If Black doesn't want to play a Kings Indian with .. e5, you really cannot stop him. The Gruenfeld isn't possible after 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 and some players have used the order 1. c4 Nf6 2. Nc3 g6 3. e4 Bg7 4. d4 to even further discourage it. 

Whilst the Petrosian system, both in the traditional form and the modern alternatives attempts to clamp down on the f5 break, it's going to happen eventually, even if played under favourable circumstances for White. Any player who doesn't feel able to play that type of position will eventually have to abandon 1. d4 2. c4 typical positions as it's a position that many variations eventually lead to.

Thank you all for your answers.

Okay so I can eliminate the Gligoric System 7.Be3 for sure.

What's worrying me about the Petrosian System 7.d5 and the Exchange Variation 7.dxe5 dxe5 8.Qxd8 Rxd8 is that Black has so many ways to avoid them completely:

After 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nf3 Bg7 4. Nc3 Black can try 4...d5 or 4...c5 or 4...O-O 5. e4 c6 6. Be2 d5 or 4...O-O 5. e4 c5

And most importantly, after 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nf3 Bg7 4. Nc3 O-O 5. e4 d6 6. Be2, Black doesn't have to play 6...e5, he has so many possibilites to deviate: 6...c5, 6...Nbd7, 6...Na6, 6...Nc6, 6...c6, 6...Bg4

But on the other hand Black has no way to avoid the Fianchetto Variation 3.Nf3 Bg7 4.g3

And there's something I find bad about the Petrosian System 7.d5 : it doesn't look to be that much solid/quiet/positional... It does possess the name of the most solid/quiet/positional/drawish player of all time, but it seems to still look like the Mar Del Plata (which everyone said is extremely sharp and tactical) except that the Black queenside Knight has a different journey.
I've seen some games with live commentary on Youtube which featured the Petrosian Sytem of the KID, and Black got very big and scary Kingside attacks against the poor White King who got slaughtered in most of them...

The only downside of the Fianchetto Variation of the KID is that in my entire opening repertoire I never use any fianchetto (so I was thinking that since I don't play any fianchetto I will get very familiarized/accustomed to positions without any fianchetto, and should therefore not aim for anything with a fianchetto).

For white, one tip in the main lines of the Mar del Plata is that the bishops are better defenders of the kingside than are the knights.  Send the knights off to raid the queenside and keep the bishops ready to cover the holes on the kingside.

Get Black's white-square bishop off the board and live longer.

Playing the main lines as White with 9. Ne1 is seriously fun chess and should not be missed.

I did wonder about the Fianchetto. Others have suggested that it's too subtle for the likes of me, but I gather that Wojo's Weapons explains it quite well. 

I noticed that in this thread BPaulsen suggested the Gligoric: http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1226348173/135. Apparently it's good for White if Black just aims for the standard kingside attack, which at my level many people will. In fact, at my level the most effective lines are probably those that offer the best chances if neither player knows much theory!

Straggler wrote on 06/25/14 at 12:28:45:

There are a couple of options: 5.Bd3, 6.Nge2 (Seirawan) or 5.Nf3, 6.h3. I tried both, but they didn't really suit me.  So I chose 5.h3, 6.Bg5 which can be played against the Benoni as well and scores excellently in practice. It demands preparation of course. In another corr. game of mine, which actually began via the KID, I played 10.Nge2 iso 10.Nf3 (see previous page) as I was too lazy to find out which one was best. After 10.Nge2 I barely scraped a draw.

Straggler wrote on 06/25/14 at 12:28:45:

Recently I met someone whom I suspected to play the Lion and eventually the Philidor. So I followed Schandorff's recommendation 1.d4 d6 2.c4 Nf6 3.Nc3 e5 4.d5 Nbd7 5.e4 Nc5 6.f3. Black can't transpose well to the KID anymore after 4.d5. While I have my doubts - Schandorff is quite optimistic imo - I managed to win a nice game; Black had 100 ELO points more.
I prefer my games sharp with me having the initiative. If you're risk averse you better turn to 1.e4 imo.

OrangeCounty wrote on 06/25/14 at 00:36:32:


If the original poster allows the Kings Indian, at some point in the game he's going to have to get his hands dirty with some tactical calculation. It's unpleasant as in the Mal del Plata to know that you get mated if you get it wrong. The Gligoric, Petrosian and Finachetto variations do at least have the advantage, if you can call it such, that it won't be until later in the game that Black will come gunning for you down the f and g files. The h3 systems might be worth considering. It's not a quiet game, but when the threat of .. f5 has been met by g4 and you can still go long with the King, it's Black, not White threatened with disaster on the g file.

kylemeister wrote on 06/24/14 at 16:21:04:


I'd imagine boredom would set in fairly rapidly, but studying all the little tactics that can arise in the few moves after the central exchanges could be a practical weapon. It's not really strategic in the sense of any grand design, just trying to improve  White's position. 

Whether that's actually a "solid/positional/quiet variation" as requested by the original poster is another matter as it can be hard work trying to find all the nuances in such positions. In main lines as White you can just trundle forward with pawns and only really need to calculate accurately on the final breakthrough, if at all.

OrangeCounty wrote on 06/24/14 at 03:04:37:


It's a characteristic of many Kings Indian positions that White will get and maintain an edge from the opening. The reason why it remains popular for Black at lower levels of skill is that it offers a lot of scope for White to lose control in the critical period between moves 20 and 40. 

As far as the Exchange variation is concerned, that's certainly slow, but experienced Kings Indian defenders will have methods of improving their position. One of them is that White having played e4 and c4 leaves the d4 square vulnerable whilst Black isn't so vulnerable on d5 by virtue of being able to play c6. So there are obvious plans of Bc8-g4xf3 and Nb8-d7-f8-e6-d4. I'm not sure of White's obvious plan for playing the ending.