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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Revival of 1 b3 (Read 9996 times)
XChess1971
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #26 - 07/10/19 at 12:36:26
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A position can appeal to you. But it doesn't mean you are better. On the contrary to play Bb2 and exchange it for the knight on f6 just to ruin black's pawn structure on the king side when the center is not defined doesn't make much sense. Even worse when you moved b3. Many players of the white side play d4 and e3 to counter the bishop that goes to g7. But black is not forced to do that. There are positions in which you play d5 first and then c5 depending on the situation. And white has to watch out for checks on b4 and a5. Believe it or not black could even sacrifice the d5 pawn for activity in some cases. There were times when in some bliz games I played h5, Bh6 and 0-0. The point was that if a knight came to f4 you would trade the bishop. Also h5 threatens h4 and hxg3. So if white played h4 you could try f6, g5 and f4. In those positions black had to control e4 and hold the queen side. Not a fun position even for a KIng's Indian player. But still 4...d5 the very next move sounds like the way to go. Attacking or controlling the center with 4...d5 and 5...c5 looks like a priority in the position. Stockfish 10 suggest against 4.d4 b6 as one option making sure that once white plays 5.g3 black will answer Bb7. The point is not to just play with black Bg7 and 0-0 and give white a free hand in the center. Even if white plays 4.g3 d5 is strong.
« Last Edit: 07/10/19 at 21:01:45 by XChess1971 »  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #25 - 07/08/19 at 17:51:53
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Yeah, Ruifeng Li had game against Vigorito the next day that went 4... d5 5 cxd5 Qxd5 6 Nc3 Qa5 7 a3 c5 8 e3 Bg7 9 Nf3 and it looks like Li was significantly worse for stretches of the game although he drew.

Maybe 6 e3.  Agree that if anyone is better, it is Black, but looks playable for White if the position appeals to him.



  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #24 - 07/08/19 at 06:28:16
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Prasanna R obviously was unprepared. Like XChess mentioned 4...d5 is better as the obvious 5.cxd5 (5.e3 d4) Qxd5 6.Nc3?! Qa5 shows the downsides of White's play.
  

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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #23 - 07/07/19 at 22:07:11
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Ruifeng Li won a nice game at National Open as White with this 1 b3 g6 2 Bb2 Nf6 3 Bxf6 line ...

[Event "Las Vegas National op"]
[White "Li, Ruifeng"]
[Black "Prasanna Raghuram, Rao"]
[Site "Las Vegas"]
[Round "4"]
[Annotator ""]
[Result "1-0"]
[Date "2019.06.14"]
[WhiteElo "2546"]
[BlackElo "2448"]
[PlyCount "53"]

1. b3 Nf6 2. Bb2 g6 3. Bxf6 exf6 4. c4 Bg7 5. Nc3 f5 6. Rc1 b6 7. Nf3 Bb7 8. e3 0-0 9. g3 Nc6 10. Bg2 Ne5 11. d4 Nxf3+ 12. Bxf3 Bxf3 13. Qxf3 c5 14. dxc5 b5 15. 0-0 Bxc3 16. Rxc3 Qa5 17. Rfc1 bxc4 18. Rxc4 Qxa2 19. Qd1 Rfd8 20. Rd4 Qa3 21. c6 d6 22. c7 Re8 23. Rxd6 Rac8 24. Rd7 Qa5 25. Qd4 Qb6 26. Qxb6 axb6 27. Rc6 1-0
  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #22 - 07/07/19 at 12:09:35
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Mtal wrote on 07/07/19 at 03:23:18:
I was trying b3 for a little bit but never liked the tromp like positions. Do b3 players like it? In the Jacobs b3 book g4 is kinda interesting. I wanted to look at other stuff vs nf6.


One more thing, I just feel b3 does not work in those troop positions cause doesn't my pawn want to be on b4?
  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #21 - 07/07/19 at 03:23:18
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I was trying b3 for a little bit but never liked the tromp like positions. Do b3 players like it? In the Jacobs b3 book g4 is kinda interesting. I wanted to look at other stuff vs nf6.
  
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XChess1971
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #20 - 06/23/19 at 10:34:10
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RdC wrote on 12/30/12 at 12:21:24:
As mentioned at http://www.chesspublishing.com/content/12/index.htm, GM Jobova has revived interest in 1 b3.

Amongst the games is the sequence 1. b3 Nf6 2. Bb2 g6 3. Bxf6 gxf6 4. c4 Bg7 5. Nc3 f5 6. Rc1

Checking my personal database, I found that I had played this idea myself in the 1970s. Jobova continued with g3 which I imagine is better than the approach I would use with e3, Nf3 and Be2.

Larsen and Fischer had played 1. b3 in 1970 and later. The idea of taking on f6 is obvious enough, even if at first you only regard it as a blitz weapon.

Why not 4...d5? getting rid of the backward pawn?
  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #19 - 06/23/19 at 07:48:38
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Leon_Trotsky wrote on 06/23/19 at 04:51:00:
By the way, not sure if they have this book in other languages, but I have the Italian book b3 attacco: Nimzo-Larsen by Alessio De Santiis, published 2017.

If you want a newer resource on 1. b3, it looks interesting. Better if you know Italian, or at least a related language where you can follow easily (castellano, French, etc.).

Hmm, I would indeed aim to use my knowledge of French.  I recall that that once enabled me to just about understand every word of a Spanish-language book on the Trompowsky.
On a historical note, it occurs to me that 2017 is 40 years since the publication of a Nimzo-Larsen book I once owned, by Raymond Keene.
« Last Edit: 06/23/19 at 21:36:04 by kylemeister »  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #18 - 06/23/19 at 04:51:00
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You replied after seven years ¿  Cheesy

By the way, not sure if they have this book in other languages, but I have the Italian book b3 attacco: Nimzo-Larsen by Alessio De Santiis, published 2017.

If you want a newer resource on 1. b3, it looks interesting. Better if you know Italian, or at least a related language where you can follow easily (castellano, French, etc.).
  
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XChess1971
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #17 - 06/23/19 at 02:55:18
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RdC wrote on 12/30/12 at 17:17:31:
Uberdecker wrote on 12/30/12 at 16:26:59:
P.S. Which lines with ...c5 were you referring to?


I would imagine this is the reference game. The problem with the early c5 is that it gives away the d5 square for the rest of the game, as Karpov demonstrates. It must be well enough known that only a handful of players have repeated Browne's move order over the last forty years. The popularity of Hedgehog set ups is such that most players prefer 3. .. e6 or the 3. .. Nc6. In the latter case, transpositions to Karpov-Browne can remain possible if Black later tries .. g6 .




The problem in playing 3..g6 is that black compromised his position with 1..c5. And it created a big hole on d5 after Bxf6. If he wanted to adopt a ...g6 system it had to be played right after 1.c4 (1.c4 g6). Otherwise 1.c4 c5 2.b3 had to be followed with something different but not allow Bxf6 doubling pawns and controlling d5 after Nc3.
  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #16 - 02/06/13 at 07:48:43
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I find it hard to see what White gains by having the d-pawn on d2 rather than d4 in this specific line. On d4, it takes space in the center, it does not block the black-squared bishop (since the bishop does not exist), and it is not very exposed - White can cover it with e3, and if Black ever plays ...c5, White will have an excellent square on d5.

I would rather think that this is indeed an inferior version of the 2...g6 3.Bxf6 Tromp, but that White plays it because 2...g6 is not a very usual way to meet the Tromp. 2...g6 is only Black's 5th most popular choice against the Tromp, while it is the most popular move after 1.b3 Nf6 2.Bb2. Black's most popular choice against the Tromp is 2...Ne4, which of course makes no sense against 1.b3. Against ...e6/...d5 setups, White can play a Bird setup with e3 and f4, when the Bishop stands well on b2.

So, White plays 1.b3, at the risk of playing an inferior 2...g6 Tromp, but taking advantage of the bishop's placement in other lines.
  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #15 - 01/26/13 at 13:44:31
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About blitz games, it proves nothing since it is even possible to have a 99,99 % score in lines that are better for the opponent! About this c concrete position I am no shure.
  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #14 - 01/25/13 at 18:23:52
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It’s not possible to score heavily in a series of blitz games with a line which should be, say, equal? 

Regarding White holding back his d-pawn, offhand I wonder if he would be claiming an advantage in the case of something like this:  3. Bxf6 ef 4. c4 f5 5. Nc3 Bg7 6. e3 0-0 7. Nge2 d6 8. g3 Nd7 9. Bg2 c6 10. 0-0 Re8 11. Rc1 (this involves a series of White moves mentioned earlier).

I suppose a major issue is 3. Bxf6 ef 4. c4 d5, as played by Wang Hao against Jobava in the same event (albeit blitz) as Jobava-Mamedyarov.  I notice that that was the move given by ECO (as leading to "unclear"), and that in NIC's online database it scores 50% (from only a dozen games, but with White seeming to have an overall rating advantage).
  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #13 - 01/25/13 at 17:48:05
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kylemeister wrote on 01/25/13 at 16:16:53:
I don't know why people cite their internet blitz games as evidence of the value of an opening line. 


Because if the opening truly had serious issues, I'd at best be breaking even in my games with it. The fact that of any variation I play, I have the must success with that line over any other really does count for something. Is that really so hard to believe?



  
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Re: Revival of 1 b3
Reply #12 - 01/25/13 at 16:48:18
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The structure is the same save for the d-pawn, which can stay on -d2, or advance to -d3 or -d4 depending on the situation. The pawn on -b3 usually advances to -b4 in conjunction with pawns on -c4 and -a4.
  
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