 Rb8 30.Rxg6+ fxg6 31.Rg3+-) 28.Rg5 Qf8 29.Qxf8+ Kxf8 30.hxg6 fxg6 31.f3±] 27.Rcc3 [There is no satisfactory defence now] Qf8 28.Qg5 Rxh5 29.Qxh5 Qg7 30.Rcf3 d4 31.Rf6 Kf8 32.Rgxg6 1-0

A. FideMaster vs TopNotch [A21]
Team Tourney, 2007 Time 30/30
[TopNotch]

1.c4 e5 2.Nc3 d6 3.g3 f5 4.Bg2 Nf6 5.d3 Be7 6.e3 0-0 7.Nge2 c6 8.0-0 Be6 9.b3 Na6 [Yrjola and Tella don't consider the

risky text move, and suggest instead 9...d5 which indeed is a lot safer but also a lot less fun Smiley] 10.d4! Qe8 11.Ba3 Rd8

12.Qc2 g5 Preparing e4 if need by securing the f4 square from a possible Knight incursion. As it turns out the text move

also facilitates a strong Kingside attack 13.c5?! [In case of 14.Rd1 I had intended 14...e4 with a reasonable game] dxc5

14.dxe5 Ng4 15.Na4 Qh5 16.h3 Nxe5 17.Nxc5 Nxc5 18.Bxc5 Nf3+ 19.Kh1 Rd2! [Also winning as pointed out by Fritz is

19...f4! 20.Bxe7 Bxh3 21.Bxf8 Bg4+ 22.Bh3 Qxh3#] 20.Qc3 Bxc5 21.Ng1 Nxg1 22.Kxg1 Rd5! [The key to the combination] 23.Bxd5

Bxd5 0-1


That didn't take very long to do at all, although I suppose the games could benefit from a bit more formatting which I'm sure I will get the hang of over time.

Much appreciated for the info Rossia.

Toppy Smiley
  

The man who tries to do something and fails is infinitely better than he who tries to do nothing and succeeds - Lloyd Jones Smiley
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Matemax
God Member
*****
Offline


Chesspub gives you strength!

Posts: 1302
Joined: 11/04/07
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #27 - 11/30/07 at 18:30:18
Post Tools
*argh*  - what happened to 4.d3? Kiss
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
drkodos
God Member
*****
Offline


I see....stars.

Posts: 778
Location: Jupiter, and beyond
Joined: 03/29/07
Re: Radjabov's Jaenisch
Reply #26 - 11/30/07 at 18:00:38
Post Tools
rossia wrote on 11/30/07 at 17:35:08:
I have right to share these games with you after I paid heavy price for it. It's all good will and altruism.


Factually incorrect.  

Your payment at a "heavy price" no doubt also included your legally binding agreement to NOT share this very information with anyone.  It is called proprietary RIGHTS, and you are possibly in violation of it, whether you are in Russia, the Planet Tralfalmadore, or anywhere else in which other human beings can come into contact with you.

And, while your intent may be that of good will and altruism, it is irrelevant, because a higher law other than your own mental code of ethics likely takes precedence here.

You may want to at least try to hide under the umbrella of the Fair Use Doctrine, but even that would probably not apply because of your possible (ab/over)use of the info.



Just sayin.
  

I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 
Topic Tools
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo