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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Problem with the Accelerated Dragon (Read 13078 times)
J-dog
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #20 - 03/07/08 at 23:03:32
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kobe, drop the acc. dragon before you seriously hurt yourself.
  
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CheckMate
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #19 - 03/07/08 at 08:13:42
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To kobesarmy:

Get Silman's Winning With The Sicilian. It gives a complete repertoire against 1. e4 based on the Sicilian and Accelerated Dragon. It's the book I learned this opening from.

Silman/Donaldson: Accelerated Dragons is another good book but this one is not a repertoire book.

The Gurgenidze move order is 5. c4 Nf6 6. Nc3 d6 (!) 7. Be2(or f3 or 0-0) Nxd4 8. Qxd4 Bg7.

The point is to lure White's queen to d4 and later win a tempo (after Bg7 and 0-0) by forcing White to retreat with his queen. Therefore the trade must occur before White gets the time to play Be3, otherwise he may recapture with the Bishop instead. Therefore the move order 5 ... Nf6 (5 ... Bg7 would be answered with Be3 and Black can forget the Gurgenidze). The Gurgenidze trade on d4 must take played on move 7 (after ... d6) to avoid the e4-e5 problem, this is important!!!
  
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kobesarmy
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #18 - 03/07/08 at 01:32:37
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i had a book on it but it didn't really help, it told me the lines to play and tricks for the middle game along with what to look for, when i tried it out, kept getting punished with the line i had tried to use which is why i posted this
  

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kobesarmy
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #17 - 03/06/08 at 00:24:48
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ok, i'll try d6 then depending on my opponent
  

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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #16 - 03/05/08 at 11:57:18
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Quote:
yes, d6 is an alternative, i'll take alook at their games, thanks, do u agree with whan MNb said with the exchange before the opponent can exchange? 5...Nf6 6.Nc3 Nxd4


It's not just an "alternative", this is the mean move. If you really want to play Bg7 quickly followed by Nf6, just do it by playing 5..Bg7 forcing 6.Be3 and then 6..Nf6 Nc3 and here you do what you want.

And about your question: the only point to play 6..Nxd4 immediately is to avoid the lines with Nc2, but I don't fear them that much. The disadvantage of 6..Nxd4 immediately is that White after 7.Qxd4 d6 has the additional response 8.c5, and in the book on the Accelerated Dragon by Silman and Donalson, they think that 8.Bg5 merits a "!" "This move garantees White some advantage." 8..Bg7 9.Qd2 0-0 10.Bd3, etc. Here we see one point of 6..d6 first: it "forces" White to put the bishop on the less active square: e2 instead of d3. But 6..Nxd4 might be ok, maybe it's more a question of taste but personnally I play 6..d6
  
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kobesarmy
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #15 - 03/05/08 at 01:24:56
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wow, thanks, i'll keep that in mind, thank you for ur help, u'v been a great help for me
  

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MNb
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #14 - 03/05/08 at 01:18:02
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Who knows what's going on in other people's minds? If you are convinced that something is good, draw your own conclusions even if the world top passes the opportunity.
A few years ago I had the same experience. I had found a good line for Black in the Blumenfeld Gambit 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 c5 4.d5 b5 and had scored an easy win with it in a corr game. The point was to begin a devastating attack iso winning back the pawn. When I checked it several years later I saw that many players much stronger than me had taken the pawn and lost. So I wrote a letter to New in Chess with my game. GM Van der Sterren commented that I was right and last year Morozevich tried it ....
For the sake of clarity: my opening ideas more often s**k.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
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kobesarmy
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #13 - 03/05/08 at 00:49:21
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that's what i thought but why do some people pass this 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cd 4.Nxd4 g3 5.c4 Nf6 6.Nc3 Bg2 7.NxN bxN 8.e5 up? my openings book didn't even mention it and didn't play d6, on the gensunasumus, there are many games at master level that don't go that path and there are book openings that don't do this, why should white pass this up?
  

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MNb
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #12 - 03/05/08 at 00:37:22
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kobesarmy wrote on 03/05/08 at 00:26:03:
MNb wrote on 03/04/08 at 03:31:52:
You mean 7.Nxc6 bxc6 8.e5 ? How does this drive away from restricting Black then? Or am I misunderstanding you? For this reason it is convenient to post moves. It makes sure we write about the same thing.


sry, i'm new here, i'll try to remember to post the moves, and yes, i was refering to 7.Nxc6 bxc6 8.e5 because earlier i asked u about why some strong players pass on this move and u said that it wasn't about losing tempo, it was about restricting so i thought in that way that white might be losing the sight of the orginal plan which would actually be good for black despite the loss of tempo

I see. When writing this I commented on 5.c4, not on 7.Nxc6. Sorry about the misunderstanding. I have looked in my database and glanced through a few games. Imo 7.Nxc6 bxc6 8.e5 Ng8 9.f4 is something Black definitely should avoid.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
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kobesarmy
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #11 - 03/05/08 at 00:28:42
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ArKheiN wrote on 03/04/08 at 07:40:24:
There is no problem. You gave that move order: 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.c4 Nf6 (Bg7 is the main alternative but is really a different way to play against the maroczy) 6.Nc3 and now of course 6..d6! (preventing e5 and threatening Ng4 if White play Be3 without Be2), 7.Be2 Nxd4 8.Qxd4 Bg7 is the Gurgenidze defense of the Maroczy, a very solid line with easy ideas, just watch games of Tiviakov and Malakhov. 5..Bg7 folowed by 7..Ng4 is more for umbalanced battle.



yes, d6 is an alternative, i'll take alook at their games, thanks, do u agree with whan MNb said with the exchange before the opponent can exchange? 5...Nf6 6.Nc3 Nxd4
  

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kobesarmy
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #10 - 03/05/08 at 00:26:03
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MNb wrote on 03/04/08 at 03:31:52:
You mean 7.Nxc6 bxc6 8.e5 ? How does this drive away from restricting Black then? Or am I misunderstanding you? For this reason it is convenient to post moves. It makes sure we write about the same thing.


sry, i'm new here, i'll try to remember to post the moves, and yes, i was refering to 7.Nxc6 bxc6 8.e5 because earlier i asked u about why some strong players pass on this move and u said that it wasn't about losing tempo, it was about restricting so i thought in that way that white might be losing the sight of the orginal plan which would actually be good for black despite the loss of tempo
  

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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #9 - 03/04/08 at 07:40:24
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There is no problem. You gave that move order: 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.c4 Nf6 (Bg7 is the main alternative but is really a different way to play against the maroczy) 6.Nc3 and now of course 6..d6! (preventing e5 and threatening Ng4 if White play Be3 without Be2), 7.Be2 Nxd4 8.Qxd4 Bg7 is the Gurgenidze defense of the Maroczy, a very solid line with easy ideas, just watch games of Tiviakov and Malakhov. 5..Bg7 folowed by 7..Ng4 is more for umbalanced battle.
  
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MNb
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #8 - 03/04/08 at 03:31:52
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You mean 7.Nxc6 bxc6 8.e5 ? How does this drive away from restricting Black then? Or am I misunderstanding you? For this reason it is convenient to post moves. It makes sure we write about the same thing.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
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kobesarmy
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #7 - 03/04/08 at 03:13:40
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so is it actually bad for white to do that exchange? is the loss of tempo acutally not that much of a drawback? it does drive white away from the plan of restricting black
  

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MNb
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Re: Problem with the Accelerated Dragon
Reply #6 - 03/04/08 at 03:09:00
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The whole idea of 5.c4 is not to force Black to lose a tempo, but to get a strong grip on the centre. Hence Maroczy's Bind.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
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