ChessPub Forum - The Ruy Lopez Revisited

Markovich God Member Offline Posts: 6099 Location: Columbus, Ohio Joined: 09/17/04	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #30 - 03/18/10 at 15:11:46	Post Tools	Print Post
	Rimfaxe wrote on 03/18/10 at 14:27:35: If you want to learn the classical defence your could start with this article. http://correspondencechess.com/campbell/hard/h990517.htm It is quite old but very good, and a good place to start learning the classical defence. And it is free! I don't think any books published for many years have so good a coverage of the Classical Spanish as these articles, and after all I don't think theory have changed much during the last decade in this opening anyway. I'm flattered by that, but anyone should be very careful, because I have since discovered that the method of play I recommended after 5.Nxe5 is not sound in all variations. I explained why some time ago in a thread here, but it's too much trouble to unearth it. Also since that writeup is old, there is scant treatment of White's popular Qd3 in the more positional line. Contrary to your assertion, theory has moved forward. You could take my work as an intro, but I would recommend you look at the updates here and also get Sokolov's Spanish book.

	The Great Oz has spoken!
	IP Logged

Rimfaxe YaBB Newbies Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 16 Joined: 08/18/06	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #29 - 03/18/10 at 14:27:35	Post Tools	Print Post
	If you want to learn the classical defence your could start with this article. http://correspondencechess.com/campbell/hard/h990517.htm It is quite old but very good, and a good place to start learning the classical defence. And it is free! I don't think any books published for many years have so good a coverage of the Classical Spanish as these articles, and after all I don't think theory have changed much during the last decade in this opening anyway.


	IP Logged

Fromper Senior Member Offline GrandPatzer Posts: 378 Location: Chicago, IL, USA Joined: 03/12/10 Gender:	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #28 - 03/15/10 at 23:00:31	Post Tools	Print Post
	Matemax wrote on 03/15/10 at 22:10:19: Fromper wrote on 03/15/10 at 22:00:16: So what's the verdict on this book? Worth getting for a 1700 player who's tired of banging out 12 moves of the mainline Ruy Lopez against opponents my own level, only for both of us to sit there wondering what to do next? too complicated for 1700 - you should get Watson's books ??? What's too complicated for a 1700? The mainline RL, or the less common lines in this book? Or are the lines in this book ok, but the book itself is too complicated? And which books by Watson are you referring to?

	GrandPatzer!!! 1777 peak USCF rating - currently 1620 from coming back rusty
	WWW IP Logged

Matemax God Member Offline Chesspub gives you strength! Posts: 1302 Joined: 11/04/07	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #27 - 03/15/10 at 22:10:19	Post Tools	Print Post
	Fromper wrote on 03/15/10 at 22:00:16: So what's the verdict on this book? Worth getting for a 1700 player who's tired of banging out 12 moves of the mainline Ruy Lopez against opponents my own level, only for both of us to sit there wondering what to do next? too complicated for 1700 - you should get Watson's books


	IP Logged

Fromper Senior Member Offline GrandPatzer Posts: 378 Location: Chicago, IL, USA Joined: 03/12/10 Gender:	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #26 - 03/15/10 at 22:00:16	Post Tools	Print Post
	So what's the verdict on this book? Worth getting for a 1700 player who's tired of banging out 12 moves of the mainline Ruy Lopez against opponents my own level, only for both of us to sit there wondering what to do next?

	GrandPatzer!!! 1777 peak USCF rating - currently 1620 from coming back rusty
	WWW IP Logged

najdorfslayer Full Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 153 Joined: 05/08/09	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #25 - 01/24/10 at 18:33:56	Post Tools	Print Post
	Talking of Greet's book. He recomends 8.Bb3 in the Main Line of the Bird's. This is also not covered in Sokolov's book. Neither is it mentioned in Flear's old 'Offbeat Spanish' or more amazingly Dangerous weapons 1.e4 e5 which Greet himself co-authored BIZARE!!!!! Any comments!


	IP Logged

Matemax

God Member

Offline

Chesspub gives you strength!

Posts: 1302
Joined: 11/04/07

Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov
Reply #24 - 01/22/10 at 10:12:41

Post Tools

Print Post

Stefan Buecker wrote on 01/20/10 at 19:09:13:

Matemax wrote on 01/20/10 at 07:17:00:

Markovic says (in a thread some time ago):
Well, I must say that it's exasperating to have posted here many times how, after 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb4 f5 4. Nc3 fxe4 5. Nxe4 d5 6. Nxe5 dxe4 7. Nxc6 Qg5 (some call this the "Classical" Schliemann) 8. Qe2 Nf6, White's strongest and best is not the highly reputed and often-exclam-adorned 9. f4, but 9. Nxa7+! [...]

I'd be interested to learn what Sokolov recommends against Hugo Süchting's 8.Nd4+! c6 9.Bf1!. In Kaissiber 7 (1998) I had expressed my sympathy for this line, accompanied by analyses. Has Black really enough for the pawn?

I would never play this as White in an OTB game. It is obvious that Black has ample practical compensation.

IP Logged

Schaakhamster God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 650 Joined: 05/13/08	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #23 - 01/21/10 at 05:19:46	Post Tools	Print Post
	TonyRo wrote on 01/20/10 at 21:28:59: It seems as though these days, the stronger the player, the less there is in the bibliography. Chess Stars Bibliography's are extraordinarily small, and it doesn't surprise me that this one is any different. It adds to the impression that most GM's rely a lot more on their own research rather then on literature then we patzers think. I read more then once that a GM stated that he just needed one good book (recent wasn't necessairy) for the basics and a database (and nowadays an engine I would assume) to research a new opening.


	IP Logged

TonyRo God Member Offline I'm gonna crack your skull! Posts: 1826 Location: Cleveland, OH Joined: 11/26/07 Gender:	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #22 - 01/20/10 at 21:28:59	Post Tools	Print Post
	It seems as though these days, the stronger the player, the less there is in the bibliography. Chess Stars Bibliography's are extraordinarily small, and it doesn't surprise me that this one is any different.


	IP Logged

Stefan Buecker God Member Offline Posts: 1386 Location: Germany Joined: 02/11/09 Gender:	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #21 - 01/20/10 at 20:56:40	Post Tools	Print Post
	No bibliography and no mention of Kaissiber? I am shocked.


	IP Logged

Schaakhamster God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 650 Joined: 05/13/08	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #20 - 01/20/10 at 20:39:53	Post Tools	Print Post
	tafl wrote on 01/20/10 at 19:42:41: One curious detail in Sokolov's book is that after 3...Bc5 he doesn't seem to consider Greet's 4.Nxe5!? at all (but after 4.0-0 Nf6 he considers 4.Nxe5 in great detail). Well in a way it is an odd book. Sometimes he covers a lot of ground sometimes his approach is very narrow. There is no bibliography and I haven't met any references to others books. I have the impression that the book is just the result of Sokolov and a database. To his defence 4. Nxe5!? seems a minor line while 5. Nxe5 is quite mainstream theory. And 4. Nxe5!? can be "avoided" by the Berlin moveorder.


	IP Logged

tafl Senior Member Offline Posts: 380 Location: Norway Joined: 05/27/05 Gender:	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #19 - 01/20/10 at 19:42:41	Post Tools	Print Post
	One curious detail in Sokolov's book is that after 3...Bc5 he doesn't seem to consider Greet's 4.Nxe5!? at all (but after 4.0-0 Nf6 he considers 4.Nxe5 in great detail).

	A computer once beat me at chess but it was no match for me at kick boxing - Emo Philips
	IP Logged

Stefan Buecker God Member Offline Posts: 1386 Location: Germany Joined: 02/11/09 Gender:	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #18 - 01/20/10 at 19:09:13	Post Tools	Print Post
	Matemax wrote on 01/20/10 at 07:17:00: Markovic says (in a thread some time ago): Well, I must say that it's exasperating to have posted here many times how, after 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb4 f5 4. Nc3 fxe4 5. Nxe4 d5 6. Nxe5 dxe4 7. Nxc6 Qg5 (some call this the "Classical" Schliemann) 8. Qe2 Nf6, White's strongest and best is not the highly reputed and often-exclam-adorned 9. f4, but 9. Nxa7+! [...] I'd be interested to learn what Sokolov recommends against Hugo Süchting's 8.Nd4+! c6 9.Bf1!. In Kaissiber 7 (1998) I had expressed my sympathy for this line, accompanied by analyses. Has Black really enough for the pawn?


	IP Logged

Schaakhamster God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 650 Joined: 05/13/08	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #17 - 01/20/10 at 17:21:30	Post Tools	Print Post
	Well I have been looking at bit and pieces (mainly Jaenisch/Schliemann and Bird stuff) but now I'm going to look at the part which was my main motivation for buying the book: The Classical variation. Just dusted of my Offbeat Spanish by Flear (2000) and the 2 Hard Chess columns (1999) for reference. A quick scan seems to indicate that nothing specific has been published on the Classical since then .


	IP Logged

Matemax God Member Offline Chesspub gives you strength! Posts: 1302 Joined: 11/04/07	Re: The Ruy Lopez Revisited - Sokolov Reply #16 - 01/20/10 at 15:08:04	Post Tools	Print Post
	Quote: If I were a partisan of White's side of the Spanish, I'd be sure to get myself a copy of this book. That's what I did (even I play the Ruy with both colours but haven't played the Schliemann for more than 10 years with Black - well "times are a....chaiaching" lalala)


	IP Logged