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Normal Topic TN against the From's gambit (Lasker). (Read 3553 times)
DrSnuggles
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Re: TN against the From's gambit (Lasker).
Reply #3 - 01/08/09 at 00:36:53
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Well, the results of an variation somewhat reflects the status of it, at least if higher rated people playes it over and over again.

So I did a search through big database 08 (with updates approx. 4040000 games) where both players should have at least a rating of 2400. I could find 6 games played with g5 (Lasker) with a score percentage of 50% for white (I think avarage should be about 55%).
Of these 6 games only one featured d4 with a draw as result.

These statistics does not say that much and all those old masters are exluded + creative players of 2300 in rating + a high rated player beating the crap out of a low rated player (say, Berescu-Zerdo 1998). But it do show that these lines are much unexplored.

The point being that d3 has been regarded as an mistake, but may not be with the right continuation. And yes, I do think that the old 5.d4 and the more modern 5.g3 are good moves.

Why did I even look for an alternative? Well, I was going to play a 2200, whom I lost to alot in blitz games, when he used the Lasker variation. He always seem to come up with new moves, which is not to be found in any books. So, I wanted to surprise him with his own means.

I quess I am not the only one. Lars Karlsson played the weird 5.c3 (instead of 5.d4 and 5.g3) against him in Rilton cup a few years ago.

Thank for your comments

DrSnuggles
  
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Re: TN against the From's gambit (Lasker).
Reply #2 - 01/06/09 at 00:26:29
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Spot on - I do believe that the From's Gambit, with best play, does not provide Black with full compensation for the pawn.

However, the reason I don't ever play the Bird's Opening as White (except occasionally in 1-minute) is because I can't find any route to an advantage after 1...d5. Indeed, White's extra tempo over a Dutch gives him equality, but no more. I recall a few people on this forum saying in the past that the extra tempo can even harm White, but I tend to disagree.

Returning to the other topic (the Lasker), I don't see why White shouldn't be better after 5.g3 g4 6.Nh4 or 5.d4 g4 6.Ne5. I couldn't find a single rated player play 5.d3 as White on my database, so I wouldn't trust it.
  

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Re: TN against the From's gambit (Lasker).
Reply #1 - 01/05/09 at 16:02:35
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DrSnuggles wrote on 01/05/09 at 15:39:59:
1. f4 e5 2. fxe5 d6 3. exd6 Bxd6 4. Nf3 g5 5. d3 g4 6. Nd4 Qh4+ 7. g3 Bxg3+ 8.hxg3 Qxh1 9. Bf4 Ne7 10. Nc3 c6 11. Qd2 Qh5 12. Ne4 Nd7 13. O-O-O f5 14. Nd6+ Kf8 15. Ne6+ Kg8 16. Bg2 Qg6 17. Nd4 Nd5 18. e4 Nxf4 19. Qxf4 Nf6 20. N4xf5 Kf8 21. Rf1 Bxf5 22. Nxf5 Rd8 23. Nd6 Kg7 24. e5 Nd5 25. Bxd5 cxd5 26. Nf5+ 1-0

In this line instead of 10...c6 I think 10...Be6 is better and after 11.Ne4 Nd5 12.Qd2 Nc6 13.Nc6 bc6 White has good compensation for the exchange.
Instead of 6...Qh4 I would propose 6...Be5 and after 7.c3 c5 8.Nb3 Qh4 9.g3 Bg3 10.hg3 Qh1 11.Nc5 Nf6 I think Black equalises without much efforts. Of course my analysis are not so deep. I looked at the position for less than 30 minutes. Maybe there will be some improvements...
  
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DrSnuggles
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TN against the From's gambit (Lasker).
01/05/09 at 15:39:59
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Hello,

I am not a strong player (1900), but I found an TN against From's gambit and just wanted to know your point of view.
I have only played it in blitz, though. I just do not play the Bird's in longer games.

So here it is:

1. f4 e5
2. fxe5 d6
3. exd6 Bxd6
4. Nf3 g5?!
5. d3 g4
6. Nd4 Qh4+

And now I can only find games with Kd2 (at chessbase or in Big database 08), not fun at all.

so...

7. g3!? (an exchange sac)
7....Bxg3+
8. hxg3 Qxh1

White has control over three central squares, control over the dark squares, better development, safer king's position + the position favour pieces not rooks (and white is up a piece Smiley, sort of).

I have played this sac 12 times and 11 games I won and one draw against a 2200 player.

The pieces (white):
The Q-bishop will go to f4. Sometimes to restore material with Be5.
The Q-knight will go to c3 and later to e4.
The queen goes to d2 and often to e3.
The king castle long (obviously)
The K-bishop goes to g2 (when the black queen has moved).

The pieces (black):
I thing a good set-up for black consists of

Q-knight to a6.
Q-Bishop to e6
K-knight to e7
Castle long

Later black might try for h5,h4,h3 (or h*g3).

A few game fragments played on ICC:

1. f4 e5 2. fxe5 d6 3. exd6 Bxd6 4. Nf3 g5 5. d3 g4 6. Nd4 Qh4+ 7. g3 Bxg3+ 8.hxg3 Qxh1 9. Bf4 Na6 10. Qd2 Qd5 11. Qe3+ Ne7 12. Nc3 Qc5 13. Ne4 Qb4+ 14. Kf2 Qxb2 15. Nf6+ Kd8 (1-0, 20)

And here I should have played 16. Qe5 with a better position.

1. f4 e5 2. fxe5 d6 3. exd6 Bxd6 4. Nf3 g5 5. d3 g4 6. Nd4 Qh4+ 7. g3 Bxg3+ 8.hxg3 Qxh1 9. Bf4 Ne7 10. Nc3 c6 11. Qd2 Qh5 12. Ne4 Nd7 13. O-O-O f5 14. Nd6+ Kf8 15. Ne6+ Kg8 16. Bg2 Qg6 17. Nd4 Nd5 18. e4 Nxf4 19. Qxf4 Nf6 20. N4xf5 Kf8 21. Rf1 Bxf5 22. Nxf5 Rd8 23. Nd6 Kg7 24. e5 Nd5 25. Bxd5 cxd5 26. Nf5+ 1-0

Which can be improved upon for both sides.

1. f4 e5 2. fxe5 d6 3. exd6 Bxd6 4. Nf3 g5 5. d3 g4 6. Nd4 Qh4+ 7. g3 Bxg3+ 8.hxg3 Qxh1 9. Bf4 Qd5 10. e3 Na6 11. Nc3 Qd8 12. Qe2 c5 13. Ndb5 Bd7 14. Nd6+ Kf8 15. Bg2 Bc6 16. e4 h5 17. Nf5 Ne7 (1-0, 49)

And here I missed Bd6 with an winning game.

So what do you think?

DrSnuggles







  
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