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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations (Read 32289 times)
kylemeister
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #39 - 05/12/15 at 16:47:18
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I notice that a game Gunnarsson-Golod 2002 transposed via 5. h4 h6 6. Nf3 e6 7. d4, with Black opting for the ...Nxd4 approach (it was won by White, who was playing up about 250 points).
  
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TonyRo
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #38 - 05/12/15 at 14:41:59
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I have been looking a bit at the Fischer System lately (for White), and came up with an interesting idea. I don't think it's groundbreaking or anything, but an interesting practical weapon nonetheless. I thought that after 1.c4 c5 2.g3 g6 3.Bg2 Bg7 4.Nc3 Nc6 5.Nf3 e6 6.h4!? was interesting. My idea is that after the most played (and thematic) move 6...h6 we can play into the common isolani lines after 7.d4 cxd4 8.Nb5 d5 9.cxd5 exd5 10.O-O Nge7 11.Bf4 O-O 12.Nfxd4, etc.

My thought was that eventually White would grab a free tempo with Qd2, and that perhaps the insertion of h4/h6 favors White somewhat. Maybe White is a smidge better, or at least he can claim that he's reached a position that is somewhat atypical of the Fischer System. The only game to feature 6.h4 and 7.d4 is recent, and favored White for sure:



Black can play 6...h5 instead, but then maybe White should prefer 11.Bg5, I dunno, really just started to look at it. Thoughts?
  
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Vass
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #37 - 03/08/14 at 09:03:00
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BladezII wrote on 03/08/14 at 08:49:43:
I have a question, or perhaps, a proposal for discussion here --

What about this deviation by black on move 6... 


1. Nf3 c5 2. c4 Nc6 3. g3 g6 4. Bg2 Bg7 5. Nc3 e6

6. d3 d5

Before White has the chance to play Bg5.

Any thoughts ?




As it seems to me...it only transposes to the main line after 7.Bg5 Nge7  Undecided
  
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BladezII
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #36 - 03/08/14 at 08:49:43
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I have a question, or perhaps, a proposal for discussion here --

What about this deviation by black on move 6... 


1. Nf3 c5 2. c4 Nc6 3. g3 g6 4. Bg2 Bg7 5. Nc3 e6

6. d3 d5

Before White has the chance to play Bg5.

Any thoughts ?



  

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BladezII
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #35 - 02/28/14 at 01:35:13
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BabySnake wrote on 12/06/11 at 11:03:28:
I had forgotten but then remembered when I came back to this thread that an opponent of mine a while age did choose the exact same set-up and move order (8. Bd2 b6 9. a3 Bb7)  which to me after more thought seems to put the ball back into white's court regarding the Marin/Jobava approach vs the Fischer set-up. So I totally agree with Vass....I'm stumped!

I still think Marin's books are fantastic, but he covers so much new ground that of course he can not possibly foresee all possibilities!  Grin





The problem with Marin's book is that is it did not use heavy computer assistance to check some lines.  The book faces so many problems because some move orders do not hold their integrity when checked with our silicon partners.

Another GM who caught very many problems with Marin's book is GM Delchev.  The list is very vast.

Marin needed a good team of assistants to check his lines and he needed to use more computer assistance.
  

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TonyRo
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #34 - 02/27/14 at 02:47:44
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Yes, Watson's coverage of this line was quite good, and reasonably convincing from a practical perspective (like you said).
  
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Ametanoitos
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #33 - 02/21/14 at 09:39:41
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My problem with this as Black is that i'll have zero winning chances, while at the slightlest inaccuracy White will have an overwelming position. Looking at Watson's coverage of this line in his "Mastering" series, i see that White has also a choice of promising continuations! For a practical player i don't see why he has to look smething more than this actually.
  
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TonyRo
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #32 - 02/21/14 at 03:00:38
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Ametanoitos wrote on 02/20/14 at 22:47:10:
White has some initiative in the symmetrical variation with e3+Ne2+d4. Isn't this enough for an edge at least in OTB play?


This was always my opinion as well. When I looked at it a year ago or so, I thought White had annoying play and reasonable practical chances, but that Black could prove equality with precise play. Surprise!

Grin
  
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Ametanoitos
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #31 - 02/20/14 at 22:47:10
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White has some initiative in the symmetrical variation with e3+Ne2+d4. Isn't this enough for an edge at least in OTB play?
  
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Vass
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #30 - 01/13/14 at 22:49:05
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Thank you, thank you, thank you people!  Grin
By the way, looking at games like these, one may think they're not substantial. After all, draws on 13-th move?!?
In fact, a good correspondence chess player spends many, many days to analyze the posible continuations. And the fact that both players agreed to draw, after all, means that the position is completely equal. Equal, yes, but full of life for an OTB game.  Wink
  
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #29 - 01/13/14 at 21:09:22
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Thanks for posting some miniature games  Grin
  
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Vass
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #28 - 01/13/14 at 19:34:43
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fling wrote on 01/13/14 at 16:30:58:
Lol, well, I am preparing to give it a shot. Who knows what I might stumble upon as Black :-D

You won't be disappointed. Here are my last correspondence (mini) games:





This line seems to be completely harmless. I've spent hours and hours to find even a tiny edge for black or white, with no success. It seems my opponents came to the same conclusion.  Wink
  
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fling
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #27 - 01/13/14 at 16:30:58
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Lol, well, I am preparing to give it a shot. Who knows what I might stumble upon as Black :-D
  
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Vass
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #26 - 01/13/14 at 08:55:01
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fling wrote on 01/12/14 at 21:40:33:
Vass, did you come up with something more substantial?


You said it here already:

fling wrote on 11/30/12 at 12:40:28:
... I guess the Fischer system is alive and kicking I guess.


Wink
  
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Re: English Symmetrical, Fischer setup recommendations
Reply #25 - 01/12/14 at 21:40:33
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Vass, did you come up with something more substantial?
  
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