ChessPub Forum - Owen Whole Hog Variation

Bonsai God Member Offline Posts: 622 Joined: 03/13/04 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #25 - 05/26/09 at 07:31:04	Post Tools	Print Post
	As to whether anyone still plays it, I've had IM Branko Filipovic play it against me (and last I checked he still seems to just play b6 stuff as black all the time). Looking at the game the computer doesn't seem to like his position after 9...Nc6 that much, but 10.Nb5 is not the right reply and neither is 10...Qe8 that great in return, neither 11.Nxd6 such a great idea in return and he was then probably better after move 13 or so. So the game's hardly of theoretical value. 1. d4 b6 2. e4 Bb7 3. Bd3 e6 4. c4 f5 5. exf5 Bb4+ 6. Kf1 Nf6 7. Nf3 O-O 8. a3 Bd6 9. Nc3 Nc6 10. Nb5 Qe8 11. Nxd6 cxd6 12. fxe6 dxe6 13. Be3 e5 14. d5 e4 15. dxc6 Bxc6 16. Nd4 exd3 17. Nxc6 Qxc6 18. Qxd3 Rae8 19. h3 Kh8 20. Kg1 Ne4 21. Rf1 Rf5 22. Kh2 d5 23. cxd5 Rxd5 24. Qe2 Qd6+ 25. g3 Rf5 26. Rd1 Qf8 27. Rhf1 Qf7 28. Rc1 h6 29. Qc4 Qf8 30. Kg2 Kh7 31. Qc2 Kh8 32. Bd4 Qd6 33. Qc6 Qxd4 34.Qxe8+ Kh7 35. Rc2 Qd3 36. Qc6 Nxg3 37. Re1 Rg5 38. Rc3 Ne4+ 39. Kh2 Nxc3 40. Qxc3 Qd6+ 41. Kh1 Qd5+ 42. f3 Qf5 43. Kh2 Qf4+ 44. Kh1 Qg3 45. Qd3+ Rg6 46. Qf1 h5 47. Rd1 Rf6 48. Rd3 Re6 49. f4 Re1 50. Rxg3 Rxf1+ 51. Kg2 Rxf4 52. Rd3 a5 53. Rd5 Kh6 54. Kg3 Rf6 55. a4 g6 56. Rd4 Rc6 57. b4 Rc3+ 58. Kg2 Ra3 59. bxa5 bxa5 60. h4 Kg7 61. Rc4 Rb3 62. Rc5 Rb4 63. Rxa5 Rxh4 64. Ra8 Rb4 65. a5 Ra4 66. Ra6 Kh6 67. Ra8 Kg5 68. a6 Kg4 69. a7 Ra2+ 70. Kf1 g5 71. Kg1 h4 72. Kf1 h3 73. Kg1 Kg3 74. Rf8 Ra1+ 75. Rf1 h2+ 0-1 Mmmh, I cannot say I'm exactly proud of my play here. The game flipped about a few times, what I thought was fascinating was how much play he got for the exchange sacrifice he made with 33...Qxd4. After failing to finish it off on move 43, he just eventually won an ending that I should have managed to draw. However what I think it shows is that as a stronger player you are probably only mariginally worse and can outplay 2200 patzers like me in the ensuing mess. I guess I would not want to try it as black against a stronger player and perhaps that new analysis by Wind (which I have not seem) makes the case even clearer?.


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HgMan God Member Offline Demand me nothing: What you know, you know Posts: 2330 Location: Up on Cripple Creek Joined: 11/09/04 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #24 - 05/26/09 at 02:45:38	Post Tools	Print Post
	I dunno: at the sight of it, maybe your opponent would bolt from the table and you would collect the points by default...

	"Luck favours the prepared mind." --Louis Pasteur
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Antillian God Member Offline Brilliance without dazzle! Posts: 1757 Joined: 01/05/03 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #23 - 05/25/09 at 20:22:42	Post Tools	Print Post
	Is anyone still daring to play this opening...what with Swine Flu and all?

	"Breakthrough results come about by a series of good decisions, diligently executed and accumulated one on top of another." Jim Collins --- Good to Great
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Stefan Buecker God Member Offline Posts: 1386 Location: Germany Joined: 02/11/09 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #22 - 05/25/09 at 11:42:07	Post Tools	Print Post
	Did you find a mistake in Wind's analysis of 7.Nf3?


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Keano God Member Offline Money doesn't talk, it swears. Posts: 2928 Location: Toulouse Joined: 05/25/05 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #21 - 05/25/09 at 09:00:50	Post Tools	Print Post
	I noticed there are some GMs who continue persist in this line for Black (I think there was a game in the recent US ch). I´ve investigated it myself, and this simple Nf3 business does indeed seem awkward for Black - the engines all give a massive advantage to White, but maybe there is more to it, after all that king is still on f1. It just seems like its too tricky to play for Black, but I agree it would be great to rehabilitate this line.


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Stefan Buecker God Member Offline Posts: 1386 Location: Germany Joined: 02/11/09 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #20 - 05/24/09 at 05:35:28	Post Tools	Print Post
	So your project is to reinvent the wheel? As I said in reply #15: Stefan Buecker wrote on 05/20/09 at 04:20:34: Kaissiber 33 has 9 pages on the best treatment 4...f5 5.exf5 Bb4+! by Maurits Wind. After 6.Kf1 Nf6 Maurits analyzed 7.c5, 7.Be2 (Beliavsky), and yes, he also analyzed 7.Nf3 0-0 8.a3 (as well as 8.c5). His main line is 7.a3, by the way. You are a bit late, if you want to rehabilitate 5...Bb4+.


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HgMan God Member Offline Demand me nothing: What you know, you know Posts: 2330 Location: Up on Cripple Creek Joined: 11/09/04 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #19 - 05/24/09 at 00:42:37	Post Tools	Print Post
	With summer effectively upon us (the May long weekend--last week--typically ushers in summer in Ontario), I'd like to propose a project (either this, or I'll get caught up with projects around the house...): 1.e4 b6 2.d4 e6 3.c4 Bb7 4.Bd3 f5 5.exf5 Bb4+ if 5...Bxg2 is, indeed, debunked then this is an interesting alternative 6.Kf1 the f8-square has been made available for the Black king, thereby removing the dangers associated with ...Bxg2 6...Nf6 7.Nf3! 0-0 8.a3 Bd6 9.Nc3 Statistics do not favor Black in this position; in fact, it looks almost lost. But is there a way to rehabilitate Black's play after 5...Bb4+ ? It would be terrific if we could make this playable for Black...

	"Luck favours the prepared mind." --Louis Pasteur
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HgMan God Member Offline Demand me nothing: What you know, you know Posts: 2330 Location: Up on Cripple Creek Joined: 11/09/04 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #18 - 05/20/09 at 18:25:49	Post Tools	Print Post
	Yes: noticed that--hence the new post in that section. Weird, though, since the Owen typically starts with 1.e4...

	"Luck favours the prepared mind." --Louis Pasteur
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Markovich God Member Offline Posts: 6099 Location: Columbus, Ohio Joined: 09/17/04	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #17 - 05/20/09 at 12:04:26	Post Tools	Print Post
	Owen's Defense belongs in Daring Defenses.

	The Great Oz has spoken!
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HgMan God Member Offline Demand me nothing: What you know, you know Posts: 2330 Location: Up on Cripple Creek Joined: 11/09/04 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #16 - 05/20/09 at 11:56:45	Post Tools	Print Post
	Many thanks! When I get my act together, I will need to order a copy of Kaissiber...

	"Luck favours the prepared mind." --Louis Pasteur
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Stefan Buecker God Member Offline Posts: 1386 Location: Germany Joined: 02/11/09 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #15 - 05/20/09 at 04:20:34	Post Tools	Print Post
	Odessky's book is an unusual work, very enthusiastic and then there are his self-ironic observations... buyers of his book on 1.b3 will know what I mean. There was a nice review of the latter available in the web. - Kaissiber 33 has 9 pages on the best treatment 4...f5 5.exf5 Bb4+! by Maurits Wind, plus 1 page on the Whole Hog 5...Bxg2?! by me. Not much for weeks of work, but I failed to rescue the line.


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HgMan God Member Offline Demand me nothing: What you know, you know Posts: 2330 Location: Up on Cripple Creek Joined: 11/09/04 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #14 - 05/20/09 at 02:34:52	Post Tools	Print Post
	This is terrific stuff! I had forgotten about this thread and just rambled through it. Hopefully I will get a chance to provide my own analysis in due course. A quick question: can any comment on the quality of Odessky's English Defense? And how extensive is the analysis in Kaissiber 33? Thanks in advance...

	"Luck favours the prepared mind." --Louis Pasteur
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Stefan Buecker

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Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation
Reply #13 - 02/20/09 at 04:14:11

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The "Whole Hog Variation" may be even worse than the Englund Gambit, but in both cases the strongest lines are difficult to find over the board. The latter could still be playable against a 2400+ White, in spite of my pessimistic article for Chesscafe. Because Ian Simpson from Norwich, UK, later found an improvement (8...Ba5 9. Rb5 Bxd2+ 10. Qxd2 Kd8 11. e4 a6!?, if you know what I mean).

There are quieter alternatives for Black in move four, but the idea (1.c4 b6 2.d4 e6 3.e4 Bb7 4.Bd3) 4...f5 has a special charm. In Maurits Wind's analysis of 4...f5 5. exf5 Bb4+! Black gets good play for the sacrificed pawn. This is the treatment which I recommend for most purposes, perhaps with the exception of a corr. game.

The "Whole Hog Variation" now looks worse than the Englund Gambit. However, for scoring a full point, White still has to get a few things right.
For example: 1.c4 b6 2.d4 e6 3.e4 Bb7 4.Bd3 f5 5.exf5 Bxg2 6.Qh5+ g6 7.fxg6 Bg7 8.gxh7+ Kf8 9.Bg5 Nf6 10.Qh4 Nc6 11.Ne2 Bxh1 12.Nd2 b5!? (Basman) 13. cxb5 (the natural reply, though 13. Nf4 is also strong) 13. ... Nb4 14. Bg6, and now:

(a) 14. ... Bb7 15. Nf4 Nbd5 (better than 15. ... Ke7? 16. Nh5 Qf8 17. d5!! Nbxd5 18. Ne4 +- Flear - Plaskett, Torquay 1982) 16. Nh5 Ne7 17. Bxf6 Nxg6 18. Bxg7+ Kf7 19. Qxd8 Rhxd8 20. Rc1 Rac8 21. Bf6 Rf8 (21. ... Re8 22. Rc3) 22. Ke2 Nf4+ 23. Nxf4 Kxf6 24. Rg1 Rf7 (24. ... Rh8 25. Nh5+ Kf5 26. f4; 24. ... d6 25. Ke3 e5 26. dxe5 dxe5 27. Ne4+)

25. Ne4+!! Bxe4 (25. ... Kf5 26. Ke3 +-) 26. Rg8 Bxh7 27. Rxc8 +-, White should win (analysis from Kaissiber 33).

(b) 14. ... Ke7!? (not mentioned in Kais. 33) is interesting: 15. 0-0-0! Qb8 16. Rxh1 Qxb5 17. Ng3 Raf8 18. Re1 Nxa2+ 19. Kb1 Nc3+ 20. Kc2 Nd5 21. Nf5+ Kd8 22. Nxg7 Kc8

23. Nxe6! dxe6 24. Bh6 Qa4+ 25. Kb1 Rd8 26. Bg7 Nxh7 25. Bxh7 Qd7 28. Qh6 Rdg8 29. Bxg8 Rxh6 30. Bxh6 Kb8 31. Ne4 and White is clearly better: +/- (at least).

Objectively, the Whole Hog Variation isn't correct. But who can find 20 strong moves in a row? So I am not entirely sure whether my analysis should deter anybody from playing the WHV. If you are an expert for "miracle swindles", this might be the weapon for you.

« Last Edit: 02/20/09 at 10:05:02 by Stefan Buecker »

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RivertonKnight Junior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 73 Joined: 01/30/09	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #12 - 02/19/09 at 17:33:39	Post Tools	Print Post
	Thanks Mr Buecker, I think anyway ... It's not like I wanted the Whole Hog busted I guess if I wanted to play a pawn down and hope for a miracle swindle Speaking of pawn down Mr Buecker is the Englund Gambit completely busted yet ? Alas, of to a main line if so Thanks for saving me a beating on the board Cheers, AJ


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Papageno Senior Member Offline FM Posts: 299 Location: Germany Joined: 06/12/08 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #11 - 02/19/09 at 12:30:29	Post Tools	Print Post
	Just mentioning for the sake of completeness: Here, out lines towards white advantage started with 9.Bg5. But 9.Ne2 does the same job. Both lead to the same variations (it's always the same position after move 11). 9. Ne2 Bxh1 (9... Nf6 10. Qh4 Bxh1 11. Bg5 {is the very same.}) 10. Bg5 Nf6 11. Qh4 ±/+- For instance, a game by Shirov or Browne-Miles, 1-0, 1978 took this course.


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ANDREW BRETT God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 622 Joined: 07/07/06	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #10 - 02/19/09 at 08:02:18	Post Tools	Print Post
	Interesting stuff which kind of confirms that this line is a bit iffy for Black. Is 4.. nc6 still ok for black or has there been a flaw in that line. Separate point- we're very lucky to have Stefan with us.......Special request for Tony K - can you get Stefan to do us a one off Kings Gambit special !


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Stefan Buecker

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Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation
Reply #9 - 02/19/09 at 00:13:14

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Your main line: 1.c4 b6 2.d4 e6 3.e4 Bb7 4.Bd3 f5 5.exf5 Bxg2 6.Qh5+ g6 7.fxg6 Bg7 8.gxh7+ Kf8 9.Bg5 Nf6 10.Qh4 Nc6 11.Ne2 Bxh1 12.Nd2 Kf7 13.Nf4 Nxd4

Here you give 14.O-O-O Nf3 15.Nxf3 Bxf3 16.Bg6+ Ke7 17.Nxe6
dxe6 18.Rxd8 Rhxd8 19.Qg3 Be2 20.Qxc7+ Rd7 21.Qg3 Rd4 22.Qa3+
Kd7 23.b3 Bf3 ( 23...a6 24.Qa4+ b5 25.Qa5 =+) 24.Qa4+ Bc6 25.Qb4
Nd5 26.Qa3 Nf6 27.Bxf6 ( 27.Qb2 Nxh7 -+) ( 27.Qb4 Rh8 28.f3
Rd8 29.Qa3 Ra8 =) Bxf6 28.c5 a5 29.cxb6 Rc8 -+

The immediate check 14. Bg6+ wins, because here Black cannot play Ke7 (14. ... Ke7 15. Nh5 Qf8 16. Qxd4 +-). And if 14. ... Kf8 15. 0-0-0, Black is lost: 15. ... Bc6 (15. ... Bf3 16. Ne4; 15. ... Nf3 16. Nxf3 Bxf3 17. Nxe6+ +-; 15. ... Nf5 16. Bxf5 exf5 17. Ng6+ Kf7 18. Ne5+ Kf8 19. Bxf6 +-) 16. Ne4 Nf3 17. Nxe6+ and so on, +- (analysis from Kaissiber 33).

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RivertonKnight Junior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 73 Joined: 01/30/09	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #8 - 02/18/09 at 23:55:01	Post Tools	Print Post
	Well a-bit different It might be a try 1.c4 b6 2.d4 e6 3.e4 Bb7 4.Bd3 f5 5.exf5 Bxg2 6.Qh5+ g6 7.fxg6 Bg7 8.gxh7+ Kf8 9.Bg5 Nf6 10.Qh4 Nc6 11.Ne2 ( 11.Nd2 Bxh1 12.Ne2 Kf7 transposes below ) Bxh1 ( 11...Nb4 12.Bg6 Bxh1 13.Nbc3 Bf3 14.Nf4 Nc6 15.Ne4 Bxe4 16.Bxe4 Nxd4 17.O-O-O c5 18.Nh5 Rxh7 19.Bxf6 Bxf6 20.Qxf6+ Qxf6 21.Nxf6 Rf7 22.Nxd7+ Rxd7 23.Bxa8 Ne2+ ) 12.Nd2 ( 12.Nbc3 e5 13.O-O-O Bf3 14.Re1 exd4 15.Nd5 Bxd5 16.cxd5 Ne5 17.Bf5 Nf3 18.Qf4 Nxe1 19.Kd2 Nxd5 20.Bxd7+ Nxf4 21.Bxd8 Nf3+ 0-1, Georgopoulos Steve - Mos Ali, Australia 1993) ( 12.Nf4 e5 13.Ng6+ Kf7 14.dxe5 ( 14.Nxe5+ Nxe5 15.dxe5 Qe7 16.Bxf6 Bxf6 17.Qxf6+ Qxf6 18.exf6 Rae8+ 19.Kd2 Be4 20.Nc3 Bxh7 21.Rg1 Bxd3 22.Kxd3 Reg8 -+ ) Rxh7 15.Qf4 ( 15.Qg3 d6 16.e6+ Kxe6 17.Nf4+ Kf7 18.Bg6+ Kg8 19.Bxh7+ Kxh7 20.Qh3+ Kg8 21.Qe6+ Kh7 =+} 22.Nd2 Nd4 23.Qh3+ Kg8 24.O-O-O Bc6 =+) Rh3 16.exf6 Bxf6 17.Be2 Kxg6 18.Qg4 Bxg5 ( 18...Rh8 19.Bxf6+ Kxf6 20.Nc3 Qf8 21.f3 =+ ) 19.Qxh3 Qf6 20.Qxd7 Rf8 21.Bd3+ Kh5 22.Qh7+ Bh6 23.Be2+ Kh4 24.Nd2 ( 24.f3 Re8 25.Nd2 Nd4 26.O-O-O Rxe2 -+)Qxf2+ 25.Kd1 Qg1+ 26.Kc2 Nb4+ 27.Kb3 Qe3+ 28.Bd3 Nxd3 29.Rxh1 Qxd2 30.Qe4+ Rf4 31.Qe7+ Kh3 32.Qe6+ Rg4 33.Qxh6+ Qxh6 -+)Kf7 13.Nf4 ( 13.Ng3 Nb4 14.Bb1 Bb7 15.Nh5 Rxh7 16.Bxh7 Qh8 17.Nxf6 Bxf6 18.Bxf6 Qxf6 19.Qh5+ Ke7 20.a3 Na6 21.Be4 Rh8 =) ( 13.f3 Nb4 14.Bb1 Nc6 15.Nf4 ( 15.Kf2 Ne7 16.Bc2 Nf5 17.Qh3 Bg2 18.Qxg2 Rxh7 19.Rg1 Qh8 20.Bf4 Rh5 21.Qg6+ Kf8 22.Bxc7 Ne8 23.Bxf5 Rxf5 =+)Ne7 16.Kf2 c6 17.Kg1 Nf5 18.Bxf5 exf5 19.Bxf6 Qxf6 20.Qh5+ Ke7 21.Ng6+ Kd6 22.Kxh1 Kc7 23.Nxh8 Rxh8 24.Rg1 Qxd4 25.Qxf5 Qxb2 26.h4 Rf8 27.Qd3 Be5 28.Kg2 Rh8 29.Kh3 Bf4 30.Nf1 Qf6 31.Rg4 Bd6 32.Rg6 Qe7 33.Ne3 Be5 34.f4 Rxh7 35.fxe5 Qxh4+ 36.Kg2 Qh2+ 37.Kf1 Qxe5 38.Ng4 Qa1+ 39.Kg2 Qxa2+ 40.Kg3 Rf7 41.Rf6 Rg7 42.Qc3 =) Nxd4 14.O-O-O Nf3 ( 14...Nf5 15.Bxf5 exf5 16.Rxh1 Rxh7 17.Qg3 Qe7 18.Qd3 Qe5 19.Nf3 Qe4 20.Qb3 b5 21.cxb5+ d5 22.Rd1 Qc4+ 23.Qxc4 dxc4 24.Bxf6 ( 24.Rd4 c3 25.bxc3 Ne4 26.Rd7+ Kg8 27.Rxc7 Nxc3 =+)Bxf6 25.Rd5 ( 25.Rd7+ Kg8 =+) Kg8 26.Rxf5 Rf8 =+) 15.Nxf3 Bxf3 16.Bg6+ Ke7 17.Nxe6 dxe6 18.Rxd8 Rhxd8 19.Qg3 Be2 20.Qxc7+ Rd7 21.Qg3 Rd4 22.Qa3+ Kd7 23.b3 Bf3 ( 23...a6 24.Qa4+ b5 25.Qa5 =+) 24.Qa4+ Bc6 25.Qb4 Nd5 26.Qa3 Nf6 27.Bxf6 ( 27.Qb2 Nxh7 -+) ( 27.Qb4 Rh8 28.f3 Rd8 29.Qa3 Ra8 =) Bxf6 28.c5 a5 29.cxb6 Rc8 -+ Thanks, AJ


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Stefan Buecker God Member Offline Posts: 1386 Location: Germany Joined: 02/11/09 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #7 - 02/18/09 at 23:13:17	Post Tools	Print Post
	9. Bg5 Nf6 10. Qh4 Bxh1 11. Ne2 Bf3 (Otto Hardy) 12. Nf4 Nc6 13. Nd2 Bg4 14. Ng6+! Kf7 15. Ne5+ Nxe5 16. dxe5 Bf5 17. Bxf5 exf5 18. exf6 Bxf6 19. Qh5+ Kg7 20. Qh6+ Kf7 21. Nf3! (Alex Yermolinsky's improvement upon 21. Qh5+ Kg7 22. Qh6+ draw, Baginskaite - Miles, Philadelphia 1999) 21. ... Qe8+ 22. Kf1 Bg7 23. Qh4! and a few more moves, +- (analysis by Odessky). The main alternatives to Hardy's move are 11...Nc6 12. Nd2! b5!? (Basman) and 11...Qe7, and I worked hard to find a rescue for Black, but without success.


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RivertonKnight Junior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 73 Joined: 01/30/09	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #6 - 02/18/09 at 03:21:01	Post Tools	Print Post
	I would be interested in what Kaissiber 33 (2008) has to say about this line. I've done abit of work on the whole hog 1.d4 e6 2 c4 b6 3 e4 Bb7 4 Bd3 f5 5 ef Bg2 6 Qh5 g6 7 fg Bg7 8 gh Kf8 if you could carry on from here abit as to what is the refutation? Thanks, AJ


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Stefan Buecker God Member Offline Posts: 1386 Location: Germany Joined: 02/11/09 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #5 - 02/13/09 at 15:49:45	Post Tools	Print Post
	The wild 1. c4 e6 2. d4 b6 (English Defence) 3. e4 Bb7 4. Bd3 f5 5. exf5 Bxg2?! was called "Whole Hog Variation" by Michael Basman. There have been several attempts to rescue the idea for Black, e. g. Odessky's "English Defence" (2008), where it was studied on 30 pages. Unfortunately, it doesn't work - cf. Kaissiber 33 [2008], p. 29. In the same issue, Maurits Wind analyzes 5...Bb4+ in great detail, which leads to great complications.


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MNb God Member Offline Rudolf Spielmann forever Posts: 10780 Location: Moengo Joined: 01/05/04 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #4 - 01/08/09 at 01:50:51	Post Tools	Print Post
	1.e4 b6 2.d4 Bb7 3.Bd3 f5? is a forced loss as pointed out by the Dutch corr. player Guido den Broeder almost 30 years ago. His analysis is not that well-known, if somebody is interested I can look it up. After 3.c4 e6 4.Bd3 f5 his refutation is prevented (key square f5), though it remains suspect. His analysis also can be used with colours reversed after 1.b4 e5 2.a3 (or 2.b5) d5 3.Bb2 Bd6 4.f4? exf4.

	The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged. GC Lichtenberg
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HgMan God Member Offline Demand me nothing: What you know, you know Posts: 2330 Location: Up on Cripple Creek Joined: 11/09/04 Gender:	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #3 - 01/08/09 at 00:21:15	Post Tools	Print Post
	Miki wrote on 01/07/09 at 18:49:09: You are probably thinking of this line: 1.d4 e6 2.c4 b6 3.e4 Bb7 4.Bd3 and now Bauer says that black has 3 options: 4...Nc6 or 4...Bb4 => solid but passive 4...f5 => very wild, and Bauer's preference (even though he is not sure who ends up better out of the complications) He analyses it in game 44 in the book (Burnett - Kraai, 2004) Btw, I prefer this move order: 1.d4 b6 2.c4 Bb7 but it gives white some other options and black doesn't have Bb4 at his disposal. That sounds about right--thank you --although the Bb4 line followed by f5 is possible (or vice versa). I remember a couple of rollicking good analysis sessions...

	"Luck favours the prepared mind." --Louis Pasteur
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Miki Junior Member Offline Posts: 55 Joined: 11/10/08	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #2 - 01/07/09 at 18:49:09	Post Tools	Print Post
	You are probably thinking of this line: 1.d4 e6 2.c4 b6 3.e4 Bb7 4.Bd3 and now Bauer says that black has 3 options: 4...Nc6 or 4...Bb4 => solid but passive 4...f5 => very wild, and Bauer's preference (even though he is not sure who ends up better out of the complications) He analyses it in game 44 in the book (Burnett - Kraai, 2004) Btw, I prefer this move order: 1.d4 b6 2.c4 Bb7 but it gives white some other options and black doesn't have Bb4 at his disposal.


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kylemeister God Member Offline Posts: 4989 Location: USA Joined: 10/24/05	Re: Owen Whole Hog Variation Reply #1 - 01/07/09 at 18:17:47	Post Tools	Print Post
	Don't know about Bauer's book, but I thought 3...f5 had been established as losing, and that even its counterpart in the English Defense was supposed to be bad. Oh, I see that your Owen = my English.


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HgMan God Member Offline Demand me nothing: What you know, you know Posts: 2330 Location: Up on Cripple Creek Joined: 11/09/04 Gender:	Owen Whole Hog Variation 01/07/09 at 17:57:17	Post Tools	Print Post
	I'm tilting at windmills a little here in asking for help with little info to provide... Almost 15 years ago, I was introduced to the Whole Hog Variation of the Owen in Ireland. I don't remember a great deal about it. White opened with e4,d4,c4,Bd3 and Black played an early ...f5, which led to all kinds of chaos. White gets a tumultuous kingside attack going, wins tons of material and exposes the Black king, but I seem to remember thinking that we couldn't find a win and that once the dust settled, Black was actually better. Does this ring any bells? Does anything like this appear in Christian Bauer's book? Thanks (and apologies) in advance...

	"Luck favours the prepared mind." --Louis Pasteur
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