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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) The Knight's Tango (Read 13929 times)
Jay
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #17 - 02/02/11 at 17:57:12
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I cannot agree more about the quality of Palliser's book.  The games are quite instructive for the feel and leave little doubt that it can be played.  I think its advantage is there are really so many ways that black can play after the two knight moves that white has to proceed with a certain amount of caution (even if he is on the attack).  I do think the Tango is a sound recommendation because the player is likely going to have to learn how to play many different positions.

TN wrote on 11/03/10 at 11:11:50:
BabySnake wrote on 11/03/10 at 10:49:43:
By the way, can anyone tell me Avrukh's recommendation vs the Tango in his 1. d4 GM series?


He recommends playing in Catalan fashion with 3.Nf3 e6 4.g3 Bb4 5.Bd2 Bd2 6.Qd2, followed by a quick Nc3 and Rd1 to take the sting out of ...e5. For details, I refer you to the book.

Most of Avrukh's 1.d4 vol. 1 is the Catalan.

On the Tango front, the only issue I have with it is its lines are somewhat incompatible with a mainline KID where black plays g6.  It's not bad, but you will not be able to have a single cohesive KID/Tango repertoire.

TonyRo wrote on 11/03/10 at 13:02:53:
Ah, I was pretty sure you were going to go into the "No Tango! Play the Tarrasch!" routine. Perhaps a sound piece of advice for a 1700 player.

I didn't even read the original post until now, but I would be right there with you. A 1700's style is to hang pieces.

Anyway, why would his coach, under the assumption that he's a positional player, recommend the Tango? That's what came to mind!?!

I was thinking the same thing considering the pawn pushes chasing the queen's knight over to the kingside is an attacking stance for black and not a positional one.
  
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Michael Ayton
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #16 - 11/03/10 at 18:24:45
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[quote]The Tango is a great weapon on 1700 level. White players usually don't have a clue and play 3.Nc3 e5 4.d5 or 3.d5. [/quote]

I've never faced 3 d5 in the Durham league, but yes, lots and lots of 3 Nc3 e5 4 d5. (Which wouldn't be bad if such Whites went for h2-h4 plans, but they never do!) I've never dared post a game of mine on here before, but here's a 'typical' Tango I won in the Durham league a frightening five years ago:

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 Nc6 3. Nc3 e5 4. d5 Ne7 5. e4 Ng6 6. Bg5 Bc5 7. Be2 h6 8. Bd2 d6 9. Nf3 O-O 10. O-O Bd7 11. a3 c6 12. Qc2 cxd5 13. cxd5 Rc8 14. Rac1 b5 15. b4 Bd4 16. Qd3 Bxc3 17. Rxc3 Rxc3 18. Bxc3 Nf4 19. Qc2 (19. Qe3 Qb6!) Qc7 20. Rc1 Qxc3 21. Qxc3 Nxe2+ 22. Kf1 Nxc3 23. Rxc3 Rc8 24. Rxc8+ Bxc8 25. Nd2 Kf8 (and the conclusion was: 26. Ke2 Ke7 27. h3 Kd8 28. Ke3 Nd7 29. Nb3 Nb6 30. Na5 Nc4+ 31. Nxc4 bxc4 32. a4 Kc7 33. Kd2 Bd7 34. a5 Kb7 35. Kc3 Bb5 36. h4 g6 37. g3 Ka6 38. f4 f6  0-1)

Huge fun -- as long, that is, as White doesn't play 3 Nf3! ...




  
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TonyRo
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #15 - 11/03/10 at 15:31:27
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I 1000% agree - I just think it's funny that his coach suggested it if he thought he was a Karpov-esque, positional style player. The Tango is a pretty dynamic, aggressive opening played by the likes of Bologan and Christiansen. Not exactly a "boa" type of approach!
  
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #14 - 11/03/10 at 14:28:55
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The Tango is a great weapon on 1700 level. White players usually don't have a clue and play 3.Nc3 e5 4.d5 or 3.d5. No need to drop it for the Tarrasch.
  

Improvement begins at the edge of your comfort zone. -Jonathan Rowson
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TonyRo
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #13 - 11/03/10 at 13:02:53
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Ah, I was pretty sure you were going to go into the "No Tango! Play the Tarrasch!" routine. Perhaps a sound piece of advice for a 1700 player.

I didn't even read the original post until now, but I would be right there with you. A 1700's style is to hang pieces.

Anyway, why would his coach, under the assumption that he's a positional player, recommend the Tango? That's what came to mind!?!
  
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Markovich
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #12 - 11/03/10 at 12:42:40
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TonyRo wrote on 11/03/10 at 12:29:40:
You may not get a response. He registered two years ago, has 14 posts, and made this one about 2 months ago. Grin


Oh well.  And here I was looking forward to riding my hobby horse about coaches that think their job is to deduce the chess "style" of a 1700 player.
  

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TonyRo
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #11 - 11/03/10 at 12:29:40
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You may not get a response. He registered two years ago, has 14 posts, and made this one about 2 months ago. Grin
  
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #10 - 11/03/10 at 12:20:10
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Dante88 wrote on 08/31/10 at 05:05:46:
My coach tells me I need to pick up a new defense as Black against 1.d4 .  I'm not comfortable with 1.d4 d5, and he says my current opening (The Grunfeld) is much too tactical and dynamic for a positional player as myself (In previous posts I mention that I look up to Karpov and his boa-constrictor style of chess).  He suggested I try out the Tango where the basic line is as follows :

1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Nc6

I've been playing blitz games to get a feel for it with mediocre results(about a 33/33/33 percentage with W/L/D).  My biggest problem is I haven't been able to find ANYTHING furthering the theory of the Tango.

Could someone point me in the right direction please, or perhaps tell me what kind of defense I should check out?


What's your rating, if I may ask?
  

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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #9 - 11/03/10 at 11:46:07
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Thanks TN!  Smiley
  
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TN
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #8 - 11/03/10 at 11:11:50
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BabySnake wrote on 11/03/10 at 10:49:43:
By the way, can anyone tell me Avrukh's recommendation vs the Tango in his 1. d4 GM series?


He recommends playing in Catalan fashion with 3.Nf3 e6 4.g3 Bb4 5.Bd2 Bd2 6.Qd2, followed by a quick Nc3 and Rd1 to take the sting out of ...e5. For details, I refer you to the book.
  

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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #7 - 11/03/10 at 10:49:43
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By the way, can anyone tell me Avrukh's recommendation vs the Tango in his 1. d4 GM series?
  
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TonyRo
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #6 - 08/31/10 at 15:02:53
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Didn't the forum dig up some problems dealing with some of the more dynamic h4-based ideas a while back?

EDIT:

I've found some of at least some use. Maybe we can continue with some analysis of what people find critical to the Tango's survival:

Tango Stuff:

http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1201973602/15

http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1233890161/15

Nimzo Stuff:

http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1217940875/6#6

http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1273032994/6#6
  
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TN
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #5 - 08/31/10 at 14:13:52
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Against the Zurich, Black doesn't have to play Palliser's recommended 5...d6 but can instead prefer 5...d5, when 6.a3 Bc3 7.Qc3 Ne4 8.Qc2 e5 9.e3 Bf5 is a variation of the Nimzo where Black has no problems. More theoretically critical is 6.e3, but then 6...0-0 7.Bd3 dc4 8.Bc4 a6 9.0-0 Bd6 is perfectly playable for Black.

Also, after 4.a3, Palliser doesn't like 4...d5 5.Nc3 for Black, mentioning 5...Be7, 5...g6 and 5...a6, but he doesn't examine 5...dc4!? 6.e4 Na5, which in my view is no worse than the main line 4...d6 5.Nc3 g6. After 7.Bc4 Nc4 8.Qc4 c6 9.Qc4 Be7 Black's bishop pair compensates for White's central space advantage and freer development.

And after 4.g3, if Black wants a Bogo-Indian but without the theory, he should consider 4...Bb4 5.Bd2 0-0!?, keeping all of Black's options open. For example, 6.Bg2 Bd2 7.Nbd2 d6 8.0-0 e5 9.d5 Ne7 is fine for Black, and 6.Nc3 d5 is a good version of the Catalan for Black because White has committed his knight to c3.
  

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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #4 - 08/31/10 at 13:32:16
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TonyRo wrote on 08/31/10 at 12:07:24:
Practically, it's a great line, and it's also quite fun to play as well. I can't tell you how many times I got great positions after 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 Nc6 3. Nc3 e5 4. d5 Ne7 followed by ...Ng6, ...Bc5, and ...d6. Most people just simply do not play well against this opening, and if you know it well, you can breeze through the opening and slide in to some very pleasant middlegame positions.


I've had a few of those easy games myself. But once opponents are above 2100-2200 they almost all play 3.Nf3 and the game will be much calmer (not necessarily a bad thing, of course).

As a follow-up to my Nimzo-Indian move order suggestion, those who really like the Tango plans with the ...e5 push could meet 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.e3 with Taimanov's 4...Nc6!? intending ...e5, and 4.f3 with 4...d5 5.a3 Be7 6.e4 dxe4 7.fxe4 e5 8.d5 Bc5 - a line that was recommended in "Chess Openings for Black, Explained".
  

Improvement begins at the edge of your comfort zone. -Jonathan Rowson
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TonyRo
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Re: The Knight's Tango
Reply #3 - 08/31/10 at 12:07:24
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Practically, it's a great line, and it's also quite fun to play as well. I can't tell you how many times I got great positions after 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 Nc6 3. Nc3 e5 4. d5 Ne7 followed by ...Ng6, ...Bc5, and ...d6. Most people just simply do not play well against this opening, and if you know it well, you can breeze through the opening and slide in to some very pleasant middlegame positions.

However, there are some pressing problems (probably) in the Zurich Variation that promise White something, and I do remember some postings in some other threads here where people found some other lines as well. We should try to find them.

But yes - Palliser's book is the way to go.
  
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