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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3 (Read 13629 times)
Lauri Torni
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #12 - 09/26/14 at 09:10:25
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Anders wrote on 09/16/14 at 19:15:11:
Ramirez have coverage of 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 c5 3.d5 b5 from Black's perspective in his ChessBase DVD Benko 2.

Burgess analyze from White´s point of view in "A Cunning Opening Repertoire for White.  He think´s it is quite OK for Black though if I remember right.


4.-Ne4 gives white an advantage. Best is 4.-Qb6 5.Bxf6 Qxf6 6.c3 Qb6 when white is at most slighly better (Burgess, Ramirez)
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #11 - 09/16/14 at 19:15:11
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Ramirez have coverage of 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 c5 3.d5 b5 from Black's perspective in his ChessBase DVD Benko 2.

Burgess analyze from White´s point of view in "A Cunning Opening Repertoire for White.  He think´s it is quite OK for Black though if I remember right.
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #10 - 09/12/14 at 08:54:32
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IsaVulpes wrote on 09/11/14 at 21:28:48:
TN wrote on 09/19/09 at 01:01:19:
One of the most popular answers to 2.Nf3 for Benko players is 2...c5 3.d5 b5, which can either transpose to a Benko after 4.c4, or gives Black good counterplay after 4.Bg5 Qb6 5.Nc3 b4!.

Are there any resources on this line to be found somewhere? 
Does it have a name? It seems to be just listed as "Old Benoni", which doesn't help too much.
How would it continue? At first glance, I end with 6.Na4 Qa5 7.b3 Ba6 8.e3 Bf1:, which does seem to be something I'd like to play.

This looks rather interesting - but also *ripe* with possibilities (Houdini wants to play 4.e4 Cheesy Which.. I will most likely not meet OTB) - perhaps too ripe, as I'm a bit lost. 
I figure the purpose of ..Qb6 is to protect the b5 pawn, and is done over ..a6 to get an overall faster development - or to keep the a6 square free for a Bishop/Knight, or because I plan an early queenside offense with ..a5? 

What about 4. ..Ne4? It seems to score better and have much less drawish tendencies according to some databases, but obviously those numbers are to be taken with a few grains of salt, considering the sample size of this position is .. rather low.

What is White's idea? Bf6: followed by an attack against a king that's either stuck in the center or castled into an open G-File? Would I even retake the Knight with gf6:..

I'm not really sure of either players plan/ideas/anything in this position; so any piece of help would be very welcome.


I remember when I studied these lines I used a few Yearbook Surveys (you can look them up on New In Chess's website). In the 5...b4 line there were a few key games by Tregubov who is probably the leading expert on these lines for Black. Pedersen's recommendation in his Benko Gambit book was to indeed play 4...Ne4 followed by 5...Bb7, to avoid the damaging of your pawn structure that would raise after 4...Bb7 5.Bxf6. These lines are very concrete and so it's not easy to come up with general principles, especially as both sides need to be a bit creative with how they get their pieces out. 

PS I recall Johnsen's update of Summerscale's 'A Killer Chess Opening Repertoire for White' claimed a small pull for White after 4...Qb6 5.Bxf6 Qxf6 6.c3. I did some work on this line a long time ago and felt it was equal, but somewhat easier for White to play in practice.
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #9 - 09/11/14 at 21:28:48
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TN wrote on 09/19/09 at 01:01:19:
One of the most popular answers to 2.Nf3 for Benko players is 2...c5 3.d5 b5, which can either transpose to a Benko after 4.c4, or gives Black good counterplay after 4.Bg5 Qb6 5.Nc3 b4!.

Are there any resources on this line to be found somewhere? 
Does it have a name? It seems to be just listed as "Old Benoni", which doesn't help too much.
How would it continue? At first glance, I end with 6.Na4 Qa5 7.b3 Ba6 8.e3 Bf1:, which does seem to be something I'd like to play.

This looks rather interesting - but also *ripe* with possibilities (Houdini wants to play 4.e4 Cheesy Which.. I will most likely not meet OTB) - perhaps too ripe, as I'm a bit lost. 
I figure the purpose of ..Qb6 is to protect the b5 pawn, and is done over ..a6 to get an overall faster development - or to keep the a6 square free for a Bishop/Knight, or because I plan an early queenside offense with ..a5? 

What about 4. ..Ne4? It seems to score better and have much less drawish tendencies according to some databases, but obviously those numbers are to be taken with a few grains of salt, considering the sample size of this position is .. rather low.

What is White's idea? Bf6: followed by an attack against a king that's either stuck in the center or castled into an open G-File? Would I even retake the Knight with gf6:..

I'm not really sure of either players plan/ideas/anything in this position; so any piece of help would be very welcome.
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #8 - 07/21/10 at 10:36:48
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Thats an interesting option I had not considered - although there is something about the line:
1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 g6 3.c4 c5 4.Nc3 cxd4 5.Nxd4 d5 6.cxd5 Nxd5 7.Ndb5 Nxc3 8.Qxd8+ Kxd8 9.Nxc3 which leaves me a bit cold, nevertheless that endgame should be defensible I suppose, so its a viable option.
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #7 - 07/21/10 at 09:52:50
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Keano wrote on 07/21/10 at 09:34:49:
the real "problem" with 2...g6 I see is that Black must be prepared to enter the Maroczy which is an opening in its own right - solid but maybe not to all tastes.

1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 g6 3.c4 c5 4.Nc3 cxd4 5.Nxd4 d5 is a more or less independent option.
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #6 - 07/21/10 at 09:34:49
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That is the way Kiril Georgiev prefers to enter the b6 lines in his book "Squeezing the gambits", although its also true the lines are playable for Black.

Going back to the original question its really down to taste and repertoire - the real "problem" with 2...g6 I see is that Black must be prepared to enter the Maroczy which is an opening in its own right - solid but maybe not to all tastes. Otherwise I agree 2...c5 followed by ...b5 is the way to go, where we enter more random/bizarre/uncharted territory....
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #5 - 09/19/09 at 08:59:05
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So is there still a possibility to transpose into a benko after
1.d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 g6 3. c4 c5 4.d5 b5
or why is it said benko wouldn't be possible after 2.Nf3?

It is possible, but white can push black into lesser lines of the Benko. I am no expert, but iirc the lines where white goes b6 or even bxa6 are less good for black with Nf3 and g6 thrown in than without.
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #4 - 09/19/09 at 06:58:14
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Finally, if you have a broad repertoire, you can meet 2.Nf3 with 2...d5. Even if you don't play 1...d5 as Black, you can add this to your repertoire against players whom you are certain will not play 3.c4.


That would be also my recommendation. Almost every player playing 2.Nf3 won't play 3.c4 (I would even say 100% for low rated player).
They will either answer 2 ... c5 with e3 or most probably with c3.

If you play 2...d5, the 3 moves which you will face will be 3.Bf4 (a lot), 3.Bg5, 3.e3

Against these systems, the books mentionned earlier are good references, and it's quite easy to have an advantage after the opening.

This is of course valid for under 2200. Above you might still need to know some other lines like QGA, QGD, slav, since you might face 3.c4
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #3 - 09/19/09 at 01:01:19
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Quote:
So is there still a possibility to transpose into a benko after
1.d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 g6 3. c4 c5 4.d5 b5
or why is it said benko wouldn't be possible after 2.Nf3?


In my opinion, playing 2...g6 isn't the best option for a Benko player without a lot of familiarity with the KID. You have to know how to meet 3.Bg5, 3.Bf4, 3.e3, 3.Nc3 and 3.c4 c5 4.Nc3/e3, which involves a lot of study.

One of the most popular answers to 2.Nf3 for Benko players is 2...c5 3.d5 b5, which can either transpose to a Benko after 4.c4, or gives Black good counterplay after 4.Bg5 Qb6 5.Nc3 b4!. You still have to know how to meet 3.c3, but against this you can either play 3...d5 and learn how to deal with the Torre, London and Colle (if you have Rizzitano's 'How to Beat 1.d4' you can use this source), or play 3...e6 and accept a transposition to the 2...e6 London, Torre or Colle. If you own Cox's 'Dealing with d4 Deviations' you will find some good antidotes for Black. 

Another (less common) option is to play 2...e6, and meet 3.c4 with either 3...c5 4.d5 b5!?, the Blumenfeld Gambit, or the 'Anti-Anti-Benko' 3...a6!?, which often leads to Benko-like positions after ...c5 d5 b5 and is fully playable in spite of its rarity in tournament play. Again you have to know how to meet 3...c5 4.e3/4.Nc3, but if you have Cox's book this won't trouble you. 

Finally, if you have a broad repertoire, you can meet 2.Nf3 with 2...d5. Even if you don't play 1...d5 as Black, you can add this to your repertoire against players whom you are certain will not play 3.c4.
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #2 - 09/18/09 at 21:42:21
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One thing that might be a bit of an issue is 4. Nc3, which could be aiming for e.g. a Maroczy, a "Gheorghiu Benoni" or 4...cd 5. Nxd4 d5 6. cd Nxd5 7. Ndb5.  I would think 4. dc might also be more promising than in some comparable positions (such as 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 c5 and 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 c5 3. e3 g6).
  
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Re: Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
Reply #1 - 09/18/09 at 21:05:08
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It is if White does not chose one of the deviations like 3.Nc3.
  
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Benko question against 1.d4 2.Nf3
09/18/09 at 14:40:58
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So is there still a possibility to transpose into a benko after
1.d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 g6 3. c4 c5 4.d5 b5
or why is it said benko wouldn't be possible after 2.Nf3?
  
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