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Normal Topic Interesting idea in the Panno (Read 4893 times)
ErictheRed
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Re: Interesting idea in the Panno
Reply #5 - 07/10/14 at 09:28:20
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yolocounty wrote on 07/10/14 at 02:16:17:
Eric:

I agree 9...Re8 was a mistake.  The thought process went like this: I want to play ...e5 and meet d4-d5 with Nc6-d4, but with the knight on e2 that is no go.  After 9.a4 White's hardly going to play on the kingside, so she'll play 10. Nc1 and I reply 10...e5 11 d5 Nd4.  9...Re8 was supposed to be a classy waiting move since after an eventual [something]xd4, ...exd4, my rook would be on the open file.

I'm not sure, in retrospect, why I thought any of that would actually happen.  But I had rejected the (correct) 9...Nd7 and 9...a5, so I was going to play something silly.


I see; well live and learn I guess.  ...Re8 just doesn't often do much in the Panno, though admittedly it's probably fine after White plays a tame move like 9.a4?! (when there shouldn't be any queenside castling). 

As Kylemeister points out the immediate 9...e5 is certainly playable, though that closed, "full Benoni" position is in some ways an old-fashioned way of playing the King's Indian (though probably justified here).  I'd probably go 9...a5 myself.
  
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yolocounty
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Re: Interesting idea in the Panno
Reply #4 - 07/10/14 at 02:16:17
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Eric:

I agree 9...Re8 was a mistake.  The thought process went like this: I want to play ...e5 and meet d4-d5 with Nc6-d4, but with the knight on e2 that is no go.  After 9.a4 White's hardly going to play on the kingside, so she'll play 10. Nc1 and I reply 10...e5 11 d5 Nd4.  9...Re8 was supposed to be a classy waiting move since after an eventual [something]xd4, ...exd4, my rook would be on the open file.

I'm not sure, in retrospect, why I thought any of that would actually happen.  But I had rejected the (correct) 9...Nd7 and 9...a5, so I was going to play something silly.
  
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ErictheRed
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Re: Interesting idea in the Panno
Reply #3 - 07/08/14 at 21:25:40
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What's the point of 9...Re8?  It's almost always wrong in the Panno, as Black has much better things to use a tempo on.  Often Black thinks that he's protecting his king by enabling a future Be3-h6 to be met with ...Bg7-h8, but it's a critical tempo and letting a bishop sit on h6 isn't exactly safe for Black, anyway.  Also the whole queenside castling, h-file attack is basically off the table after 9.a4?.
  
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TonyRo
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Re: Interesting idea in the Panno
Reply #2 - 07/08/14 at 20:31:46
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I would have thought for about 15 seconds before playing 9..a5, for what it's worth.
  
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kylemeister
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Re: Interesting idea in the Panno
Reply #1 - 07/08/14 at 19:13:21
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Well, John Watson's Panno book of about 32 years ago had 9...e5 10. d5 Na5 11. Nc1 c5 (with several variations and game citations, basically leading to equality) as its main line, and had a little about 9...a5, which had been recommended by Boleslavsky and Westerinen.
  
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yolocounty
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Interesting idea in the Panno
07/08/14 at 18:49:07
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I played a game this weekend that went 1 d4 Nf6 2 c4 g6 3 Nc3 Bg7 4 e4 d6 5 f3 0-0 6 Be3 Nc6 7 Qd2 a6 8 Nge2 Rb8 . . .

and now 9 a4.

What on earth was this move?  After some thought, I rejected the (probably correct) 9 ... Nd7 and went for 9 ... Re8 and 10 ... e5.  There are a couple of database games but this isn't even mentioned in Vigorito's book(s) which seems reasonable given that it has obvious drawbacks.

Interesting idea, though.  The immediate 9 ... e5 10 d5! Na5 11 Nc1! covers everything with b4 coming.  And 9 ... Na5 10 Nc1 is the same, since ...c7-c5 is still a pawn sacrifice.

I think 9 ...Nd7 10 Nc1 e5 makes a lot of sense, to be able to play ...Nd4, and anything but 10 Nc1 allows 10 ...Na5 and 11...c5 with "normal" counterplay.

Any thoughts?
  
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