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Normal Topic C25: Discouraging 1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.f4 (Read 3871 times)
Dragonslayer
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Re: Discouraging 1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.f4
Reply #2 - 11/15/10 at 13:12:32
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I met this gambit in 1996.
1.e4 e5 2.f4 Nc6 3.Nc3 (3.Nf3 f5 was a very hot topic just then)
3...Bc5 4.Nf3 ef4. And now I just played into the drawing line with 5.d4 Nxd4 6.Nxd4 Qh4+ 7.Ke2 d5! a few moves later my opponent declined the draw with Qf2+ and Qd4+, the position is then very complicated but White seems to be ok - as lon as he doesn't mind his King being stuck in the centre. He missed his chance for a ko blow and I won the game. The conclusion seems to be that 5.d4?! is too careless.
This countergambit also comes after 1.e4 e5 2.f4 Bc5 3.Nc3 ef4 4.Nf3 Nc6.
@ MNb: I thought the Schelmmer had been refuted by some KG expert...  Wink
  
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MNb
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Re: Discouraging 1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.f4
Reply #1 - 11/13/10 at 14:17:18
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I have met Black's gambit about 25 years ago. I won as White, but not due to the opening. More than 15 years ago I saw it in Dutch corr.chess magazine Schaakschakeringen. Black's results were excellent. In my opinion the Knight sac is completely correct.
White should avoid it with 4.fxe5 d6 5.Nf3 dxe5 6.Bb5.
If you don't mind that line as Black I have another idea for you: 1.e4 e5 2.f4 Bc5 3.Nf3 (3.Nc3 Nc6, ha) d5!? and then Schlemmer's idea 4.Nxe5 (maybe 4.Qe2) dxe4 5.Qh5 Be6.
  

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Siegbert T.
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C25: Discouraging 1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.f4
11/13/10 at 13:56:45
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Recently my engines pointed me towards an idea I've never seen before:
after 1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.f4 I always was inclined towards the unclear gambit 3... Bc5, the idea being 4.fe5 d6 5.ed6 Qd6 with compensation I believe according to established theory.
However the whole idea is bypassed through the "theoretically best" 4.Nf3, transposing to the KGD.

And here it is: (after 1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.f4 Bc5 4.Nf3) my Engines preferred 4....ef4 to my amazement, because 5.d4 suggests itself. Only, the Engines come up with the breathtaking 5...Nd4!!, folowed by 6.Nd4 Qh4+ 7.Ke2 d5 with an firm evaluation 0.00. Black seems to be playing with a draw in hand, and possibilities to try for more. Somewhat offputting for the White player, I believe.

Has anyone seen this idea before?
It's not unimportant for more then one white line:
There's also 1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.f4 ef4 (main stream) and now 4.Nf3 Bc5!? (what a move! I've seen white players bursting out in laughs. But, not for long...)
Let's don't forget 1.e4 e5 2.f4 Nc6 3.Nc3 used to be an good continuation. After 3.Nf3 f5!? of course (Miles).

Looking forward to reading comments on this.
« Last Edit: 07/24/11 at 00:46:35 by Smyslov_Fan »  
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