ChessPub Forum - The best analysis program?

Pawnpusher Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 274 Joined: 01/04/18 Gender:	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #178 - 06/04/19 at 23:40:57	Post Tools	Print Post
	I do use Cuda, the evaluation puzzles me. I am used to seeing scores far lower than LcO gives for positions. Have you noticed this?


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tony37 God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 619 Joined: 10/16/10	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #177 - 06/04/19 at 23:26:56	Post Tools	Print Post
	brabo wrote on 06/04/19 at 11:15:32: tony37 wrote on 06/04/19 at 09:30:49: ordo elo (or self-play elo) can be very misleading, as I wrote a few posts before can I ask what AMD card you're using? probably way better than mine My AMD FX(tm)-6300 6 core processor 3,5Ghz is configured with a Nvidia Geforce GTX 960. That is average nowadays. but since you have an Nvidia card, you probably use the (fast) Cuda version of Lc0 after all I think JFugre was talking about using the OpenCL version on an AMD graphics card like Radeon


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brabo God Member Offline Welcome chessfriend Posts: 1073 Joined: 02/02/07	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #176 - 06/04/19 at 11:15:32	Post Tools	Print Post
	tony37 wrote on 06/04/19 at 09:30:49: ordo elo (or self-play elo) can be very misleading, as I wrote a few posts before can I ask what AMD card you're using? probably way better than mine Yes I also don't trust the ordo elo much. It is an indication but I consider the match much more valuable. My AMD FX(tm)-6300 6 core processor 3,5Ghz is configured with a Nvidia Geforce GTX 960. That is average nowadays.


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Pawnpusher Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 274 Joined: 01/04/18 Gender:	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #175 - 06/04/19 at 11:09:02	Post Tools	Print Post
	Yes I think Tony37 is on point according to what I have read. If I understand it is not only the ELO of a network but the number of games (in other words the number of positions) in the network. I have an Nvidia Geforce 1060 card, and am looking to find the best settings as I read that LcO is sort of difficult to get optimized. Having said that I am impressed at the play of LcO.


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tony37 God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 619 Joined: 10/16/10	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #174 - 06/04/19 at 09:30:49	Post Tools	Print Post
	brabo wrote on 06/04/19 at 09:05:37: JFugre wrote on 06/04/19 at 06:18:45: OpenCL still gets reasonable performance on AMD cards. Correct. I ran last week a 100 game match 15 minutes + 10 seconds between the commercial Komodo 11 and Lc0 on my AMD (2,5 years old) and Komodo only won with 56 - 44. That is about 50 elo difference. I expect with a longer timecontrol that Lc0 would maybe even win such match. I was using the opencl and a network = 3214 ordo elo. Today there is already a network = 3253 ordo elo. ordo elo (or self-play elo) can be very misleading, as I wrote a few posts before can I ask what AMD card you're using? probably way better than mine


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brabo God Member Offline Welcome chessfriend Posts: 1073 Joined: 02/02/07	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #173 - 06/04/19 at 09:05:37	Post Tools	Print Post
	JFugre wrote on 06/04/19 at 06:18:45: OpenCL still gets reasonable performance on AMD cards. Correct. I ran last week a 100 game match 15 minutes + 10 seconds between the commercial Komodo 11 and Lc0 on my AMD (2,5 years old) and Komodo only won with 56 - 44. That is about 50 elo difference. I expect with a longer timecontrol that Lc0 would maybe even win such match. I was using the opencl and a network = 3214 ordo elo. Today there is already a network = 3253 ordo elo. I will most likely write an article on my blog about it as I guess it is interesting to see what the performance of Lc0 today is on more or less commodity hardware.


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JFugre Junior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 89 Joined: 01/22/19	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #172 - 06/04/19 at 06:18:45	Post Tools	Print Post
	TopNotch wrote on 06/04/19 at 01:58:39: I've tried this and essentially LC0 is utterly useless running on windows unless you have a Nvidia Graphics Card. I honestly don't understand why they even offer blas, opencl, its a joke. OpenCL still gets reasonable performance on AMD cards. OpenCL on a CPU or an Intel iGPU is too slow. They just lack the horsepower. It's mainly when comparing with the RTX cards that the gap widens up to ludicrous levels (i.e. an RTX 2060 is 15 times faster than a high end AMD card, whereas with a GTX 1060 it's only ~2.8).


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an ordinary chessplayer God Member Offline I used to be not bad. Posts: 1796 Location: Columbus, OH (USA) Joined: 01/02/15	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #171 - 06/04/19 at 03:22:18	Post Tools	Print Post
	TopNotch wrote on 06/04/19 at 01:58:39: I honestly don't understand why they even offer blas, opencl, its a joke. Not a joke. It's a software experiment, they are trying not to limit the target hardware. Alphazero didn't run on stock x86 hardware, and lc0 need not, either. Some systems don't have graphics at all, but sufficiently powerful CPUs (or TPUs in Alphazero's case) can still make it interesting. Who knows what kind of crazy homegrown system someone might want to try it on?


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TopNotch God Member Offline I only look 1 move ahead, but its always the best Posts: 2211 Joined: 01/04/03 Gender:	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #170 - 06/04/19 at 01:58:39	Post Tools	Print Post
	I've tried this and essentially LC0 is utterly useless running on windows unless you have a Nvidia Graphics Card. I honestly don't understand why they even offer blas, opencl, its a joke.

	The man who tries to do something and fails is infinitely better than he who tries to do nothing and succeeds - Lloyd Jones
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Pawnpusher Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 274 Joined: 01/04/18 Gender:	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #169 - 06/03/19 at 14:46:16	Post Tools	Print Post
	Yes, I think for cuda to work you have to have some sort of Nvidia GPU, other GPUs use open cl, and if no graphics card the blas. I think that is how it works.


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tony37 God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 619 Joined: 10/16/10	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #168 - 06/03/19 at 08:09:44	Post Tools	Print Post
	Leon_Trotsky wrote on 06/02/19 at 22:37:00: I followed the instructions, but still analysis window is totally blank for Windows there are three versions (blas, opencl and cuda), did you try all three? the blas and opencl versions are likely to be very slow, so don't expect too much


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Pawnpusher Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 274 Joined: 01/04/18 Gender:	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #167 - 06/03/19 at 00:41:47	Post Tools	Print Post
	I just used the directions from the Github LcO site and it did take a couple of tries, I also looked at the Youtube site quoted above, and got it going. I looked on a computer chess forum. It was originally called Talkchess because I am trying to find the best settings for my GPU. It was mostly interesting and somewhat useful. Hope this helps.


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Leon_Trotsky Senior Member Offline Кто был никем — тот станет всем! Posts: 499 Location: Barcelona, CAT Joined: 08/11/17 Gender:	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #166 - 06/02/19 at 22:37:00	Post Tools	Print Post
	I followed the instructions, but still analysis window is totally blank

	https://elajedrezdelproletariado.blogspot.com/
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proustiskeen YaBB Moderator Offline Hello from Omaha! Posts: 680 Joined: 08/11/08	Re: The best analysis program? Reply #165 - 06/02/19 at 18:24:53	Post Tools	Print Post
	@Leon_Trotsky - this may be of assistance. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2SB4Z-o5ZQ


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tony37

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Re: The best analysis program?
Reply #164 - 06/02/19 at 16:04:57

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update: I'm really not sure this weights file with 4305 elo is actually better than more recent ones about 3300
the first one gives some really weird evaluation in the following position, it initially thinks white is better there (the more recent file doesn't)

update2: Now I finally got it: self-play elo doesn't seem to be important, you have to look at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1XSJiCcQpCLv0fNwrUn7jXjdkZFU63YFEWpdXv6dS... (I seem to remember this site was down when I first looked there)
So network number 42000 is strongest available for now

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