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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8 (Read 21102 times)
MartinC
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #22 - 10/25/18 at 11:20:14
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It definitely doesn't look especially fun, but maybe fun is too risky in general these days Smiley
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #21 - 10/25/18 at 10:11:32
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FightingDragon wrote on 10/24/18 at 10:25:55:
Why not 13. ... Nf4: 14.Nd8: Bd8: 15.g3 Ng6 (instead of Tregubov's 13. ... bc6:)?
This looks more or less equal to me.


I see that most players prefer 13...Nxf4 here, and Romain played it himself a few days ago. Still, I think White must be a bit better here, he has more space and Black has the usual problems activating his light-squared bishop.
John Watson has been looking at the Armenian Variation a lot recently (particularly with 7...Kf8), but hasn't paid much attention to 11...h5 yet.
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #20 - 10/24/18 at 10:25:55
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Why not 13. ... Nf4: 14.Nd8: Bd8: 15.g3 Ng6 (instead of Tregubov's 13. ... bc6:)?
This looks more or less equal to me.
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #19 - 10/24/18 at 07:44:04
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Michael Ayton wrote on 05/05/18 at 07:25:13:
Quote:
The [line] that’s concerned me most so far is 6 b4 cd 7 Qg4 Kf8 8 Nb5 Bb6 9 Nf3 Nc6 10 Bb2 Nge7 11 Nbd4, when both 11 …Ng6 12 Nc6 bc 13 Bd3 a5 14 0-0 and 11 …h5 12 Qf4 Ng6 13 Nc6 bc 14 Qg3 look a little better for White to me.

It's coming to something when you quote yourself! But looking again at the 11 ...h5 line here I think I may have been too negative. I'd thought something like 14 Qg3 a5 15 Bd3 Ba6 16 0-0 Bd3 17 cd c5 18 bc was good for White, but maybe Black is OK ...

Yesterday the Russian grandmaster Pavel Tregubov tried 15...Ne7 but that is definitely no improvement. Looking at the time-consumption it seems that black was out book after 14.Qg3. Few grandmasters read this forum.

However more than likely the supergrandmaster Arkadij Naiditsch also found and liked 14.Qg3 at home. Amateurs or supergrandmasters we practically find all the same moves as we use the same tools. Still there is an enormous gap as we amateurs maybe check a couple of those positions while the supergrandmasters have done it for 1000x more positions.
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #18 - 05/05/18 at 10:04:14
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I vaguely thought we were trying to make it 'solid' Wink

9 .. Bc7 looks good fun a priori - e5 is gone so a really nice centre.
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #17 - 05/05/18 at 07:25:13
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Quote:
The [line] that’s concerned me most so far is 6 b4 cd 7 Qg4 Kf8 8 Nb5 Bb6 9 Nf3 Nc6 10 Bb2 Nge7 11 Nbd4, when both 11 …Ng6 12 Nc6 bc 13 Bd3 a5 14 0-0 and 11 …h5 12 Qf4 Ng6 13 Nc6 bc 14 Qg3 look a little better for White to me.

It's coming to something when you quote yourself! But looking again at the 11 ...h5 line here I think I may have been too negative. I'd thought something like 14 Qg3 a5 15 Bd3 Ba6 16 0-0 Bd3 17 cd c5 18 bc was good for White, but maybe Black is OK ...
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #16 - 05/04/18 at 19:34:41
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Quote:
Can't you just go 6.. Kf8 there?

I've no idea! But I don't see any strong players doing it.

Quote:
9.. Bc7 maybe, but its a very different kind of game 6 b4 cd 7 Qg4 Kf8 etc.

If so that's surely no detraction. The Armenian's a complex system; the 7 Nb5 Bc7 lines are different again.
  
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MartinC
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #15 - 05/04/18 at 19:21:13
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Can't you just go 6.. Kf8 there?

9.. Bc7 maybe, but its a very different kind of game 6 b4 cd 7 Qg4 Kf8 etc.
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #14 - 05/04/18 at 07:39:24
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Quote:
Solid? No, never Smiley

I got quite interested in this, and it does look reasonably solid to me. What’s White’s best line? The one that’s concerned me most so far is 6 b4 cd 7 Qg4 Kf8 8 Nb5 Bb6 9 Nf3 Nc6 10 Bb2 Nge7 11 Nbd4, when both 11 …Ng6 12 Nc6 bc 13 Bd3 a5 14 0-0 and 11 …h5 12 Qf4 Ng6 13 Nc6 bc 14 Qg3 look a little better for White to me. Maybe the way to go is 11 …Ng6 12 Nc6 Nf4 13 Nd8 Bd8, when Black’s position looks very hard to crack? – this gets the best engine scores (for what that’s worth), and almost all the games I’ve seen reaching this position end in draws.

I presume that after 6 Qg4 Ne7 7 Qg7 Rg8 8 Qh7 cd 9 b4, Black should play 9 …Bc7, since 9 …dc?! 10 ba will transpose to the 6 b4 cd 7 Qg4 Ne7?! 8 ba dc 9 Qg7 Rg8 10 Qh7 Nbc6 11 Nf3! line now considered bad for Black.
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #13 - 04/29/18 at 21:35:51
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Solid? No, never Smiley

Popular I dunno unless they're making this Kf8 stuff work well. It got driven to near extinction when the Winaver PPawn style lines (seemingly?) got semi refuted a while back.
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #12 - 04/27/18 at 18:47:44
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Is 5...Aa5 becoming a solid, popular alternative to going down the 7. Dg4 road, similar to 6...Da5 ¿
  
https://elajedrezdelproletariado.blogspot.com/
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #11 - 04/27/18 at 08:35:49
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This line is very quickly gaining popularity. I published an extensive analysis about it in my latest article. I also made some advertisement for this site in the same article which probably can't harm either.  Grin
http://chess-brabo.blogspot.com/2018/04/fashion-part-2.html
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #10 - 10/20/15 at 15:20:53
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Smyslov_Fan wrote on 10/20/15 at 12:34:18:
I haven't looked. Has 7...Kf8 been played much since 2013?


Checked chessbase and it looks like it's been played about 20 times during 2014-15, which is twice as many times as during 2012-13
  
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #9 - 10/20/15 at 12:34:18
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I haven't looked. Has 7...Kf8 been played much since 2013?
  
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MartinC
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Re: C18: Armenian variation5..Ba5 6.b4 cxd4 7. Qg4 Kf8
Reply #8 - 10/20/15 at 09:37:12
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10 Bf4 in the game in the viewer above I imagine Smiley

Bit of a public place to store theory notes I'd have thought!
  
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