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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life (Read 64178 times)
kylemeister
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #37 - 11/20/13 at 22:10:53
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I've had the impression (e.g. from an article in NIC) that 4...Nxe4 is a serious try and that perhaps White has nothing better than to transpose to a ...d5 main line by giving back the piece.  (Incidentally I think the first time I saw anything about 4...Nxe4 was in Informator in the '90s.)
  
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gwnn
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #36 - 11/20/13 at 21:44:38
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He also gives a few lines with the reversed Haloween for a laugh, BTW. The author is a funny guy. Also 1 e4 e5 2 f4 c6?! Smiley (along with its refutation)
  
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Benoniac
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #35 - 11/20/13 at 20:19:56
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kylemeister wrote on 11/20/13 at 19:33:00:
I'd have to say it would be surprising if such an old and natural main line were not still "holding up pretty well" ...



Well, I obviously dont know everything you do, Kylemeister.

I was just trying to help a fellow member get going  Smiley

Ben
  

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kylemeister
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #34 - 11/20/13 at 19:33:00
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I'd have to say it would be surprising if such an old and natural main line were not still "holding up pretty well" ...
  
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Benoniac
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #33 - 11/20/13 at 19:07:11
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Not to worry!
He gives: 4.g3-Bc5 5.Bg2-d6 6.d3-a6!, and so on. I checked a little bit, and it seems to hold up pretty well.

By the way; all the markings I have given in my posts are  Choen`s.

Good luck with you corr game Smiley It seems you have equalized already...

Ben
  

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Pale Horse, Pale Rider
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #32 - 11/20/13 at 17:13:11
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Benoniac wrote on 11/07/13 at 22:25:03:
[quote author=717E6D6D706B1F0 link=1378671786/19#19 date=1383773665]
Vienna:
3.f4-d5 4.fxe5-Nxe4 5.Sf3-Bc5!? 6.d4-Bb4 7.Bd2-Bg4!

Glek: 2.Nc3-Nf6 3.g3-c6!?

Spanish four knights:
Rubinsteins 4...Nd4

Scotsh four knigths:
4.d4-Bb4!?


With my usual impatience I started playing two correspondence games without even receiving the book yet. From your description I figured that the author proposes

1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nc3 Nc6

which is the four knights. Now my opponent played 4. g3 which should be a four knight's Glek or so. In your summary you only mentioned 3. g3. Now i wonder if the move order from my game is covered (obviously i cannot transpose). I don't want help for my game but i would like to know if this is covered so I'd wait for the book or not (then i would go into some research now). Thanks for your kind help!
  
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lnn2
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #31 - 11/10/13 at 19:01:39
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I like FM Cohen's view on Petroff in his new book: a combination of some sort of Sicilian and the Petroff is the most lethal and dangerous combination. 

Gelfand is a role model for this repertoire.

Having said that I think the Berlin Ruy is a good alternative as well - less forcing than Petroff so probably easier to maintain long term which is why Kramnik seems to have preferred Berlin lately. There are a number of players who combine both Najdorf and Berlin e.g. Topalov.

Pingudon wrote on 09/08/13 at 20:23:06:
I have played a lot of French and Caro, but I got tired of lack of space. I watt to change to 1... e5 but do not want to study so much theory. Is the Petrov as good as the Caro or French? Kramnik, Anand, Karpov and a lot more had played the Petrov but they don't anymore. Is ok the Petrov to be played against strong players and to be played for the rest of your chess life?

  
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Pale Horse, Pale Rider
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #30 - 11/09/13 at 10:51:42
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Fllg wrote on 11/09/13 at 08:59:02:
It´s available, see e.g. schachversand.de.


Oh, my bad Embarrassed. I searched there yesterday but appearently schachversand hasn't added the other to the authors data base. Searching directly for the book title works. Thanks. Don't feel like waiting until december Sad
  
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Fllg
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #29 - 11/09/13 at 08:59:02
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It´s available, see e.g. schachversand.de.
  
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Pale Horse, Pale Rider
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #28 - 11/09/13 at 00:17:22
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Fllg wrote on 11/08/13 at 21:18:03:
It feels somewhat odd to me because Black ends up playing an main line with a lot of nuances of an opening which is normally reached after 1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6. And this is a book about the Petrov, isn´t it? Wink


I kind of agree here. It seems to play directly into what white wants to achieve playing the Bishop's game - avoiding the Petrov that ist.
I'm confused, is the book already available? Amazon.de and .com indicate that it's due in december?!
  
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Fllg
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #27 - 11/08/13 at 21:18:03
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It feels somewhat odd to me because Black ends up playing an main line with a lot of nuances of an opening which is normally reached after 1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6. And this is a book about the Petrov, isn´t it? Wink

After 1 e4 e5 2 Bc4 Nf6 3 d3 both 3...c6 intending d5 and 3...Bc5 postponing the development of the queen´s knight are decent independent options. The latter is especially interesting if White continues with f2-f4, since then Black has the good idea to strike back in the centre with ...c6 & ...d5.

That´s also a more interesting choice against the Vienna after 1 e4 e5 2 Nc3 Nf6 3 Bc4 Bc5 instead of 3...Nxe4, when White has the dull option 4 Qh5 Nd6 5 Qxh5+ Qe7 6 Qxe7+. Not that Black has a reason to complain here.
  
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Benoniac
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #26 - 11/08/13 at 18:38:28
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Hmm. I dont get why this is slightly odd combined with the Petroff. But then again, I know nothing about this opening. To  to me it seems that after: 1.e4-e5 2.Bc4-Nf6 3.d3 black has nothing better than : 3....Nc6 and after 4.Nf3 here we are; 4...Be7 or 4...Bc5. The latter seems the most active.

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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #25 - 11/08/13 at 17:01:37
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Benoniac wrote on 11/08/13 at 10:30:41:
Cohen favour the line: 4...Bc5! with a standard set-up involving: h6, a6, Ba7 and Nh5. 
Maybe not so deep analysis for a ML, but you will get the gist of it  Smiley 

Ben


While theoretically perfectly sensible this is slightly odd for a repertoire based around the Petrov and certainly a lot of those playing 2.Bc4 will be happy with this. I certainly will Smiley

I´m also not in favour with some of his other choices since White can force Black to play very dull or very sharp lines sometimes.

Of course that may be the nature of the Petrov as well.

But I´m still interested in the book as long as the coverage of the main subject is decent.


  
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Benoniac
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #24 - 11/08/13 at 10:30:41
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Cohen favour the line: 4...Bc5! with a standard set-up involving: h6, a6, Ba7 and Nh5. 
Maybe not so deep analysis for a ML, but you will get the gist of it  Smiley 

Ben
  

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Pale Horse, Pale Rider
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Re: C42-C43 The Petrov for the rest of your chess life
Reply #23 - 11/07/13 at 23:00:23
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Benoniac wrote on 11/07/13 at 22:25:03:
King`s Gambit:
declined with 2...Bc5

Vienna:
3.f4-d5 4.fxe5-Nxe4 5.Sf3-Bc5!? 6.d4-Bb4 7.Bd2-Bg4!

Glek: 2.Nc3-Nf6 3.g3-c6!?

Spanish four knights:
Rubinsteins 4...Nd4

Scotsh four knigths:
4.d4-Bb4!?

And :

2.Nc3-Nf6 3.Bc4-Nxe4!

2.Bc4-Nf6 3.d3-Nc6 4.Nc3-Na5

Overall a lot of sharp stuff it seems. Hope this helps a bit.

Ben


Thank you very much for the summary. I just checked these lines in a database and they all seems reasonable. What makes me wonder is what happens after:

1. e4 e5
2. Bc4 Nf6
3. d3 Nc6
and now not 4. Nc3 but 4. Nf3

* * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * *
*

Checking the database black has played 4...Bc5 or 4...Be7 here in the vast majority of games. The first brings us back to Giuoco Pianissimo, the latter to the two knight's defence. Is 4. Nf3 adressed in the book. I would guess so because it brings us back to what is a major line in theory, isn't it?!
  
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