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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Markovich steps down as Moderator (Read 14251 times)
TalJechin
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #35 - 05/15/12 at 10:54:52
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[quote author=6950535C5E51504D3F0 link=1336829607/33#33 date=1337071977]
Finally, good luck to Markovich with his own chess website and I hope that you'll post some information about your project.[/quote]

Yes, it will indeed be interesting to see what will come of the Alekhine project, looking forward to seeing it!

As for the step down, my impression for quite a while has been that Markovich was a bit fed up with constantly correcting entries for the same kind of errors over and over which may have inspired some draconian ideas, mostly in favour of deleting drivel instead of relocating it. I can't say that I blame him, as I might myself have done the same the umpteenth time someone would post a misspelled header in the wrong section...

Still, a moderator must try to keep a low profile or else the corrections can easily be interpreted as personal, which causes unnecessary conflicts. So I reckon it's all for the best in the end - we've lost a moderator but we'll soon gain a new chess site to visit and Mark will surely be happier creating content than deleting drivel! :)
  
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GMTonyKosten
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #34 - 05/15/12 at 10:15:23
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Viceroy wrote on 05/13/12 at 12:42:44:
Mr kosten, I think you are being deliberately obtuse.

Really? Did anyone understand your weird post?

Viceroy wrote on 05/13/12 at 12:42:44:
and we are talking Shawshank Redemption.

What? Huh
  
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Volcanor
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #33 - 05/15/12 at 08:52:57
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I'm not able to judge the work Markovich did as a moderator, but he did something! And to my knowlegde, without getting anything (or at least without getting much) in return. It's easy to criticize people doing something when you do nothing yourself. Markovich, thank you for your job as a moderator!

I highly value Markovich's comments as a forum member. I'm not saying that I always agree with him, but he has intersting opinions and he is willing to share them. I hope we'll continue to see him make posts on this website. Markovich, thank you for your comments on this site!

Finally, good luck to Markovich with his own chess website and I hope that you'll post some information about your project.
  
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Jay
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #32 - 05/15/12 at 00:31:38
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kylemeister wrote on 05/14/12 at 21:37:49:
Didn't know Markovich stood accused of being banal -- now that just goes too far!

No, no.  I was not accusing him.  I was simply giving examples of badness and saying even if he was these things, surely he wasn't all the time.  His service has value.  We should thank him for that value.  Whether he also had bad qualities is beyond the point.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #31 - 05/14/12 at 22:41:40
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Thank you Markovich for your time and effort. Please continue as a member of this forum. You have contributed much.
« Last Edit: 05/15/12 at 01:31:27 by trw »  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #30 - 05/14/12 at 22:18:02
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I will let this thread continue for another few hours, then will lock it.

This serves no purpose that I can see.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #29 - 05/14/12 at 21:37:49
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Didn't know Markovich stood accused of being banal -- now that just goes too far!
  
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ghenghisclown
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #28 - 05/14/12 at 21:35:28
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ErictheRed wrote on 05/14/12 at 20:51:55:
Arrgghh...let's let this one go... my goodness, someone apologizes and resigns and others want to continue to say bad things about him?  Let it go, you got your wish.


You are leaving out a few details.


He tendered his resignation and then said: "a small handful of  of whom would happly take the forum to hell if given free rein (e.g. Gambit and Ghengisclown)"  and

"...there are a few people, you can just about count them on one hand, whose viciousness, immaturity and disregard for decency requires a strong hand."

I have a disregard for decency (am I posting porn?) because I put too many quotes in a response?

I will remind everyone that he left because he told another person, Barnaby (neither one of the super villains above, Gambit or I) to kiss his a##.

I have actually made an effort to tone down what I say and how I say it. I have endeavored to remove sarcasm as of late and even ignore certain snide comments pointed at me.

My reward for this was having my post deleted because I quoted several people to support my case in one thread, quoting one after the other (much the same as I have above). Finally he admitted that he removed almost my whole post because of his browser issue. He then wouldn't allow me to discuss it. So it's easy for people to dismiss this when they themselves haven't been censored.
  

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Jay
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #27 - 05/14/12 at 20:56:30
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Gilchrist is a legend wrote on 05/14/12 at 20:27:24:
http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1331189420/133#133

I have been on many forums before, mostly tourism/travel or language learning, and I have never seen moderators act like that before, especially the second sentence of that post (no. 133).

There is also a time to be magnanimous.  Even if you think he was rude, heavy-handed, and banal, I think we can all say "Thanks for the service" when he leaves.  Surely he wasn't those 3 thing all the time.
  
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ErictheRed
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #26 - 05/14/12 at 20:51:55
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Arrgghh...let's let this one go.  Markovich has resigned and apologized, let's not keep saying bad things about him, mmkay??

I've always respected Markovich's opinion and frankly have no idea how good of a job he does as a moderator; my posts are never altered or deleted, I never get PMs, so I'll just stay out of that.  But my goodness, someone apologizes and resigns and others want to continue to say bad things about him?  Let it go, you got your wish.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #25 - 05/14/12 at 20:27:24
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http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1331189420/133#133

I have been on many forums before, mostly tourism/travel or language learning, and I have never seen moderators act like that before, especially the second sentence of that post (no. 133).
  

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barnaby
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #24 - 05/14/12 at 17:32:58
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I will now takemy leave as well...good luck to all chess players and people using this wonderful resource.

If I in anyway had an impact in his stepping down I am not apologetic and am instead pleased that he has finally realized his heavy handed approach to over moderation of things he personally is against is not welcomed by all the users.

Peace.

may peace of mind and action find us all before we leave this existence

  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #23 - 05/14/12 at 17:30:17
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GMTonyKosten wrote on 05/12/12 at 22:02:16:
barnaby wrote on 05/12/12 at 04:05:47:
OCD.

This is not really appropriate for this Forum, what makes you think you can just insult moderators?



recognizing something is not an insult...

markovich has done his fair share of insulting people as well.

no apologies for recognizing his propensity to overkill the application of rules has caused a lot of stress for people and has been the kernel for many forum issues.

His willingness to continually break his own set of standards in order to win a point is a major point of hypocrisy that is visible to anyone with an objective position here
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #22 - 05/14/12 at 16:16:17
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I haven't been following this at all but Markovich has done a great service to the forum over the years, and hopefully can still be persuaded to stay on as moderator.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #21 - 05/14/12 at 15:32:37
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It looks fairly certain that Markovich plans on staying resigned.  Everyone please thank him for his service!

Thanks Markovich.  I appreciate the service you provided. 

Occaisional disagreement should not be taken as lack of repsect.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #20 - 05/13/12 at 21:00:05
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Viceroy wrote on 05/13/12 at 12:42:44:
Markovich, you don't have to bother replying on this thread, a pm will do.

I suspect based on only one potentially negative interaction among many positive with Markovich what irritated some posters.  Correcting a user in a forum instead of a PM is like using a chainsaw when a scalpel is needed.  Try PM first.  And don't resign.  Chessplayers can be crabby, combatative.  Take us with a grain of salt and we will try to do the same.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #19 - 05/13/12 at 18:24:44
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I don't want to take over the forum. In fact, I welcome moderation from SmyslovFan and now Proustiskeen!

This for me is about consistency and having a good logical basis for doing things. "I don't like it" is not  a good basis.

And I didn't send you (Markovich) hate mail. Yes, I got angry...AFTER you explained you deleted me because of YOUR browser issue. You didn't like all the colors. You just happened to be doing this to someone who disagreed with you. The thread post had no insults. You just deleted it because:

You didn't like the optics in your browser.

After having done the damage and realizing the conflict of interest, you abandoned moderating that thread. That's an admission of what went wrong.

So I think I have a point.
  

"Experience is a dim lamp, which only lights the one who bears it."
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #18 - 05/13/12 at 13:32:01
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Markovich,

no worries, we all make mistakes.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #17 - 05/13/12 at 13:25:06
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Sorry.  I am confusing you with someone else.

My apologies.
  

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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #16 - 05/13/12 at 12:42:44
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Quote:
I don't understand your post, but it is clear that you don't run a Forum!


Mr kosten, I think you are being deliberately obtuse; and we are talking Shawshank Redemption! Still, your forum, do whatever you think best.

Markovich,

Quote:
people sending me hate mail (e.g... Viceroy


Sorry, but I think you are confusing me with someone else. We did exchange a few pms about 2 years ago concerning linguistics. I thought it was quite a pleasant exchange of views, with some humor from both sides and we came quite close to agreement. FWIW it was about the word whilst.

Your last line of your pm to me said:Fundamentally though I accept your point that it's a cultural difference and not worth arguing about.

I replied: I concur.

I don't think that could be considered hate mail. Smiley

Markovich, you don't have to bother replying on this thread, a pm will do. (if you feel like replying, of course Grin.) But, I feel I had to correct this, as I detest hate mail and anyone who sends it. I have never posted anything, anywhere, that I wouldn't say to someone's face.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #15 - 05/13/12 at 10:34:07
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Jupp53 wrote on 05/13/12 at 09:41:17:
I didn't find the meaning of "OCD". [If it's the DSM-IV diagnosis it's a self-offending post in terms of striking intellectual underperforming. Or is it about running barefoot?]

So what's it about? Restricting citations is good. Killing a moderator is bad.


It wasn't "OMG" by itself, it was just the continual carping and sniping by a few people, a small handful of  of whom would happly take the forum to hell if given free rein (e.g. Gambit and Ghengisclown), people sending me hate mail (e.g. the Ghengisclown and Viceroy); the surety of some people who have not had to moderate anything that they know much better how to moderate; my own occupation with a chess website project of my own (online in the next 60 days); and my general sense that the game here really isn't worth the candle.

You do have a forum here that pretty much polices itself, but there are a few people, you can just about count them on one hand, whose viciousness, immaturity and disregard for decency requires a strong hand.

Anyway I'm done with it.  I'll still post now and then.  I will not, however, respond to the heated reply that any trifling offense to Ghengisclown inevitably generates.  One of the advantages of not being a moderator is that you can put someone on your "hide" list.
  

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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #14 - 05/13/12 at 10:04:56
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Viceroy wrote on 05/12/12 at 23:32:22:
here's a tip: make sure they understand the difference between moderate and dominate.

I don't understand your post, but it is clear that you don't run a Forum! Roll Eyes
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #13 - 05/13/12 at 09:41:17
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I didn't find the meaning of "OCD". [If it's the DSM-IV diagnosis it's a self-offending post in terms of striking intellectual underperforming. Or is it about running barefoot?]

So what's it about? Restricting citations is good. Killing a moderator is bad.
  

Medical textbooks say I should be dead since April 2002.
Dum spiro spero. Smiley
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #12 - 05/13/12 at 07:53:01
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Matemax, I will answer you in the moderation thread.
  

"Experience is a dim lamp, which only lights the one who bears it."
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #11 - 05/13/12 at 07:43:23
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ghenghisclown wrote on 05/13/12 at 07:35:33:
Hey Markovich, what happened to the rule that said you're not entitled to give offence back when you have been offended?

Don't kick someone already on the floor  Sad - give him a chance to stand up again. Wink
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #10 - 05/13/12 at 07:35:33
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Hey Markovich, what happened to the rule that said you're not entitled to give offense back when you have been offended?

By the way, I have argued that one (normally) has a right to answer one's detractors, not a right to offend people. Of course, strictly speaking, no one has a right to do anything on here - it's private space.

Basically, what's going on here is you're actually deeply annoyed with a lot of posters on Chesspub. This is affecting how you moderate. Your personal likes and dislikes are not a good basis for moderating, deletion, censorship, or consistency.
  

"Experience is a dim lamp, which only lights the one who bears it."
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #9 - 05/13/12 at 00:13:05
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Unnecessary... but also unnecessarily passive-aggressive.

You do a good job, Markovich, but a thick skin is needed to be a moderator.  More than that, you need to be 'better' than those whose posts you moderate.  Why sink to the level of the cretins whose posts warrant deletion?

I'd ask that you reconsider your decision, and that Tony not accept your resignation. 


Markovich wrote on 05/12/12 at 21:09:47:
OK, I herewith resign my role as a moderator in these forums. 

Best to all.

  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #8 - 05/12/12 at 23:32:22
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Tony Kosten,

I guess that means we will have to start looking for Moderators again

here's a tip: make sure they understand the difference between moderate and dominate.

Dogs like to urinate in an indiscriminate manner to mark out their territory; some forum members here like to do the same with their posts: ensure the new mod does not display such a canine tendency.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #7 - 05/12/12 at 23:11:01
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Markovich wrote on 05/12/12 at 21:09:47:
OK, I herewith resign my role as a moderator in these forums.

That's a pity, I guess that means we will have to start looking for Moderators again. Sad
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #6 - 05/12/12 at 22:02:16
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barnaby wrote on 05/12/12 at 04:05:47:
OCD.

This is not really appropriate for this Forum, what makes you think you can just insult moderators?
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #5 - 05/12/12 at 21:41:45
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And now, not being a moderator any more, I will say that "KMA" seemed like an appropriate enough response to "OCD," actually.  But it violates the precept that rudeness should not be met with rudeness, and so, I apologize, not to barnaby, but to others here.
  

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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #4 - 05/12/12 at 21:09:47
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OK, I herewith resign my role as a moderator in these forums. 

Best to all.
  

The Great Oz has spoken!
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #3 - 05/12/12 at 19:59:11
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Hold on.  This is how a moderator speaks and behaves?  I read just about everything that Markovich writes, because I agree with most of what he says.  It is not lost on me, however, that most of the arguments and instances of poor decorum on this forum end up involving Markovich, and not in a moderator role.

We have a lovely little community here.  It's beginning to fray, in part because of a lack of new blood, but also because of a growing lack of fair play amongst members.  I don't have an answer beyond encouraging self-restraint, but this concerns me.

Markovich wrote on 05/12/12 at 13:33:26:
barnaby wrote on 05/12/12 at 04:05:47:
OCD.


KMA.

  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #2 - 05/12/12 at 17:11:56
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Markovich wrote on 05/12/12 at 13:33:26:
barnaby wrote on 05/12/12 at 04:05:47:
OCD.


KMA.


One reason I will sometimes quote an entire previous post is because I've seen some people change their post after someone has commented on it. This practice has become relatively rare here, so I have not seen the need.

I'm pretty dense sometimes. It took me quite a while to figure out what Markovich's comment meant.
  
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Re: Markovich steps down as Moderator
Reply #1 - 05/12/12 at 13:50:40
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Yes, my rule was a joke. Often less is more, as Bibs pointed out.
  

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Markovich steps down as Moderator
05/12/12 at 13:33:26
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barnaby wrote on 05/12/12 at 04:05:47:
OCD.


KMA.
  

The Great Oz has spoken!
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