Latest Updates:
Normal Topic Velimirovic question (Read 4134 times)
Confused_by_Theory
Senior Member
****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 427
Location: Europe
Joined: 05/13/15
Gender: Male
Re: Velimirovic question
Reply #8 - 07/20/15 at 19:11:54
Post Tools
Hello.

cramie10 wrote on 07/08/15 at 23:32:16:
This would seem academic. However,  the reason that I was looking at this line to begin with was to investigate the possibility of a Novelty after 21...f5 (the theory move) to see if White can forcibly gain an edge there. If so, then 21...f5 is under a cloud and Black players may be forced to turn to 21...h5.

Instead of 22. Nf6 after ...f5, which is the main line and the only played move according to mega database, perhaps White can play 22. exf5!?. Never played, again. My computer seems to think it's dead equal, and has most line petering off into perpetuals before long.

Any thoughts?

Well. 22.Nf6 looks promising. It just seems otb players have been fond of taking out perpetuals as white. Perhaps needlessly as the lines does not look that complicated.



Have a nice day.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
cramie10
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 16
Location: Didcot
Joined: 01/26/14
Gender: Male
Re: Velimirovic question
Reply #7 - 07/08/15 at 23:32:16
Post Tools
I'd actually just come back to post exactly the same conclusion as the two previous posters. Many thanks for your contributions, ArKheiN and Confused_by_Theory.

It would seem, then, that 21...h5!? is actually playable for back, with the only way to a plausible white advantage so far looking to be 26. Qe2!

This would seem academic. However,  the reason that I was looking at this line to begin with was to investigate the possibility of a Novelty after 21...f5 (the theory move) to see if White can forcibly gain an edge there. If so, then 21...f5 is under a cloud and Black players may be forced to turn to 21...h5.

Instead of 22. Nf6 after ...f5, which is the main line and the only played move according to mega database, perhaps White can play 22. exf5!?. Never played, again. My computer seems to think it's dead equal, and has most line petering off into perpetuals before long.

Any thoughts?
  

Doing things wrong since '94
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Confused_by_Theory
Senior Member
****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 427
Location: Europe
Joined: 05/13/15
Gender: Male
Re: Velimirovic question
Reply #6 - 07/08/15 at 20:56:27
Post Tools
Hello.

ArKheiN wrote on 07/08/15 at 20:09:30:
According to my engine, there is nothing decisive after 25.Rxh6 Kg7 but White can avoid a forced draw with 26.Qe2! with a very slightly preference for White.

Precisely. I furthered this line a bit if anyone is interested.

In general after 26.Qe2 it seems despite an extra piece black is quite vulnerable to f2-f4; also his pieces are sort of hard to get going despite optically looking reasonably placed.

Have a nice day.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ArKheiN
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing.com!

Posts: 715
Location: Belgium
Joined: 03/30/05
Re: Velimirovic question
Reply #5 - 07/08/15 at 20:09:30
Post Tools
According to my engine, there is nothing decisive after 25.Rxh6 Kg7 but White can avoid a forced draw with 26.Qe2! with a very slightly preference for White.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
cramie10
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 16
Location: Didcot
Joined: 01/26/14
Gender: Male
Re: Velimirovic question
Reply #4 - 07/08/15 at 02:05:16
Post Tools
I've just put that through my computer, and it agrees. I don't have a weak engine, either. How bizarre that it didn't spot that. Errors with the hashtable or something? Whatever. Thank you!
  

Doing things wrong since '94
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
LeeRoth
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing.com!

Posts: 1382
Joined: 10/22/05
Re: Velimirovic question
Reply #3 - 07/07/15 at 19:05:21
Post Tools
Ok, but after 21..h5 22.Nf6 Bg7 23.Qg4 Ne5 24.Rxh5+ Bh6 25.Rxh6 Kg7 is there a win for White?  Just looking at it in my head, I'm not seeing how White avoids the perpetual down the c-file, but very possible that I may be missing something.   Wink

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kylemeister
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 4533
Location: USA
Joined: 10/24/05
Re: Velimirovic question
Reply #2 - 07/07/15 at 17:36:45
Post Tools
I notice that Mikhail Golubev's Sozin book (2001) gave "21...h5? 22. Nf6."
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Confused_by_Theory
Senior Member
****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 427
Location: Europe
Joined: 05/13/15
Gender: Male
Re: Velimirovic question
Reply #1 - 07/07/15 at 17:34:49
Post Tools
Hello.


The computer indicates 22.Nf6 followed by Qg4 as the way to go for white.

Have a nice day.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
cramie10
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 16
Location: Didcot
Joined: 01/26/14
Gender: Male
Velimirovic question
07/07/15 at 16:08:31
Post Tools
Hi everyone. I've got a question on a position from the Velimirovic attack:

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 Nc6 6. Bc4 e6 7. Be3 Be7 8. Qe2 O-O 9. O-O-O a6 10. Bb3 Qc7 11. Rhg1 Nd7 12. g4 Nc5 13. Nf5 b5 14. Bd5 Bb7 15. g5 Rfc8 16. Rg3 Bf8 17. Qh5 g6 18. Nh6+ Kh8 19. Qh4 b4

Now here, Batsford's Modern Chess openings gives:

20. Rh3 bxc3 21. Ng4

as equal, giving only 21... f5?? As Black's next move. And 21... f5 is the only move that has ever been played there, according to my databse. However, it would seem like 21... h5! Just leaves white a piece down. This has never been played, however. Anyone know why? Is there some fantastic resource for White? If 21... h5 does work, then 20. Rh3, as given in Batsford's, just doesn't work.

Many thanks!

  

Doing things wrong since '94
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo