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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Hanham Philidor (Read 12526 times)
Gorath
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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #14 - 07/24/10 at 21:21:57
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motörhead wrote on 07/24/10 at 11:53:50:
Gorath wrote on 07/23/10 at 12:07:11:
My memory is a bit foggy, but didn't Shirov explain on his DVD why he thinks the g4 variation he created is unsound?


I too heard that rumour but haven't seen anything concrete on that. Does anybody have a variation on that undsoundness? My gut-feeling is, that it is not unsound but complex with fighting possibilities for Black too.

AFAIR Shirov showed an improvement in one of his later games with the g4 variation. Was there a game against Shaw? Black can play a quick expansion on the queenside with Qa5, b5-b4, Ba6 and hit white before he is fully coordinated.
Unfortunately I don't have time to look it up.
  
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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #13 - 07/24/10 at 14:27:46
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S_F must have been thinking of something else; 1. e4 d6 2. d4 Nf6 3. Nc3 h6 looks horrendous, and Black certainly can't count on then playing ...Nbd7 and ...e5.
  
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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #12 - 07/24/10 at 11:59:45
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Smyslov_Fan wrote on 11/17/08 at 06:40:26:
I think Larry Christiansen tried ...d6, Nf6, h6!? and only then ...Nbd7 and e5.  The fact that Christiansen, a player known for his attacking attitude, tried such a line shows that there is still hope for Black.  I wouldn't recommend this to beginners though.


Can you please give a line on it. I have not clue how Christiansen entered the games. Was it 1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 h6  - never seen this here, should we call it a hyperexallerated Lion? - or how did Christiansen play it?
  

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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #11 - 07/24/10 at 11:53:50
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Gorath wrote on 07/23/10 at 12:07:11:
My memory is a bit foggy, but didn't Shirov explain on his DVD why he thinks the g4 variation he created is unsound?


I too heard that rumour but haven't seen anything concrete on that. Does anybody have a variation on that undsoundness? My gut-feeling is, that it is not unsound but complex with fighting possibilities for Black too.
  

A walk trough the ocean of most souls would scarcely get your feet wet.
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Gorath
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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #10 - 07/23/10 at 12:07:11
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My memory is a bit foggy, but didn't Shirov explain on his DVD why he thinks the g4 variation he created is unsound?
  
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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #9 - 07/23/10 at 08:58:27
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In the regular Philidor, as well as in the Pirc move order, the g2-g4 attacks have become popular (Shirov etc.). That was covered in Philidor Files (Bauer), but not nearly as detailed as necessary. I have tried to work out good replies for Black in columns written at the end of 2007 for ChessCafe:

http://www.chesscafe.com/text/kaiss26.pdf
http://www.chesscafe.com/text/kaiss27.pdf
http://www.chesscafe.com/text/kaiss28.pdf

Plus a reader reaction from a grandmaster:
http://www.chesscafe.com/text/kaiss29.pdf

My sources included Nic Yearbook, an SOS article, the works by authors Warzecha, Khalifman, Bauer, and the reference work by J. van Rekom, L. B. Jansen: De leeuw, hét zwarte wapen, Netherlands 1998. The latter has many good ideas and is quite inspiring.
  
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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #8 - 07/23/10 at 08:12:28
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I am considering playing it on occasions when I must win.
I have
-Fighting Philidor by Bologan
-Philidor Files by Bauer
-Carpathian Warrior by Okhotnik+Lalic

But I don't like the idea of letting White obtaining a comfortable endgame with 4.dxe5 dxe5 5.Qxd8+ (I have played it a few times, but White's position is comfortable, even without knowledge of theory), so I have to learn the 3..Nbd7 move-order.
(I already have the Caro-Kann against strong players, in which Black's aim is not to complicate things too much, that's why I don't want to allow White to simplify the position here, too, as early as move 4-5.)

The question:
Suppose my opponent is an unsuspecting and unprepared one, and his rating is below FIDE 2150, whom I'd like to defeat at any price, that's why I choose the Philidor against him in the first place.
What is the most probable way of him improvizing after 3..Nbd7?
Knowing the 3..Nbd7-theory in Philidor Files will be enough to get me a playable position?
« Last Edit: 07/23/10 at 09:33:23 by HoemberChess »  

as
*W 1d4) Torre/Barry/Pirc/Philidor/ early _d5:early c4(QGD/Slav/QGD/etc)
*B) 1e4:e6 [+1_c5 2Nf3 a6]| 1d4:e6 2c4 Bb4+ BID/pseudoNID [+1_Nf6 NID]| 1c4:c5,_Nc6,_e5,_g6| 1Nf3:c5
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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #7 - 12/08/08 at 21:58:26
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Markovich wrote on 12/08/08 at 19:12:09:
drawyah wrote on 12/07/08 at 04:11:15:
The defense can be quite solid, but if one is adventurous there are sharper lines like the Claw. Good Chess! Keith


Personally I prefer to play the Clutching Hand.  I'd like to try the Sinister Icepick, but I'm not sure it's sound.



  

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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #6 - 12/08/08 at 19:12:09
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drawyah wrote on 12/07/08 at 04:11:15:
The defense can be quite solid, but if one is adventurous there are sharper lines like the Claw. Good Chess! Keith


Personally I prefer to play the Clutching Hand.  I'd like to try the Sinister Icepick, but I'm not sure it's sound.
  

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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #5 - 12/07/08 at 04:11:15
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The move order: 1 e4 d6 2 d4 Nf6 3 Nc3 Nbd7 4 Nf3 e5, to get the Hanham Philidor formation, is often called the "Lion". Jerry van Rekom and Leo Jansen have worked hard in promoting this move order and defense. Their website contains interesting information:

http://www.vanrekom.nl/thelion/indexgb.htm

With Jerry and Leo being non-masters, their efforts for a long time went neglected by top players, but now NIC is publishing the fourth edition of their book:

http://www.newinchess.com/The_Black_Lion-p-923.html

The defense can be quite solid, but if one is adventurous there are sharper lines like the Claw. Good Chess! Keith
  
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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #4 - 11/18/08 at 00:57:08
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Smyslov_Fan wrote on 11/17/08 at 06:40:26:
I think Larry Christiansen tried ...d6, Nf6, h6!? and only then ...Nbd7 and e5.  The fact that Christiansen, a player known for his attacking attitude, tried such a line shows that there is still hope for Black.  I wouldn't recommend this to beginners though.


I have tried this setup as well a few times and found two files (g and h) not enough for a successfull attack. That may prove I have never left the beginner stage of course.  Smiley
As White I would play 1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 e5 (Nd7 4.Be3) 4.Nge2 idea f3, Be3 and Qd2 these days. Of course that does not rule out the Antoshin. One advantage of the 1...d6 move order is avoiding 1.e4 e5 2.d4 exd4 3.Nf3 d6 4.Bc4:

http://www.kenilworthchessclub.org/games/java/2006/anti-antoshin.htm
  

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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #3 - 11/17/08 at 11:52:17
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Imo the Philidor is a solid opening for black. On club level the biggest advantage may be that black can reach his preferred setup almost against every move order after 1...d6, so it´s a bargain if you´re concerned about the amount of theory you have to learn.

I look at this from the white side. I find the Antoshin (1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 e5 4.Nf3 exd) very annoying, as black seems to define the structure of the game, and I hate to exchange the queens early in the game with 4.dxe as advocated in the section. The Antoshin addict should know the structures simply much better, although the opening may give white a slight edge. If you want to play the Antoshin you should definitely have a look at a booklet from Seel.

Finally I can´t resist to refer to a recent game of mine where I was able to launch a tactical schlachtfest against the Philidor.

Lou_Cyber vs. N.N.
1.e4 d6 2.Nc3 Nf6 3.d4 Nbd7 4.Nf3 e5 5.g4 Nxg4 6.Rg1 Ngf6 7.Bc4 h6 8.Be3 c6 9.dxe dxe 10.Qd3 Qe7 11.000 g6 12.Nh4 Rg8 13.f4 b6 14.Nf3 exf 15.Bxf4 Nh5 16.Bc7 Bb7 17.Bd6 Qxd6 18.Bxf7+ Kxf7 19.Qc4+ Qe6 20.Rxd7+ Be7 21.Ne5+ Kf6 22.Ng4+ 1-0
  

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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #2 - 11/17/08 at 09:48:44
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I trully belive in the Hanham setup. It was my first opening with black against  1.e4. I played it via the old, and "refuted", move order (3...Nd7). The only problem with it is that is difficult to get the position you want. How many times will you expect to deviate from your prefered setup 60% might be even 70%? That's the point. If you play it via the Pirc move order sure you will get 4.f4 too many times..., more that you would like. Of course every time you will get it you will enjoy a beautiful game of chess.


  

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Re: Hanham Philidor
Reply #1 - 11/17/08 at 06:40:26
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I've played this variation before.  While it's a bit passive, the opening almost certainly will leave your opponent on his own from the very beginning.

The real problem with this line is that White has countless ways of getting a comfortable game while Black has to be careful with almost every move. 

I think Larry Christiansen tried ...d6, Nf6, h6!? and only then ...Nbd7 and e5.  The fact that Christiansen, a player known for his attacking attitude, tried such a line shows that there is still hope for Black.  I wouldn't recommend this to beginners though.
  
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Hanham Philidor
11/17/08 at 06:28:54
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Hi everyone,

I spent a fair amount of time at a local bookstore recently with the book "The Philidor Files."  I had long ago dismissed the Philidor as a poor opening.  However, reaching the Hanham variation via a Pirc move order (1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 (e5 or Nd7) seems to give Black quite an interesting game, not significantly different from many lines of the closed Lopez or the d3 TKD.  The author (Bauer, I believe) makes a very strong case for the viability of the Philidor as long as Black reaches it via the Pirc move order.  After some database searches, I was surprised to find the number of GMs in the 2400-2600 range who have lost the the Philidor.  I was hoping to get your general opinion on this opening when played as Bauer recommends.  Is this a good, solid option, or is it a case of  overoptimism on the part of the author?

Thanks in advance for your opinions,
Scott
  

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