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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) 1 e4 c5 2 Bc4 (Read 19461 times)
Markovich
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Re: 1 e4 c5 2 Bc4
Reply #7 - 12/15/09 at 14:27:36
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Apropos of 2.Bc4, I've been playing some Scheveningen games with 2...e6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 d6.  What to do after 3.Nc3 is a problem, since for example, 3...Nc6 4.d4 cxd4 5.Nxd4 e6 6.Be3 Nf6 7.Bc4 and I have to face a Sozin/Velimirovic, which I don't have to do via my preferred move order (where my b8 knight hangs back and, in case of Bc4-Bb3, comes out on a6). 

So instead of 3...Nc6 I would prefer 3...d6 when White has, among other moves, 4.Bc4 which perhaps is a little stronger with Black's d-pawn committed to d6, e.g. 4...a6 5.a4 and it's a mess.  I don't suppose that Black has much to worry about, but on the other hand his game doesn't look that inspiring to me.
  

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Re: 1 e4 c5 2 Bc4
Reply #6 - 12/13/09 at 08:41:56
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In Fighting the Anti-Sicillians, Palliser devotes just one sentence to 2.Bc4. He says that after 2...e6 black equalizes comfortably. I agree with TN. 2.Nf3 d6 3.Bc4 would be the stiffer test, but even then I think that black should equalize fairly easily.
  

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TN
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Re: 1 e4 c5 2 Bc4
Reply #5 - 11/22/09 at 05:20:53
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If White wants to play in this manner, he should play 2.Nf3 first, and then meet 2...d6 with 3.Bc4, so that Black cannot play ...d5 in one turn. This doesn't change the overall evaluation of the line, but at least forces Black to find a few good moves to secure equality. I can't remember the equaliser exactly, but I recall that Black plays ...Nf6/...e6/...Nc6/...Be7/...0-0/...d5 in some order, perhaps with ...a6 thrown in.
  

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bragesjo
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Re: 1 e4 c5 2 Bc4
Reply #4 - 11/21/09 at 19:20:15
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Bc4 is genrelly given as bad since black can play e6 blunting the Bishop and quickly equalise in a few moves. Whites best after e6 is probely 3 Nc3 to prevent d5. Black can then play a6 when a4 is more or less forced. White players can later transpose to a open sicilian setup but in my experice at internet ches they will rarley do that since Bc4 is often not the most optimal move agianst e6 sicilians.
  
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Fausto Alava-Moreno
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Re: 1 e4 c5 2 Bc4
Reply #3 - 11/17/09 at 10:57:24
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I have faced this 2.Bc4 line in some correspondence games.

May be used as a surprise weapon, but I use to play 2... e6 in order to play normal black setup (sometimes the game finally follows the Schevenigen Sicilian).

Do not be afraid of 2.Bc4, but the bishop at c4 square is a useful piece in many Open Sicilian Variations.
  

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Re: 1 e4 c5 2 Bc4
Reply #2 - 11/17/09 at 10:42:00
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OK, thanks! Wikipedia has the following information on this:

Quote:
2.Bc4 (the Bowdler Attack), though once played at the highest level, is popular today only among club players or beginners who are unfamiliar with the Sicilian and are looking either to attack the weak f7 pawn or to prepare for a quick kingside castle. However, after a move such as 2...e6, Black will soon play ...d5 and open up the centre while gaining time by attacking the bishop. Anderssen-Wyvill, London 1851 continued 2..e6 3.Nc3 a6 4.a4 Nc6 5.d3 g6 6.Nge2 Bg7 7.0-0 Nge7 8.f4 0-0 9.Bd2 d5 10.Bb3 Nd4 11.Nxd4, and now Soltis recommends 11...cxd4! 12.Ne2 Bd7!


I'm aware of the different philosophies, but still it's a good idea to analyse these openings from both perspectives - I remember Watson going on at length about the differences of 1 c4 e5 2 g3 c6 (accelerated Keres) and the Alapin. IIRC Yusopov and Dvoretski have a chapter on openings with reversed colors, too. 
I didn't know about this particular instance.
  
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chk
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Re: 1 e4 c5 2 Bc4
Reply #1 - 11/17/09 at 09:32:53
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The reversed Sicilian has a different philosophy than the proper one, so I wouldn't necessarily try to compare them.

On 1. e4 c5 2. Bc4 e6 and you have a normal Sicilian where I think Black will quickly equalise in all possible variations. I think we had some discussion about this system some time ago (you can check that through the 'search' function)..
  

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1 e4 c5 2 Bc4
11/17/09 at 07:38:00
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Everybody laughs at this line, myself included (does it even have a name?). But in Marin's book 1 c4 e5, he calls the line 2 g3 Nf6 3 Nc3 Nc6 4 Bg2 Bc5 the Karpov variation (is this standard?) and claims that it's very hard to prove an advantage against it.
So does black have a better system after 1 e4 c5 2 Bc4 than playing a reversed Karpov variation?
  
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