Latest Updates:
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 
Topic Tools
Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Distasteful Threads to be Locked! (Read 18452 times)
MNb
God Member
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10758
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #16 - 06/01/10 at 16:03:49
Post Tools
Hadron wrote on 05/31/10 at 00:02:53:
Those puritans who howled racism and demanded that the thread be locked are also endowed with the same choice are they not? Nobody forced them to come to this forum or to the thread in question to be supposedly offended by its contents.

Exactly. I am glad you understand my point.

Hadron wrote on 05/31/10 at 00:02:53:
In this case choice is like true democracy, it is a myth.

Again you hit the nail right on its head. Chesspub is not a democracy, more like an enlightened dictatorship, with one difference: everyone can take it or leave it.
For such a reason I just have quite another forum I was active on.

GMTonyKosten wrote on 05/31/10 at 13:43:30:
the Chit Chat section is basically only there to allow Dutch members to moan about the Dutch football league. Wink

Yet another jealous Englishman. Can we help it that MML is more interesting than EPL?  Tongue
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Michael Ayton
God Member
*****
Offline


‘You’re never alone with
a doppelgänger.’

Posts: 1953
Location: durham
Joined: 04/19/03
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #15 - 06/01/10 at 14:55:14
Post Tools
@ HTH

I give in! I [i]didn't[/i] posit a 'majority'! Rather, you posited a minority. The burden of proof rests with you, not with me! The proof you attempt is feeble, resting as it does on the transparently faulty premise that all those who think that comments like Gambit's might require moderating will have spoken. You imply, further, that I would have had the thread locked, but I did not say that. (Nor, for the record, am I among those, if such there be, who would have Gambit banned.) Personally I was pleased to see it simply wither on the vine, so to say, but I broadly support Smyslov_Fan's general approach, for the reasons I gave.

I've told you why I personally didn't respond to Gambit's post. [i]Obviously[/i] I cannot prove syllogistically that Gambit was being untowardly provocative, but that he [i]was[/i] being so is, I contend, a perfectly reasonable, and even an obvious, extrapolation from some of his other posts. My intuition, if I'm to be permitted to use so unanalytic a human faculty, tells me that others very possibly thought the same, and had much the same motives for not responding to the "argument". I'm sorry if you don't like this -- to my way of thinking merely sensible -- reasoning, but I'm not going to waste everyone's time, including my own, by starting a poll in attempted justification of it!

A logical and reasonable case can be made for the view that strong moderation, including the prospect of censorship, should virtually never, or absolutely never, occur in any public forum. And an at least equally logical and reasonable case can be made to the effect that sometimes it should. The problem here appears to be that you seem to regard the second case as [i]not[/i] being reasonable, without however having produced any argument -- at least not any sound one -- for why this might be so. I note that a number of people have expressed (or at least wearily adumbrated!) a view in this area, and that the weight of opinion is overwhelmingly against you.


  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
GMTonyKosten
YaBB Administrator
*****
Offline


Mr Dynamic?

Posts: 3163
Location: Clermont-Ferrand
Joined: 12/19/02
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #14 - 05/31/10 at 13:43:30
Post Tools
TN wrote on 05/31/10 at 12:59:09:
A chess forum is all about the chess

I must say I thoroughly agree with the last two posts, this Forum is primarily a place where ChessPublishing.com subscribers can discuss chess, and the Chit Chat section is basically only there to allow Dutch members to moan about the Dutch football league. Wink
  
Back to top
IP Logged
 
TN
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 3420
Joined: 11/07/08
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #13 - 05/31/10 at 12:59:09
Post Tools
As much as I enjoy my sit-down comic acts in the Chit Chat section, I have to agree with Markovich.

Politics. Wrong place at the wrong time. A chess forum is all about the chess. 

@HTH

Just to let you know, I didn't ask for the thread to be locked. I hyperventilated, so I couldn't voice my opinion.
  

All our dreams come true if we have the courage to pursue them.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Markovich
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 6099
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Joined: 09/17/04
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #12 - 05/31/10 at 01:45:58
Post Tools
You want politics?  Go to a politics board.  Or still better, join a political organization, you know?  Here we sometimes do get worked up about politics, but not that much, since this board is about chess openings.  So frankly, I am bored by your hysteria.
  

The Great Oz has spoken!
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Hadron
Full Member
***
Offline


Doctor, Doctor, Doctor..When
will you ever learn?

Posts: 195
Location: Levin, New Zealand.
Joined: 03/24/05
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #11 - 05/31/10 at 01:34:00
Post Tools
[quote author=3A393335540 link=1259687316/8#8 date=1274794350]You talk of only a "moral minority" being represented, but where is your evidence that those who think that threads like the one on the Middle East you mention require moderating are in a minority? [/quote]
And you can offer evidence that there is a majority? I don’t even dare to assume, claim or even try and predict what other people are thinking. As far as the thread concerned goes, the evidence of a moral minority is matter of deduction: take the number of the hand full of puritans who complained about the thread before it was locked and divided that number by the number of registered Chesspub members and multiply by 100. For this number to be large enough to be significant in support your supposition that a majority exists would have to mean that Chesspubs membership would have to only consist of those puritans mentioned. This I doubt.

[quote author=3A393335540 link=1259687316/8#8 date=1274794350]And has it occurred to you that the reason no one bothered to refute that rant [i]might[/i] just have been that to have done so would have been to have given a poster who on that occasion was being unpleasantly and stupidly inflammatory precisely what he was seeking? [/quote]
It should come has no real surprise that as you seem to think you know what the majority is thinking that you should also believe you know what Lev is thinking as well. I can not see how you can deal with anything rationally but simply saying it was “unpleasantly and stupidly inflammatory’ and locking it ? All you are doing is concentrating on how it was said and not what was said, meaning with the thread in question, how do you address it inaccuracies for instance?...or is it a matter of ignoring that too?

HTH
>:(
  

I'm reminded again of something Short wrote recently, approximately "The biggest fallacy in chess is the quasi-religious belief in the primacy of the opening."
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Hadron
Full Member
***
Offline


Doctor, Doctor, Doctor..When
will you ever learn?

Posts: 195
Location: Levin, New Zealand.
Joined: 03/24/05
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #10 - 05/31/10 at 00:02:53
Post Tools
MNb wrote on 05/25/10 at 15:07:36:

If you find it offensive it's your problem. You have a fair choice: take it or leave it. Nobody forces you to visit this forum. It's not that I want to chase you away (as if I could); point is that when visiting a forum you'll have to accept its restrictions.

Indeed it is my problem to which I have said something about it. As to your comments about choice, your argument is fatuous. Those puritans who howled racism and demanded that the thread be locked are also endowed with the same choice are they not? Nobody forced them to come to this forum or to the thread in question to be supposedly offended by its contents. Yet they did find their way to it and took the time to complain and whine about it as well which largely but not wholly got the thread locked. In this case choice is like true democracy, it is a myth.
HTH  Angry
  

I'm reminded again of something Short wrote recently, approximately "The biggest fallacy in chess is the quasi-religious belief in the primacy of the opening."
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10758
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #9 - 05/25/10 at 15:07:36
Post Tools
Hadron wrote on 05/25/10 at 13:11:41:
Personally I don’t know what to find more offensive, the original rant or the puritans who hide away behind their monitors tapping away with false indignation proclaiming that the masses need to be protected from themselves.

If you find it offensive it's your problem. You have a fair choice: take it or leave it. Nobody forces you to visit this forum. It's not that I want to chase you away (as if I could); point is that when visiting a forum you'll have to accept its restrictions.
The second part, about those masses that need to be protected, is plain nonsense. There are plenty fora and blogs around where you can discuss subjects like the Israeli/Palestine conflict from every angle you desire, include the most offensive and racist ones.
Chesspub does not have the means to "protect the masses" from whatever.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Michael Ayton
God Member
*****
Offline


‘You’re never alone with
a doppelgänger.’

Posts: 1953
Location: durham
Joined: 04/19/03
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #8 - 05/25/10 at 13:32:30
Post Tools
I wish I understood this, HTH. You talk of only a "moral minority" being represented, but where is your evidence that those who think that threads like the one on the Middle East you mention require moderating are in a minority? And has it occurred to you that the reason no one bothered to refute that rant [i]might[/i] just have been that to have done so would have been to have given a poster who on that occasion was being unpleasantly and stupidly inflammatory precisely what he was seeking?

There's an argument, certainly, for trying to remove subjectivity from these things as far as is possible -- this is something that could valuably be discussed further and I can see a hostage to fortune in the reference to the "general ear". But Smyslov_Fan's major criterion, as he makes clear, is hate-speech or the incitation to it. This as you surely know is a widely recognised/accepted principle, not something S_F has just arrogantly invented to please himself and some undefined "minority"!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Hadron
Full Member
***
Offline


Doctor, Doctor, Doctor..When
will you ever learn?

Posts: 195
Location: Levin, New Zealand.
Joined: 03/24/05
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #7 - 05/25/10 at 13:11:41
Post Tools
Smyslov_Fan wrote on 12/01/09 at 17:08:36:
Edited:
Moderator's Note:


Hi all!

I really, really dislike censorship. But as the moderator for this forum I must represent the best interests of the Chess Pub.
 
As such, I will delete any entries that are hateful or that offends the general ear.  I will lock any topics that only incite hateful speech.

If you disagree with a thread being locked you may enter your disagreement here, or to me personally.


Some many subjective considerations. Such hubris to say that one must represent the best interests of Chesspub when really all you are representing are the moral minority (who always get what they want by complaining the longest and the loudest) and yourself (with ones subjective censorship). Much as been said and made about a certain thread discussing the middle east where the original rant was meet by howls of derision and cries of racism by the moral puritans. The odd thing is though not one person made a substantial effort to try and refute the original rant…but the thread was duly locked anyway. Personally I don’t know what to find more offensive, the original rant or the puritans who hide away behind their monitors tapping away with false indignation proclaiming that the masses need to be protected from themselves. And perhaps what’s worse, the Chesspub moderator(s) fell for it.
HTH
Angry
  

I'm reminded again of something Short wrote recently, approximately "The biggest fallacy in chess is the quasi-religious belief in the primacy of the opening."
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Markovich
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 6099
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Joined: 09/17/04
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #6 - 03/12/10 at 16:17:25
Post Tools
I didn't bother checking out any of those girls.  But I'm not sure that I agree that posting links to pictures of pretty girls is offensive.  We do have female visitors here, so I would hope we would exercise due decorum on these subjects.

At the same time I can understand the moderator's concern that the discussion would quickly turn, umm, excessively frank.
  

The Great Oz has spoken!
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
HoemberChess
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 512
Location: Lake d4 on Planet Chess
Joined: 10/08/07
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #5 - 03/12/10 at 15:57:28
Post Tools
Smyslov_Fan wrote on 03/12/10 at 15:43:17:
Think of it this way... if it's a thread that your sister would be uncomfortable with, it may well be blocked.  

It is possible to have a thread about physical beauty without being prurient.



This means, then, that our tastes over here count as prurient. Tongue For my deleted thread-opening link was to a "Beauty of the Day" section of a local news-portal. (Each and every girl who is displayed there has asked to be displayed.)
  

as
*W 1d4) Torre/Barry/Pirc/Philidor/ early _d5:early c4(QGD/Slav/QGD/etc)
*B) 1e4:e6 [+1_c5 2Nf3 a6]| 1d4:e6 2c4 Bb4+ BID/pseudoNID [+1_Nf6 NID]| 1c4:c5,_Nc6,_e5,_g6| 1Nf3:c5
Back to top
WWWGTalk  
IP Logged
 
Smyslov_Fan
YaBB Moderator
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #4 - 03/12/10 at 15:43:17
Post Tools
Think of it this way... if it's a thread that your sister would be uncomfortable with, it may well be blocked.   

It is possible to have a thread about physical beauty without being prurient.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
HoemberChess
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 512
Location: Lake d4 on Planet Chess
Joined: 10/08/07
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #3 - 03/12/10 at 15:22:48
Post Tools
Do girls with clothes on count as offensive?
  

as
*W 1d4) Torre/Barry/Pirc/Philidor/ early _d5:early c4(QGD/Slav/QGD/etc)
*B) 1e4:e6 [+1_c5 2Nf3 a6]| 1d4:e6 2c4 Bb4+ BID/pseudoNID [+1_Nf6 NID]| 1c4:c5,_Nc6,_e5,_g6| 1Nf3:c5
Back to top
WWWGTalk  
IP Logged
 
GMTonyKosten
YaBB Administrator
*****
Offline


Mr Dynamic?

Posts: 3163
Location: Clermont-Ferrand
Joined: 12/19/02
Gender: Male
Re: Distasteful Threads to be Locked!
Reply #2 - 12/02/09 at 18:46:39
Post Tools
I will let the moderator decide whether to lock it, or delete it. The second option certainly will not be a great loss to the Forum!
  
Back to top
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 
Topic Tools
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo