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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka? (Read 71794 times)
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #24 - 02/29/12 at 07:30:07
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #23 - 02/28/12 at 16:17:10
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Sorry, my question was probably not specific enough.

Thanks for your answer, Chessexplained.

Here are my thoughts:

I have a desktop and a laptop. However, I'd like to buy a tablet (but don't know which one yet) because tablets are more portable than laptops (and I won't get a Mac, sorry, even though the Air looks good) and they are for sure also cheaper. Netbooks are really not good enough in any respect, I think.

The main purpose would be to be able to watch my Chessbase videos, or read CBH-files, not so much to do serious analytical work (for which I'd use a regular computer). The problem is that there seems to be some people at Chessbase that don't like the idea of iPads, or something (e.g. why would they release a new version for Android but nothing for iPad of their app) and also that no app right now supports their CBH or video files. For this reason, using Chessbase via Wyse or something similar would be ok for my needs, but of course not optimal since I'd still have to keep the computer on at home.

The main alternative I have considered is to wait for a Win 8 tablet, and hope that any of the CB programs I have (CB, Fritz, Deep Junior) will run on that one. The problem is that they might not run under Win 8, even though the support at CB just answered me they think they will, but that they have limited experience of Win 8. And even if they do on a desktop, I am not sure they will work on a Win 8 tablet, because of the difference in processors (x86 vs ARM).

I guess with this in mind, I would ask the question a bit differently, i.e. has anybody tried to use Chessbase on their home PC from an iPad using some kind of remote control system, and if so, what are your experience?

And a follow up question would be, those of you that know more about Win 8, do you think most programs will work on a tablet with an ARM processor if they work on a regular x86 processor?
  
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Chessexplained
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #22 - 02/28/12 at 12:07:53
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The video shows chessbase run on a PC, but remotely accessed by the iPad. So you need a laptop/PC after all. If you want some really light weight mobile database, the main question is: how much do you want to spend? I personally have Chessbase run on a Macbook Air, which I absolutely always carry with me, as the weight and dimensions are so little. Decent alternatives seem to be the recently released announced Ultrabooks by other manufacturers. These notebooks incl. the Air combine ultra low weight with very decent performance, also due to the use of SSD with speeds up the database considerably. The processing power is also very good and and far better than for instance on regular, cheaper 'Netbooks'.
  
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #21 - 02/27/12 at 16:04:31
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Mortal Games wrote on 01/08/11 at 19:29:06:
Anyone here has experience or used Chessbase on iPAD? I saw this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-i-UGt70w8
   


I have to repeat the question, has anyone experience in this? I have noticed that somebody posted on this at Chess.com, and I realized that if this works, I'll get an iPad after all!
  
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #20 - 01/08/11 at 19:29:06
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Anyone here has experience or used Chessbase on iPAD? I saw this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-i-UGt70w8
  

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Jesse Gersenson
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #19 - 12/29/10 at 14:18:08
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Stigma wrote on 12/28/10 at 20:49:37:
What state must the remote desktop be in for this to work; fully active or can it be resting, hibernating etc.?


depends. if it's fully running it'll work - if not, depends on the details.

just ran a test with my netbook (1.33 ghz Z520 Atom processor).

using it's own processor, analyzing the starting position while opening a web browser and then an email program - it analyzed an average of
176,000 positions per second
(4.5 million total) in
83 seconds


to open, then close, the email program and then the web browser.

using a 'remote engine' same process, average rate
2,707,000 positions per second
(116 million total) in
43 seconds.

  
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #18 - 12/29/10 at 00:59:05
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Stigma - I mis-spoke. Thinkpad Edge is the product line with the bad screen.

lots of info about thinkpad's here:
http://forum.thinkpads.com/
  
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Stigma
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #17 - 12/28/10 at 23:46:49
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Thanks for that Jesse.

I buy a new computer only once every 3-4 years. Every time a lot of re-education is necessary, since everything I thought I knew about hardware has changed beyond recognition!

Btw. why is the IdeaPad cheaper than the ThinkPad even with a faster (?) processor and more RAM? Has there been so many problems with it that they dropped the price maybe?!
  

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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #16 - 12/28/10 at 23:01:08
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here are rybka speeds on various processors, not many notebooks on this list.

http://sedatchess.110mb.com/index.php?p=1_72

the i5 in laptops is actually an i5m - m for mobile. much slower than the desktop i5 processor, but very very fast compared to the 'netbooks' we were talking about above. This is a notebook processor. the netbooks (names are almost the same) don't have cd drives and have very low performance processors. that's one of the reasons the batteries last so long.

i use a lenovo thinkpad t410i, with an i3-370. It's very capable of doing opening preparation. is as fast as several last generation desktop quad-core processors. battery lasts maybe 1.5-2 hours. the machine is not heavy.

I've tried i5m and i7m processors and, while there's some speed improvements (the i7-720QM ran at 274kn/s), i found those processors to be too hot and cause too much fan noise.

the ideapad is cheaper - but i saw lots of people online complaining about the quality of the screen.
  
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #15 - 12/28/10 at 20:49:37
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I'm a complete newbie concerning this re-routing thing. Sounds exciting though. What state must the remote desktop be in for this to work; fully active or can it be resting, hibernating etc.? (Sorry if this is a stupid question).

But, assume you don't have a powerful desktop at home (in fact I don't!) and I want to combine analysis power, mobility and affordability in a single laptop or notebook, what brands/model should I look at? Say below $1200 or £800, roughly.

I looked at the Lenovo IdeaPad Z360 which is pretty small (13.3" screen), has an Intei Core i5 series processor, 4 GB RAM and (contrary to smaller netbooks and mini PCs) has a CD/DVD drive which I find useful. The only cons I saw was firstly, the battery life is average at best, and secondly, is a Core i5 really powerful enough to prepare openings before and during international opens?

Other models that looked promising budget-wise were the Toshiba Tecra M11 and several HP Pavilion models, but both are bigger and heavier.

I've noticed that a lot of hardware testers around the net actually use the Fritz benchmark to compare processors. Is this something chess players can reliably use to find the perfect (or best value) processor for analysis?
« Last Edit: 12/28/10 at 22:37:47 by Stigma »  

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Jesse Gersenson
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #14 - 12/28/10 at 17:09:43
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This method is suitable for play in the world of international opens.

Basically, your netbook is great in every way except for it's processor and graphics card. When you run an engine on a netbook with a 1.33 ghz Atom processor, you can't use the computer for ANYTHING else.

With the above model, you can check your email, check multiple lines at the same time, listen to music, or whatever it is you normally do with your computer.

GM's I've set this up for are interested in getting a better level of analysis than their notebook offers. Patzers, particularly Nick, the one looking for a cheap notebook to run Rybka and Chessbase, would use this method because it lowers the performance bar, and, by extension, the entry price, needed to run these two programs.
  
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #13 - 12/28/10 at 11:58:43
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Jesse Gersenson wrote on 12/26/10 at 10:12:23:
Jesse Gersenson wrote on 12/26/10 at 08:29:37:
If you have a strong computer 'at home' but want to use a simple notebook for travel, I suggest employing your home computer to run the engine and the netbook to just run the front end (chessbase, arena, aquarium).

notes:
a) this works only if both machines have access to the internet.
b) I use Arena, instead of chessbase, because it runs better on my old Thinkpad T41.


How to connect this wimpy netbook to that zippy processor

Overview
ok - i'm in a hotel room in Bern. my notebook is using the hotel's wifi and is connecting to my home computer.
i open Arena (playwitharena.com) and click analyize. The motor starts up and *blink* *blink*, two seconds gone and it's at depth 17! "This is fast," i smile to myself, "I have to thank Jesse after tomorrow's win."


8 hard steps - in decending order of the probability one 'throws in the towel' [resigns]
1. call your ISP and ask for 'a dedicated ip address'

home computer:
needs a 'dedicated ip address', which is the computer equivelant of 'a permant mailing address'. it's the address our notebook will use
to find our home computer. call your ISP and ask for "a dedicated ip address".

2. login to your router from your home computer

google your router name and the phrase 'admin login', example dlink x4-234 admin login, or check your router's box to figure out the address. typically the address will be
192.168.0.1
192.168.1.1
reference page: http://portforward.com/

3. from your router's admin page, assign your home computer a 'static ip address' based on it's name, or the mac address of it's network adapter. this is the local network's equivalent of a permanent mailing address.

in a minuet we'll tell the router, "Look, if anyone comes knocking at the door asking about chess moves, send them straight to my desktop computer. I told them to use door 7788. Anyone one knocking on that door - send to me.

so, first we have to give our desktop a permanent address - so the router can know where to send people. otherwise, each time we turn our computer off and on, the router will give our computer a new address, invalidating the forward rules we'll be setting up.

a static ip address is the local-network equivalent of a dedicated ip address.
this address can probably be something like
192.168.0.100

check the portfowarding page for more info.

4. set up 'port forwarding'
reference page: http://portforward.com/

you need to tell the router to send (forward) all information which comes into your network on port number 7788 to your analyis computer.

note: assume our dedicated ip address is 1.1.1.1 - our notebook will be connecting to 1.1.1.1 on port 7788, which is sometimes written as 1.1.1.1:7780

5. add engineServer to your home computer and engineclient to your notebook.
http://home.arcor.de/bernhard.wallner/netChess.html

6. start engine server
you have to tell it where the .exe engine is and on which port to run (use 7788).

7. start engineclient on the notebook
this program will make an exe file named, net-yourenginename.exe. from chessbase/arena you will use add this exe as a UCI engine.

enter the dedicated ip address which you got from your ISP, port 7788, and a name for the engine. let's call it Engine. this will make a file named netEngine.exe

8. open Chessbase/Arena add the engine

thread at rybkaforum with some pictures
http://rybkaforum.net/cgi-bin/rybkaforum/topic_show.pl?tid=19248

reason for edit: text setting, formatting



Thanks! Most ingenious. I think I read somewhere last year that Nakamura was doing something like this.

However, for those of us patzers who play in the "real world" of international opens,  with limited prep. time, I'm sure a decent netbook with minimum 2G RAM, loaded with Chessbase, a good database, our own opening files and a couple of decent UCI engines is adequate for most pre-round preparation needs.

In my own case, when preparing, I rarely want to leave an engine to analyse more than 15 ply and  before then I usually want to "interrupt" and "direct" the engine, rather than leave it to analyse on its own.
« Last Edit: 12/28/10 at 12:58:44 by Paddy »  
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Jesse Gersenson
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #12 - 12/26/10 at 10:12:23
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Jesse Gersenson wrote on 12/26/10 at 08:29:37:
If you have a strong computer 'at home' but want to use a simple notebook for travel, I suggest employing your home computer to run the engine and the netbook to just run the front end (chessbase, arena, aquarium).

notes:
a) this works only if both machines have access to the internet.
b) I use Arena, instead of chessbase, because it runs better on my old Thinkpad T41.


How to connect this wimpy netbook to that zippy processor

Overview
ok - i'm in a hotel room in Bern. my notebook is using the hotel's wifi and is connecting to my home computer.
i open Arena (playwitharena.com) and click analyize. The motor starts up and *blink* *blink*, two seconds gone and it's at depth 17! "This is fast," i smile to myself, "I have to thank Jesse after tomorrow's win."


8 hard steps - in decending order of the probability one 'throws in the towel' [resigns]
1. call your ISP and ask for 'a dedicated ip address'

home computer:
needs a 'dedicated ip address', which is the computer equivelant of 'a permant mailing address'. it's the address our notebook will use
to find our home computer. call your ISP and ask for "a dedicated ip address".

2. login to your router from your home computer

google your router name and the phrase 'admin login', example dlink x4-234 admin login, or check your router's box to figure out the address. typically the address will be
192.168.0.1
192.168.1.1
reference page: http://portforward.com/

3. from your router's admin page, assign your home computer a 'static ip address' based on it's name, or the mac address of it's network adapter. this is the local network's equivalent of a permanent mailing address.

in a minuet we'll tell the router, "Look, if anyone comes knocking at the door asking about chess moves, send them straight to my desktop computer. I told them to use door 7788. Anyone one knocking on that door - send to me.

so, first we have to give our desktop a permanent address - so the router can know where to send people. otherwise, each time we turn our computer off and on, the router will give our computer a new address, invalidating the forward rules we'll be setting up.

a static ip address is the local-network equivalent of a dedicated ip address.
this address can probably be something like
192.168.0.100

check the portfowarding page for more info.

4. set up 'port forwarding'
reference page: http://portforward.com/

you need to tell the router to send (forward) all information which comes into your network on port number 7788 to your analyis computer.

note: assume our dedicated ip address is 1.1.1.1 - our notebook will be connecting to 1.1.1.1 on port 7788, which is sometimes written as 1.1.1.1:7780

5. add engineServer to your home computer and engineclient to your notebook.
http://home.arcor.de/bernhard.wallner/netChess.html

6. start engine server
you have to tell it where the .exe engine is and on which port to run (use 7788).

7. start engineclient on the notebook
this program will make an exe file named, net-yourenginename.exe. from chessbase/arena you will use add this exe as a UCI engine.

enter the dedicated ip address which you got from your ISP, port 7788, and a name for the engine. let's call it Engine. this will make a file named netEngine.exe

8. open Chessbase/Arena add the engine

thread at rybkaforum with some pictures
http://rybkaforum.net/cgi-bin/rybkaforum/topic_show.pl?tid=19248

reason for edit: text setting, formatting

  
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #11 - 12/25/10 at 17:51:13
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An external DVD writer costs ca. 50€.

USB sticks are both rather slow and unreliable. They're only meant to comfortably move data from A to B. Better use external USB hard disks (small with internal power supply or cheaper standard drives with external power supply). Then keep all important data on both the external and the internal HDD.

Netbooks are fast enough for a chess database (after you've spent a couple of hours uninstalling / de-activating all the crap the manufacturer installed per default Wink ). The only problem is analyzing stuff because CPU performance is a bottle neck. A blunder check is okay, but if you want to go 25 half-moves deep you need some patience.
  
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Re: Laptop for Chessbase & Rybka?
Reply #10 - 12/25/10 at 16:06:32
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FM Dikkie wrote on 12/25/10 at 15:40:28:
Is it easy to run chessbase on a netbook? And how?
I thought these have no cd/dvd player? So I guess this goes via USB-stick?


Or an external cd/dvd player - they're not very expensive.
  
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