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ChessPub Forum › Chess Publishing Openings › Dragon Sicilians › Yugoslav 9 Bc4 › Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4

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Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4 (Read 3693 times)

AZ YaBB Newbies Offline Posts: 12 Joined: 07/16/09	Re: Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4 Reply #7 - 07/20/09 at 14:29:09	Post Tools	Print Post
	As I looked a little deeper in the discussed positions, I think that it is better to stick to Be6-d5 plan. 19...f5 seems to be insufficient for black. After your proposal: 20.Rb1 play might continue: 20...fxe4 21.fxe4 Bh3 (with threat of Bg2) 22.Rhe1 Rc8 23.Rb3 a5 (to spoil white's consolidation) 24.Kb1 a4 25.Rb4 Be6 26.Qa3 Bxc4 27.Qxa4 Bf7 28.Bd2! (with c3 following) Qc5 29.c3 Be5 30.Rb7 Bf4 (in order to grab g5 pawn in the near future) 31.Bxf4 Nxf4 32.Re3! Qxg5 33.Rg3 Qf6 (33...Qh5? 34.Nf5 +-) 34.Qb5 +/- with Rb8 or Qg5/f5 in mind. After 19...Be6 20.Rb1 d5 the most challenging for black is in my opinion 21.c5 but I still think that black has good chances in complicated position arising after 21...dxe4 22.fxe4 Qe5 (here is the difference between 19...f5 and 19...Be6-20...d5 plan, in the second variation black queen has better access to weak e4 pawn and has h2-b8 diagonal in a disposal) (22...Nf4!?).

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bragesjo God Member Offline CCE at ICCF 2021 and CCM at ICCF 2023 Posts: 1829 Location: Eskilstuna Joined: 06/30/06 Gender:	Re: Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4 Reply #6 - 07/19/09 at 09:10:27	Post Tools	Print Post
	f5 looks interesting, black gets some compensation even after the critical Rb1 but I am not shure if he gets enough.


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AZ YaBB Newbies Offline Posts: 12 Joined: 07/16/09	Re: Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4 Reply #5 - 07/18/09 at 11:36:12	Post Tools	Print Post
	Sorry about the game. It should be: J Deepan Chakkravarthy (2464) - Ponnuswamy Konguvel (2415) Nagpur ch-Commonweath 2008 (9) 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 g6 6. Be3 Bg7 7.f3 O-O 8. Qd2 Nc6 9. Bc4 Bd7 10.O-O-O Rc8 11. Bb3 Ne5 12. Kb1 Nc4 13. Bxc4 Rxc4 14.g4 b5 15.b3 b4 16.bxc4 bxc3 17. Qxc3 Qc7 18.g5 Nh5 19. Ka1 f5 20. Bc1 fxe4 21.fxe4 Bg4 22. Rd2 Qc5 23. Bb2 Qxg5 24. Rb1 Rf4 25.c5 Qxc5 26. Qxc5 dxc5 27. Nc6 Rxe4 28. Bxg7 Nxg7 29. Rb7 Kf7 30. Rxa7 Nf5 31. Ra5 c4 32. Ne5+ Kf6 33. Nxg4+ Rxg4 34. Re2 Rf4 35. Ra6+ Kg5 36. Kb2 Kg4 37.a4 Kf3 38. Re5 Rh4 39. Rc6 Rxh2 40. Rxc4 Rd2 41.a5 h5 42.a6 Rd7 43. Ra4 Ra7 44. Rb5 Nd6 45. Rg5 h4 46. Rxg6 h3 47. Ra3+ Kf2 48. Rxh3 Rxa6 49. Rgg3 Nc4+ 50. Kb1 e5 51. Rc3 Ra4 52. Rh2+ Ke1 53. Rh1+ Ke2 54. Rh2+ Ke1 55. Rch3 e4 56. Rh1+ Kd2 57. R1h2+ Kd1 58. Rh1+ Kd2 59. R3h2+ Kc3 60. Rd1 Ne5 61. Re2 Rb4+ 62. Kc1 Ra4 63. Re3+ Nd3+ 64. Rdxd3+ ½-½

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AZ YaBB Newbies Offline Posts: 12 Joined: 07/16/09	Re: Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4 Reply #4 - 07/18/09 at 11:19:00	Post Tools	Print Post
	Yeah, you are right. I can't find any games on Be6-d5 plan. There aren't many games on 15.b3 b4 either. Among them interesting one seems to be J. D. Chakkravarthy (2464) - P. Konguvel (2415) played at Nagpur ch-Commonweath 2008 where after 19.Ka1 black played surprising at first sight 19...f5. The logic is to fight for better days for Nh5. I haven't checked correctness of the move with a comp yet but black succeeded in freeing the knight and scored draw. J Deepan Chakkravarthy (2464) - Ponnuswamy Konguvel (2415) Nagpur ch-Commonweath 2008 (9) 1.e4 c5 2. f3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4. xd4 f6 5. c3 g6 6. e3 g7 7.f3 O-O 8. d2 c6 9. c4 d7 10.O-O-O c8 11. b3 e5 12. b1 c4 13. xc4 xc4 14.g4 b5 15.b3 b4 16.bxc4 bxc3 17. xc3 c7 18.g5 h5 19. a1 f5 20. c1 fxe4 21.fxe4 g4 22. d2 c5 23. b2 xg5 24. b1 f4 25.c5 xc5 26. xc5 dxc5 27. c6 xe4 28. xg7 xg7 29. b7 f7 30. xa7 f5 31. a5 c4 32. e5+ f6 33. xg4+ xg4 34. e2 f4 35. a6+ g5 36. b2 g4 37.a4 f3 38. e5 h4 39. c6 xh2 40. xc4 d2 41.a5 h5 42.a6 d7 43. a4 a7 44. b5 d6 45. g5 h4 46. xg6 h3 47. a3+ f2 48. xh3 xa6 49. gg3 c4+ 50. b1 e5 51. c3 a4 52. h2+ e1 53. h1+ e2 54. h2+ e1 55. ch3 e4 56. h1+ d2 57. 1h2+ d1 58. h1+ d2 59. 3h2+ c3 60. d1 e5 61. e2 b4+ 62. c1 a4 63. e3+ d3+ 64. dxd3+ ½-½

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bragesjo God Member Offline CCE at ICCF 2021 and CCM at ICCF 2023 Posts: 1829 Location: Eskilstuna Joined: 06/30/06 Gender:	Re: Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4 Reply #3 - 07/18/09 at 09:22:44	Post Tools	Print Post
	About Nc4 line, my trainer knows GM Pontus Carlsson and when we discussed the line he said that Pontus also had found Be6 + d5 plan and and thought that it was playable. What scares me is that I have not seen any games in that line at all...


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AZ YaBB Newbies Offline Posts: 12 Joined: 07/16/09	Re: Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4 Reply #2 - 07/17/09 at 20:55:53	Post Tools	Print Post
	Thank you bragesjo. It seems that I should take a closer look at 12...Re8. Still, I have a trust in your 19...Be6 (in place of 19...Be5 in above game) followed by 20...d5. I haven't found anything wrong with this plan. Are there any games on it available?

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bragesjo God Member Offline CCE at ICCF 2021 and CCM at ICCF 2023 Posts: 1829 Location: Eskilstuna Joined: 06/30/06 Gender:	Re: Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4 Reply #1 - 07/17/09 at 16:10:38	Post Tools	Print Post
	Re8 is the most solid line but it also gives white the most options. Many lines that are harmless in standard Soltis (and some other moves instead of h4) are stronger. Khalfimans recommendation agianst it in the Opening for White Anands series is totally useless for white in a side note where black plays Rxh1 (instead of traditional e5) followed by Kf7 and after a unmentioen exchange sac some moves later only black can win. One drawback is that in the Leko-Carlsen line black is more or less forced to sac a pawn but fortunnely I think that there are black improvments there (and not only white improvments). a6 cuts out many of whites options but the move Nd5 (after h2h4 h7h5) might be a problem. Drawbacks are that black most play accurate since whites attack is quite strong. Khalifmans recommendatied improvment over Topalov-Carlsen might have been neutralized by a exchange sac, resulting in an unclear position. Still the line is very sharp and there might be improvments for both sides. Nc4 is a interesting line. Black gets lots of play in most lines. However the line 1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 g6 6. Be3 Bg7 7. f3 O-O 8. Qd2 Nc6 9. Bc4 Bd7 10. Bb3 Rc8 11. O-O-O Ne5 12. Kb1 Nc4 13. Bxc4 Rxc4 14. g4 b5 15. b3 b4 16. bxc4 bxc3 17. Qxc3 Qc7 18. g5 Nh5 19. Ka1 {might be a problem} * EDIT abotu Nc4 line can show a game from Swedish Elite where black was crushed. [Event "Elit(Farsta-Manhem)"] [Site "?"] [Date "2008.12.05"] [Round "3"] [White "Nithander, Victor"] [Black "Magnusson, Jorgen"] [Result "1-0"] [ECO "B78"] [WhiteElo "2436"] [BlackElo "2295"] [PlyCount "81"] [EventDate "2008.??.??"] 1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 g6 6. Be3 Bg7 7. f3 Nc6 8. Qd2 O-O 9. Bc4 Bd7 10. O-O-O Rc8 11. Bb3 Ne5 12. Kb1 Nc4 13. Bxc4 Rxc4 14. g4 b5 15. b3 b4 16. bxc4 bxc3 17. Qxc3 Qc7 18. g5 Nh5 19. Ka1 Be5 20. Rb1 Rc8 21. Rb2 Qxc4 22. Qxc4 Rxc4 23. Rd1 Ba4 24. Rd2 Nf4 25. Kb1 Rc7 26. Rb4 Bd7 27. Rb8+ Kg7 28. Ne2 Nxe2 29. Rxe2 a6 30. Rd2 Rc4 31. f4 Bc3 32. Rd3 e5 33. Rb3 Bd4 34. Bxd4 exd4 35. Rd2 Bb5 36. a3 Ra4 37. Kb2 Bc6 38. Rb4 Rxb4+ 39. axb4 Bxe4 40. Rxd4 d5 41. c4 1-0


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AZ YaBB Newbies Offline Posts: 12 Joined: 07/16/09	Best after 12. Kb1: 12...Re8, 12...a6 or 12...Nc4 07/16/09 at 10:22:58	Post Tools	Print Post
	What is the best way of playing after 12.Kb1 (after 9.Bc4 Bd7 10.0-0-0 Rc8 11.Bb3 Ne5)? What are the pros and cons of 12...Re8, 12...a6 and 12...Nc4? 1) I've never liked Re8 in the Soltis, so it isn't my favourite. 2) Carlsen's 12...a6 looks odd at first but it is interesting. 3) I'm a fan of 12...Nc4 though, because I like black's chances after 13.Bxc4 Rxc4 14.g4 b5 15.b3 b4(!). Are there any problems for black in this line? Thanks for sharing your opinions. BTW, it is my first post here but I'm a longtime follower of threads and a big Dragon enthusiast.

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