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Normal Topic Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School? (Read 3482 times)
Paddy
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Re: Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School?
Reply #8 - 09/01/10 at 16:55:30
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Stigma wrote on 09/01/10 at 15:57:55:
Paddy wrote on 09/01/10 at 12:49:06:
Uruk wrote on 09/01/10 at 12:37:57:
Funny, I think the Portuguese do the reverse (ie. insert the mother's name before the father's).

So it seems "Comas" is talking about the MdP here.
I'm not sure whether Gligo invented it or just came up with the Rf7-Bf8 plan.


Possibly Comas is referring to the Mar del Plata/Gligoric, but the quoted statement is in the context of a game featuring the Fianchetto variation.

The variation with ...c5 against the Fianchetto is/was definitely known as the Yugoslav, so I suggest that my explanation is the more likely.  Smiley

I don't get it, the part of the question Uruk and I were responding to specifically said Classical with ...Na6, and then 7...Nc6 8.d5 Ne7 as an alternative! Nothing fianchetto about that.

In general, I dont' think we should read too much into the fact that both the long Classical main line and 6...c5 in the fianchetto have been popular in Yugoslavia. They are thematically very different and it's definitely possible to play/like one and not the other. I'm sure even Comas would agree with that!


Checking the book, I find that Comas does indeed also refer to the Mar del Plata as the Yugoslav variation.

In his own practice Comas has generally employed ...Nbd7 and ...e5 against the Fianchetto and ...Na6 against the Classical. So he dislikes BOTH the "Yugoslav" variations that we have discussed in this thread.
  
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Stigma
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Re: Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School?
Reply #7 - 09/01/10 at 15:57:55
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Paddy wrote on 09/01/10 at 12:49:06:
Uruk wrote on 09/01/10 at 12:37:57:
Funny, I think the Portuguese do the reverse (ie. insert the mother's name before the father's).

So it seems "Comas" is talking about the MdP here.
I'm not sure whether Gligo invented it or just came up with the Rf7-Bf8 plan.


Possibly Comas is referring to the Mar del Plata/Gligoric, but the quoted statement is in the context of a game featuring the Fianchetto variation.

The variation with ...c5 against the Fianchetto is/was definitely known as the Yugoslav, so I suggest that my explanation is the more likely.  Smiley

I don't get it, the part of the question Uruk and I were responding to specifically said Classical with ...Na6, and then 7...Nc6 8.d5 Ne7 as an alternative! Nothing fianchetto about that.

In general, I dont' think we should read too much into the fact that both the long Classical main line and 6...c5 in the fianchetto have been popular in Yugoslavia. They are thematically very different and it's definitely possible to play/like one and not the other. I'm sure even Comas would agree with that!
  

Improvement begins at the edge of your comfort zone. -Jonathan Rowson
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GabrielGale
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Re: Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School?
Reply #6 - 09/01/10 at 15:38:45
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Just to clarify: The direct quote by GM Lluis Comas on him not liking the way Yugoslavians play the KID was made in the context of the Botvinnik-Geller game which was a KID Fianchetto. However the remark was made in general and not specifically with reference to the KID Fianchetto.

Hence I am interested to know what is the difference between the Russian School and the Yugoslav School on KID play.

My ref to the naming of the KID Classical Main Line as the Yugoslav Var is in Ch 5 of the book where GM Lluis Comas is discussing his fav Var, namely the 6...Na6 var. I am just wondering whether there is a connection between this (in Ch 5) and the earlier quote which is in Ch 1.
  

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Paddy
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Re: Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School?
Reply #5 - 09/01/10 at 12:49:06
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Uruk wrote on 09/01/10 at 12:37:57:
Funny, I think the Portuguese do the reverse (ie. insert the mother's name before the father's).

So it seems "Comas" is talking about the MdP here.
I'm not sure whether Gligo invented it or just came up with the Rf7-Bf8 plan.


Possibly Comas is referring to the Mar del Plata/Gligoric, but the quoted statement is in the context of a game featuring the Fianchetto variation.

The variation with ...c5 against the Fianchetto is/was definitely known as the Yugoslav, so I suggest that my explanation is the more likely.  Smiley
  
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Uruk
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Re: Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School?
Reply #4 - 09/01/10 at 12:37:57
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Funny, I think the Portuguese do the reverse (ie. insert the mother's name before the father's).

So it seems "Comas" is talking about the MdP here.
I'm not sure whether Gligo invented it or just came up with the Rf7-Bf8 plan.
  
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Stigma
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Re: Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School?
Reply #3 - 09/01/10 at 11:48:26
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GabrielGale wrote on 09/01/10 at 05:47:55:
Interestingly (and not sure whether this is significant for the above question), in Ch 5, a chapter dedicated entirely to the KID Classical Var with 6...Na6, GM Comas Fabrego's fav KID var, he posed as alternatives what he calls the "Yugoslav Variation": 6...e5 7 O-O Nc6 8 d5 Ne7.

That is just the KID Classical Var Main Line according to GM Golubev's book.

This naming by Comas is probably in honour of GM Svetozar Gligoric, who from the early 1950s on was extremely central in developing the black side of what is now known as the "Mar del Plata" variation (the Classical KID main line with White playing Ne1 and f3). He may also have influenced other Yugoslav players to take it up.
  

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Paddy
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Re: Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School?
Reply #2 - 09/01/10 at 11:02:20
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GabrielGale wrote on 09/01/10 at 05:47:55:
I was browsing in the book, True Lies, by GM Lluis Comas Fabrego. and came across this remark:
Quote:
I feel deep respect and admiration for the way Russian players handle this defence [ie the KID] (on the other hand, I have said many times that I have never liked the handling of the King's Indian by the Yugoslavian players).


This remark is at p20 when GM Comas Fabrego is anlaysing the game Botvinnik-Geller, Budapest 1952 http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1032256 with notes taken from Geller's book, The Application of Chess Theory. The author is looking at 15 a3 (given an ? by Geller) and he goes on to show that Geller's assessment was wrong.

But I am interested to know if anyone knows the background to this remark, re the Yugoslav school vs the Russian school.

Interestingly (and not sure whether this is significant for the above question), in Ch 5, a chapter dedicated entirely to the KID Classical Var with 6...Na6, GM Comas Fabrego's fav KID var, he posed as alternatives what he calls the "Yugoslav Variation": 6...e5 7 O-O Nc6 8 d5 Ne7.

That is just the KID Classical Var Main Line according to GM Golubev's book.

Can anyone shed any light on this?


In the early days of the development of the KID (say late 1930s to early 1950s) the Russian (or more correctly Ukrainian) "school" - Bogatyrchuk, Konstantinopolsky, Bronstein, Boleslavsky, Geller... - favoured the ...Nbd7, ...e5 method against the Fianchetto variation, while the Yugoslav approach was with ...c5.

Pedantry corner: with reference to "Uruk's" post, the Spanish GM is generally known as Lluis Comas - the Fabrego part of his name merely reflects the Spanish custom of tagging on the mother's surname after the father's. (Similarly the top Spanish-born GM is Paco Vallejo, not Paco Pons.)
  
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Uruk
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Re: Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School?
Reply #1 - 09/01/10 at 07:13:13
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Guess Mr Fabrego had just been brutally mated in a MdP before he wrote these lines.
  
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GabrielGale
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Yugoslav School vs Russian/Soviet School?
09/01/10 at 05:47:55
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I was browsing in the book, True Lies, by GM Lluis Comas Fabrego. and came across this remark:
Quote:
I feel deep respect and admiration for the way Russian players handle this defence [ie the KID] (on the other hand, I have said many times that I have never liked the handling of the King's Indian by the Yugoslavian players).


This remark is at p20 when GM Comas Fabrego is anlaysing the game Botvinnik-Geller, Budapest 1952 http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1032256 with notes taken from Geller's book, The Application of Chess Theory. The author is looking at 15 a3 (given an ? by Geller) and he goes on to show that Geller's assessment was wrong.

But I am interested to know if anyone knows the background to this remark, re the Yugoslav school vs the Russian school.

Interestingly (and not sure whether this is significant for the above question), in Ch 5, a chapter dedicated entirely to the KID Classical Var with 6...Na6, GM Comas Fabrego's fav KID var, he posed as alternatives what he calls the "Yugoslav Variation": 6...e5 7 O-O Nc6 8 d5 Ne7.

That is just the KID Classical Var Main Line according to GM Golubev's book.

Can anyone shed any light on this?
  

http://www.toutautre.blogspot.com/
A Year With Nessie ...... aka GM John Shaw's The King's Gambit (http://thekinggambit.blogspot.com.au/)
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