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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral (Read 4724 times)
Roger Williamson
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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #11 - 01/11/09 at 18:23:09
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   It doesn't get much colder than that.

   revenge is a dish best served retroactively.
  
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TopNotch
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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #10 - 01/11/09 at 16:03:23
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And just to be facetious.  Tongue

Briscoe,C (2232) - Greet,A (2453) [C86]
95th ch-GBR Liverpool ENG (6), 02.08.2008

1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.0-0 Be7 6.Qe2 b5 7.Bb3 0-0 8.c3 d5 9.d3 Re8 10.a3 h6 11.Rd1 Bf8 12.Nbd2 Be6 13.Nf1 Qd7 14.Ne3 Rad8 15.Ba2 Qc8 16.exd5 Nxd5 17.Nxd5 Bxd5 18.Bxd5 Rxd5 19.c4 bxc4 20.dxc4 Rxd1+ 21.Qxd1 e4 22.Ne1 Rd8 23.Qa4 Ne5 24.Qc2 Bc5 25.b4 Bd4 26.Bb2 Qg4 27.h3 Qf4 28.Rd1 Nc6 29.Kf1 Qe5 30.Bxd4 Nxd4 31.Qc3 Kh7 32.Nc2 Nf3 0-1


Revenge being a dish best served cold.

Tops Smiley
  

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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #9 - 01/11/09 at 12:41:45
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TopNotch wrote on 01/11/09 at 00:50:13:
Curiously I can't help but feel that this thread was intended to be pejorative. TWIC is very well known and surely saubhikr could have easily found this game himself, indeed how did he even become aware of its existence.


Yes, anyone could have found the game with a modicum of effort. I posted it as by coincidence I had just found the game on TWIC with a repertoire scan, the Worrall now being in my repertoire DB due for the most part to Andrews book  Cool

Great that TWIC was so up to date with the Hastings tournament only just under way when I found the game, contrasting to the English Chess Federation website that even Today doesn't mention it even started  Roll Eyes
  

Those who want to go by my perverse footsteps play such pawn structure with fuzzy atypical still strategic orientations

Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right, stuck in the middlegame with you
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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #8 - 01/11/09 at 12:11:53
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MNb wrote on 01/11/09 at 11:15:26:
IM Andrew Greet wrote on 01/11/09 at 03:22:09:
Unfortunately these factors led me to overestimate my position

An experience I know all too well - I have lost my share of games against players rated at least 200 ELO-points later as well. The thought that this can happen to IM's too is comforting.
Didn't Karpov, as WCh, lose once as White, using the Keres-Attack, against a German amateur? IM A.Greet, I think you just have proven you are human.  Wink

And that he wrote a good book!
  
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MNb
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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #7 - 01/11/09 at 11:15:26
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IM Andrew Greet wrote on 01/11/09 at 03:22:09:
Unfortunately these factors led me to overestimate my position

An experience I know all too well - I have lost my share of games against players rated at least 200 ELO-points lower as well. The thought that this can happen to IM's too is comforting.
Didn't Karpov, as WCh, lose once as White, using the Keres-Attack, against a German amateur? IM A.Greet, I think you just have proven you are human.  Wink
« Last Edit: 01/11/09 at 20:41:54 by MNb »  

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IM Andrew Greet
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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #6 - 01/11/09 at 03:22:09
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For the record, here are a few of my thoughts regarding this game:

1) I had already beaten the same opponent using 8...d5 at the British Championship. It was obvious that he would have prepared something in response this time round, and for this reason I opted for something different.

2) The knight on a5 is not such a big problem - the regrouping to f7 is absolutely standard as owners of Marin's book will know. Giving up the a-file is also quite normal - a slight concession, but it shouldn't matter too much as Black controls enough queenside squares to prevent an invasion.

3) Not to take anything away from Chris, but this was, to put it mildly, an off day for me. Paradoxically, I think part of the reason for my downfall was that he actually didn't play the early middlegame very well. The move g3 is not something White would normally wish to do, and he also wasted a tempo playing Bh6 and later Be3 as well as using a considerable amount of time on the clock. Unfortunately these factors led me to overestimate my position, whereas in reality Black was still no more than equal. I should have continued playing solidly, but instead tried to 'punish' him and got into trouble. 23...fxe4 was a bad decision (instead a knight transfer to f6 would have made sense) and from that point on I just played horribly.

Finally, I didn't take offence to the title of the thread although there has clearly been some sort of mixup with the wording. I agree that the request was a little odd - perhaps the poster somehow heard of the result and opening of the game but was not aware of TWIC (not to mention the tournament website)?
  
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TopNotch
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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #5 - 01/11/09 at 00:50:13
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I don't imagine that Greet would be too thrilled about the title of this thread. A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral, and what excatly does based mean in this context, is it a typo?

Curiously I can't help but feel that this thread was intended to be pejorative. TWIC is very well known and surely saubhikr could have easily found this game himself, indeed how did he even become aware of its existence.

Of course I could be completely off base here, and if so I apologise in advance.

Toppy Smiley
  

The man who tries to do something and fails is infinitely better than he who tries to do nothing and succeeds - Lloyd Jones Smiley
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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #4 - 01/07/09 at 22:45:06
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I think we can safely say that the result of this game had very little to do with the opening.  Black tried to play a fairly traditional piece regrouping (well-known from the Chigorin variation since at least Rubinstein's time) but mishandled it a bit and allowed W to establish something of a bind, but he was stil pretty solid until he allowed it to slide very quickly with a series of errors towards the end of the game.

In short, Briscoe played a good solid game and Greet had an off-day.  Sh*t happens
  

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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #3 - 12/31/08 at 15:04:43
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First point is that Chris Briscoe already has beaten quite a lot of IMs recently and has at least 1 IM norm already. You might to observere that he also drew with white against a certain Mr. Short in the Worrall !

Secondly, I don't get why Greet avoided 8...d5 which is the best move .

Thirdly if you read Greet's book he's generally quite positive about white's chances in the d6 lines. Remember the old adage about playing what gms play ( I know he's only an IM !)

Fourth point is to observe that Briscoe played 5 0-0 and not 5 qe2 and thus avoided Toppy's line which suggests that 5 qe2 is not the best !
  
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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #2 - 12/31/08 at 12:22:51
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Here are my observations of this game:

1) In the opening, White saved a tempo by avoiding the move h3. The extra move Qe2 is not brilliant but it makes a later a4 more effective and also allows White to connect the rooks more quickly.

2) The problem of Black's passive queen's knight plagued Black during the early middlegame. By the time Black manoeuvred his knight to the somewhat useful f7-square, White had secured control of the only open file on the board and thus held an advantage.

3) I think 24...Nh5?! wasn't the best move, as a position where White had a superior bishop vs. knight resulted. Stronger seems to be 24...Bg4 or 24...Bf5, the latter exchanging light-squared bishops to reduce the influence of White's central space advantage owing to the d5-pawn.

In any case, a win against a Worrall expert with the white pieces certainly bodes well for the system, although it is unclear if White can secure even a faint edge in the 8...d5 variation (someone who owns Greet's 'Play the Ruy Lopez' could confirm or disprove this).
  

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Re: A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
Reply #1 - 12/31/08 at 09:16:15
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It's in TWIC 738

[Event "Masters"]
[Site "Hastings ENG"]
[Date "2008.12.28"]
[Round "1"]
[White "Briscoe, C."]
[Black "Greet, A."]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "C86"]
[WhiteElo "2253"]
[BlackElo "2440"]
[PlyCount "67"]
[EventDate "2008.12.28"]
[EventType "swiss"]
[EventRounds "9"]
[EventCountry "ENG"]
[Source "Mark Crowther"]
[SourceDate "2008.12.29"]

1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Ba4 Nf6 5. O-O Be7 6. Qe2 b5 7. Bb3 O-O 8. c3
d6 9. Rd1 Na5 10. Bc2 c5 11. d4 Qc7 12. d5 Bd7 13. b3 Nb7 14. Nbd2 Nh5 15. g3
g6 16. Nf1 Nd8 17. Bh6 Ng7 18. a4 Rb8 19. axb5 axb5 20. Ra6 f6 21. Rda1 Nf7 22.
Be3 f5 23. Bd3 fxe4 24. Bxe4 Nh5 25. N1d2 Nf6 26. Ng5 Nxe4 27. Ndxe4 Nxg5 28.
Bxg5 Bxg5 29. Nxg5 Rb6 30. Ra7 Qc8 31. Qe4 Rf5 32. Qh4 h5 33. Ne4 Kf7 34. Ra8
1-0

  

Those who want to go by my perverse footsteps play such pawn structure with fuzzy atypical still strategic orientations

Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right, stuck in the middlegame with you
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A 2200 player beat Andrew Greet based using Worral
12/31/08 at 03:06:39
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Andrew Greet wrote a nice book on Spanish using Worral Attack. Last week a 2200 player (white) beat him using this variation. Does anybody have the game ?
  
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