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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Yusupov's Colle (Read 37303 times)
MarinFan
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #32 - 05/21/12 at 12:38:24
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Reading this thread the interesting thing for me, was black is ok in the d5, c5 and Nc6 setup because many white's are happy to see this, thinking Ne5 at somepoint will be strong.

Eingorn in recent book recommends this too, one of his main lines being that which Ametanoitos posted earlier.
  
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Gorath
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #31 - 03/27/11 at 14:05:44
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Flear reviews it in NiC YB 98:

"Indeed the main focus of attention is the middlegame battle, and how the chosen methods of development have consequences deep into the game. Attacking schemes are outlined, as are defensive set-ups. The result is a much more even-handed effort than many 'system or repertoire book'. "
negative: In a few places the analysis is too chaotic. Too much and too many brackets.

"So summing up, although 90% of Grigory Bogdanovich's book is excellent, I'm left with the impression that with a little more effort from the presentation team they could have got closer to 100%."
  
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ruhroh
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #30 - 03/25/11 at 17:21:25
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Ok, I can answer my own question. I think Bogdanov's book is very very good. Not overly optimistic, but not defeatist either. Detailed annotated games structured in thematic sections for Black and White. Pure Zukertort - no antis, and no repertoire advice. Definitely not a first book for the opening - it's not organized to learn the opening for someone unfamiliar with it - but terrific supplemental material to gain a deep understanding subsequently. Decades of IM experience in an opening shared in a book.
  
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ruhroh
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #29 - 01/15/11 at 23:05:30
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Anyone read Bogdanovich's Zukertort System book? Care to comment on it?
  
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HoemberChess
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #28 - 10/25/10 at 10:30:07
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Yusupov's Bulid Up Your Chess, Vol #3 (Mastery) from 2009 has a chapter on the C-Z, as a suggested way of meeting 1..Nf6 2.Nf3 e6, which is actually the only move-order by which I can be persuaded to play 3.e3.

The first stupid question. I know that some of Rudel's books on the C-Z are more recent than, for example, Palliser's Starting Out: d-Pawn Openings (C-Z, Barry, 150, etc), and even include references to the earlier work.
I may have asked this once. ( Undecided ) How good are the books by Rudel? What is the target audience? Is he a strong player? (I have not really read any of his books, except for a few pages.)

(My last three consecutive games in this season of the team championship started with 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 e6 3.e3, so I am forced to study more and more. The opponents didn't know the good set-ups, even a 2300-FM erred with 8..d6 (instead of 8..d5) against the Classical QID, and had to think long over the board.)
« Last Edit: 10/25/10 at 11:50:49 by HoemberChess »  

as
*W 1d4) Torre/Barry/Pirc/Philidor/ early _d5:early c4(QGD/Slav/QGD/etc)
*B) 1e4:e6 [+1_c5 2Nf3 a6]| 1d4:e6 2c4 Bb4+ BID/pseudoNID [+1_Nf6 NID]| 1c4:c5,_Nc6,_e5,_g6| 1Nf3:c5
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Ametanoitos
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #27 - 05/10/10 at 21:59:40
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Yes, of course this is equal. I don't claim an advantage for Black here. I have never faced the Colle by a stronger opponent. I always won lower rated players but everytime quite easy it's the truth. Two of them have allowed the exch sac with Rxc2 because they thought it just gives away material.
  
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GMTonyKosten
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #26 - 05/07/10 at 14:27:08
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Ametanoitos wrote on 03/26/10 at 23:16:18:
I have always used the line
1. d4 d5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. e3 e6 4. Bd3 c5 5. b3 Nc6 6. Bb2 Bd6 7. O-O O-O 8. Nbd2 b6 9. Ne5 Bb7 10. a3 cxd4 11. exd4 Ne7 followed by Rc8-Rc7-Qc8-g6-Ne8-f6 etc and win game after game after game....Players with White seem to be surprized by the way they always lose

I agree with Pantu that this is only equal, of course, but it does illustrate the importance of having a coherent plan in chess. Smiley
I annotated a couple of recent Colle games of mine on Eric's April update, and also completely updated the playable Colle eBook! Smiley
Get it while it's hot! Wink
  
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Pantu
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #25 - 05/06/10 at 19:08:07
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Ametanoitos wrote on 03/26/10 at 23:16:18:
I have always used the line
1. d4 d5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. e3 e6 4. Bd3 c5 5. b3 Nc6 6. Bb2 Bd6 7. O-O O-O 8. Nbd2 b6 9. Ne5 Bb7 10. a3 cxd4 11. exd4 Ne7 followed by Rc8-Rc7-Qc8-g6-Ne8-f6 etc and win game after game after game....Players with White seem to be surprized by the way they always lose and i keep hearing the same words in the post mortems :"...but my book says that this cxd4 variation is not good! I cannot understand!...." and i always explain to them: "the problem is not with the books, the problem is with the opening!". It's better to stay away from the CZ and use your time studying something else! Grin


Interesting line although I'd suggest that's just equal, especially as it is a reversed QID: 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 b6 4.e3 Bb7 5.Bd3 d5 6.cxd5 exd5 7.O-O Bd6 8.Nc3 O-O 9.b3 a6 10.Bb2 Nbd7 11.Rc1 Qe7 12.Ne2 Ne4

The funny thing is that white is often recommended to transpose from the Colle Zukertort to the 4 e3 QID unless black is aiming for this "Colle Zukertort" setup which white then avoids i.e.

1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 e6 3.e3 b6 4.Bd3 Bb7 5.O-O d5
    ( 5...c5 6.c4 $5 )
    ( 5...Be7 6.c4 )
6.b3
    ( 6.c4 Bd6 7 cxd5 exd5 { etc transposes to the above line which is considered absolutely fine for black.} )

Although I guess if you really are happy with Black's position in that line you should be playing the 4 e3 QID as much as possible as white has decent chances for an advantage if black avoids this setup!

But on the other hand, black QID players will handle the game in a more balanced way than white C-Z players throwing everything at the queenside.
  
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GMTonyKosten
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #24 - 05/06/10 at 12:29:40
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[quote author=252C3175727672410 link=1241400065/10#10 date=1248876525]
After 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 e6 3.e3 d5 4.Bd3 c5 5.b3 Nc6 6.0-0 Bd6 7.Bb2 0-0 8.Nbd2 Qe7

Both Susan Polgar's and Aaron Sumerscale's DVDs don't deal with Black's threat of ... Qc7. Nigel Davies' DVD does. He says that after Black plays his Q to e7 White should consider playing c2-c4, heading for a hanging pawn position. The reason being Black's Q is not putting pressure on White's weak hanging pawns and will have to relocate, thus losing time.[/quote]
Surely the queen is well placed on e7, why would she need to relocate anywhere?
  
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Ametanoitos
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #23 - 03/26/10 at 23:16:18
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I have always used the line
1. d4 d5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. e3 e6 4. Bd3 c5 5. b3 Nc6 6. Bb2 Bd6 7. O-O O-O 8. Nbd2 b6 9. Ne5 Bb7 10. a3 cxd4 11. exd4 Ne7 followed by Rc8-Rc7-Qc8-g6-Ne8-f6 etc and win game after game after game....Players with White seem to be surprized by the way they always lose and i keep hearing the same words in the post mortems :"...but my book says that this cxd4 variation is not good! I cannot understand!...." and i always explain to them: "the problem is not with the books, the problem is with the opening!". It's better to stay away from the CZ and use your time studying something else! Grin
  
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Schroeder
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #22 - 03/26/10 at 22:58:10
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There is a new edition of Zuke 'Em - The Colle-Zukertort Revolutionized:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/188871039X?ie=UTF8&tag=asolattcheope-20&linkCod...

Several excerpts can be found in the ZukeDukes Forum: http://www.zuke-dukes.com/forum/index.php
  
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rooksway18
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #21 - 08/22/09 at 07:49:25
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BPaulsen wrote on 07/30/09 at 15:41:10:
TicklyTim wrote on 07/29/09 at 14:17:34:
Maybe it won't catch on at top level, as it's difficult to reach.
1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.e3 and black perhaps has better options than 3..e6.
And with 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 e6 3.e3 black can remain flexible with BPaulsen2 type moves (..c5, ..b6) which isn't a very critical line for black to face.
Elite players are going to be happy to face these lesser options.

If playing at a lower level, or a strong GM vs lesser opponent, then these options might be viable.

Club players seem to play what white wants to see, so it will probably remain very popular at that level.


Against ...c5/...b6 white can switch off to a Colle-Koltanowski, and black actually has significant problems to solve after the critical 8. e4!

Black's best bet (after 1. d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 e6 3. e3) is the d5/c5/Nc6, etc. set-up. Even if the white player enjoys the positions he gets they're still equal with best play.


In this move order black's first 9 moves seemed very effective if he flicks in ...d5 to go along with ...c5 and ...b6 (maybe this is where your saying to play the Zuckertort instead, since there is an early ...d5):

1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf5 3.e3 e6 4.Bd3 c5 5.c3 Nc6 6.Nbd2 Be7 7.00 b6 then 8.Ne5 Nxe5 9.fxe5 Nd7 10.f4

you can view the game Kamsky-Prie(!), which transposes into this line, at:

http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1066590

Palliser gives 10...c4 as a possibility for black which he says Prie used in a later game.

1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf5 3.e3 e6 4.Bd3 c5 5.c3 Nc6 6.Nbd2 Be7 7.dxc5 Bxc5 8.00 e5 9.e4 does not look like a good way for white to avoid transposing into this game, due to 9...dxe4 (9...Bg4 look nice for black too).

So is 8.Ne5 white's only decent move if he wants to play the Kolty-Colle against this line?
« Last Edit: 08/23/09 at 00:09:59 by rooksway18 »  
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BPaulsen
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #20 - 07/31/09 at 21:45:08
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TicklyTim wrote on 07/31/09 at 13:17:26:
BPaulsen wrote on 07/30/09 at 15:41:10:
Against ...c5/...b6 white can switch off to a Colle-Koltanowski, and black actually has significant problems to solve after the critical 8. e4!

Black's best bet (after 1. d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 e6 3. e3) is the d5/c5/Nc6, etc. set-up. Even if the white player enjoys the positions he gets they're still equal with best play.


After 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 e6 3.e3 b6 I expected white to play 4.c4 to transpose into some minor BPaulsen5 line.
What is your critical 8.e4 after?


1. d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 e6 3. e3 b6 4. Bd3 Bb7 5. 0-0 c5 6. Nbd2 Be7 7. c3 Nc6 8. e4!

White has seen tremendous improvements, and in the critical variation black's position is just awful (and white's score, not surprisingly, very good).
  

2288 USCF, 2186 FIDE.

FIDE based on just 27 games.
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #19 - 07/31/09 at 19:42:25
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[quote author=nmga link=1241400065/0#8 date=1248771026]Standard C-Z is also very interesting, but I'd like to ask what any of you who play it may have against the equalising line of Cabrilo--Kovacevic (8 ... Qe7 9 Ne5 cd 10 ed Qc7). Or do you deviate earlier?[/quote]
Good question! I'm still using the stuff for Black that I looked at on Eric's section a while ago and still winning game after game!!
  
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Re: Yusupov's Colle
Reply #18 - 07/31/09 at 19:28:41
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Antillian wrote on 07/31/09 at 14:06:50:
I got a question for you Colle players. I am a Queen's gambit player who would like to play the Colle as an occasional surprise weapon against weaker players. If I had to buy one book, what would you suggest?

I no longer play OTB (USCF:1951) because of my busy work schedule but that opening is one of my favorites and still use it on ICC (DionTheGreek).

Following are my sources that use to learn the opening and from time to time I go over them and find something new and exciting.

p.s. My first book and inspiration to the opening was by Gary Lane and the latest source is the DVD by Susan Polgar.

Hope that helps.

Zuke 'Em-The Colle Zukertort Revolutionized by David I Rudel  http://www.amazon.com/Zuke-Colle-Zukertort-Revolutionized-bullet-proofed/dp/1888...

The Colle System by Nigel Davies (DVD) http://www.amazon.com/The-Colle-System-Chess-DVD/dp/3866810830/ref=sr_1_12?ie=UT...

Starting Out: d-Pawn Attacks: The Colle-Zukertort, Barry and 150 Attacks by Richard Pallister http://www.amazon.com/Starting-Out-d-Pawn-Attacks-Colle-Zukertort/dp/1857445783/...

Learn the Opening the Easy Way: The Colle-Zukertort System by Suzan Polgar (DVD) http://www.amazon.com/Learn-Opening-Easy-Way-Colle-Zukertort/dp/B000MSWTMW/ref=s...

The Ultimate Colle by Gary Lane http://www.amazon.com/Ultimate-Colle-Gary-Lane/dp/0713486864/ref=sr_1_17?ie=UTF8...

A Killer Chess Opening Repertoire by Aaron Summerscale http://www.amazon.com/Killer-Chess-Opening-Repertoire-Cadogan/dp/1857445198/ref=...


  
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