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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Why isn't the QGA more popular? (Read 20561 times)
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #27 - 12/05/19 at 13:45:04
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I guess the QGA is not more popular because people don't like to play with less space, or just don't like to grind long technichal wins after defending for many moves. People even ask me why I play it. Well, usually white knows little theory and don't play the most critical lines, allowing black to be confortable (or they play 3.Nc3 a6 4.a4, and black is already slightly better).

Regarding Dlugy's quote, I certainly don't think all lines are +=, for instance 7.a4 is not hard to equalize against. But 7.Bb3 and 3.e4 e5 8.Bb5 (as in Aronian x Shirov, Elista 2006) are huge challenges for black to equalize.
  

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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #26 - 05/04/18 at 06:15:07
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I doubt I've ever seen the way Caruana played against Shankland before (7. a4 is of course a major line from way back; I recall it being played by Botvinnik, Gligoric and Geller, whilst Larsen doubted its merit), but Ju-Tan looked to me like an old pattern.  (Some time ago 9. Qe2+ was given as leading to an edge for White.)
  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #25 - 05/03/18 at 22:43:18
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Resurrecting the old thread 'cos in answer to the OP's query, just noticed that the World No 2 has been playing the QGA as Black (and of course the Petroff as Black against 1 e4 with very good results).
Then yesterday (AEST), the Women World Champion essayed the QGA in Game 1 in the 2018 Women World Champs in Shanghai (I guess not many people knew the Champs was on!!!).
What do ChessPubbers think? Any "newish/modish" way these players are playing the QGA?

Here is Fabiano Caruana's Rd 5 game from just concluded US Champs vs the new US Champ:



  

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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #24 - 08/04/17 at 06:02:54
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Keano wrote on 08/03/17 at 13:00:52:
3.e4 b5!? is very interesting.


it generally leads to 3...Nf6 positions with all the queenside pawns swapped off
  

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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #23 - 08/03/17 at 13:00:52
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3.e4 b5!? is very interesting.
  
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an ordinary chessplayer
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #22 - 08/02/17 at 20:47:02
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"What's the expert opinion?" -- It does not quite equalize.

Back in the day when Max Dlugy was still an active player, I was invited to a dinner where he was present. I will quote what he said, but only from memory so of course this is not 100% accurate.
Quote:
I am always happy when someone plays the Queen's Gambit Accepted against me. All the lines are slightly better for white, so I can just play whatever line I like at the moment.
At that time Dlugy specialized in the QGA, so he knows a thing or two about it.

As for my non-expert opinion -- I have played it, not too many times, with great results overall. I can recommend it to certain players but not to everyone. The reason I did not play it more was because I was getting even better results with the Slav.
  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #21 - 07/28/17 at 20:36:20
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sim wrote on 07/28/17 at 10:05:37:
Interesting thread. The question why the QGA isn't more popular was answered. The question why the QGA after 1.Nf3 isn't more popular was also answered.
But I'm still interested in the question why the QGA isn't more popular after 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3.
I've seen many people asking what to pair their Nimzo or Benkö with after white doesn't play 2.c4 and 3.Nc3. Shouldn't the QGA be mentioned? (I'm probably overlooking something.)


I cant imagine why people would want to pair the Benko with the QGA?

It would probably require learning additional lines against D pawn specials, and Benko players I would think would prefer switching into a KI/Pirc set up or maybe even a kasparov gambit if white follows up with 3.c4?
  

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sim
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #20 - 07/28/17 at 10:05:37
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Interesting thread. The question why the QGA isn't more popular was answered. The question why the QGA after 1.Nf3 isn't more popular was also answered.
But I'm still interested in the question why the QGA isn't more popular after 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3.
I've seen many people asking what to pair their Nimzo or Benkö with after white doesn't play 2.c4 and 3.Nc3. Shouldn't the QGA be mentioned? (I'm probably overlooking something.)

Edit: for example, I overlooked that it could be a solution for a Benkö-player, but won't help a Nimzo-player against an uncooperative white player.
« Last Edit: 07/28/17 at 19:15:06 by sim »  
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ErictheRed
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #19 - 07/14/17 at 00:03:29
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Of course the QGA is a fantastic opening and should probably be more popular at lower levels.  On the other hand, I've always felt that Black is taking more risks in many lines, and from a practical point of view, White can often just play normal moves and be pretty successful by playing with a general understanding of isolated pawn positions, for instance.  There isn't a huge reward in store for Black in studying up on the Queen's Gambit Accepted, not to the extent that Black can be rewarded in the King's Indian or Nimzo-Indian.  That's probably why it isn't more popular, but if it suits you, all the better to specialize in a rare opening!
  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #18 - 07/13/17 at 23:39:51
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The QGA is quite concrete at times so many players shy away from it and try to pick more closed openings. I also don't think you can really use it vs flank openings like you can the other options. It's akin to the Nimzo in the sense that White has to let you and people often want universal openings. That's why stuff like the KID, London, KIA and Semi-Slav always has a large following. I might be wrong though. These were my reasons for not playing it.

In terms of soundness, it's extremely reliable and will never be refuted. Even Avrukh's second book after nearly a decade can't find an edge in it. The first 2008 book had e3 lines and his updated version switched to e4 because those didn't seem to offer much of anything. However, even the e4 lines often lead to equality.

For instance, take this line from the first 20 pages of Avrukh's book:

1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 dxc4 4.e4 b5 5.a4 c6 6.axb5 cxb5 7.b3 Nf6 8.bxc4 Nxe4 9.c5 Bxc5 10.Bxb5+ Bd7 11.Bxd7+ Qxd7 12.dxc5 Qxd1+ 13.Kxd1 Nxf2+ 14.Ke2 Nxh1 15.Bf4 O-O 16.Bd6 Rc8 17.Nc3 Nd7 18.Na4 Nf6 19.Nd2 Ne8 20.Bf4 Nc7

He suggests that White may have better long term prospects due to the passed pawn but I highly doubt it. It's nearly impossible for it to become a true threat and I'd say Black is completely equal.

This is in the first 20 pages and already Black has an equalizing line despite Avrukh picking what he thinks are the toughest variations.

  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #17 - 12/30/16 at 09:42:48
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After buying Delchev book and having started to play regularly the QGA both in online blitz and OTB games I am even more convinced now that the QGA is highly underrated. My results so far have been better than with any other defense I used to play against 1.d4. It is now my main answer to 1.d4.

  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #16 - 11/12/16 at 10:44:31
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It's not popular because people don't want to play it Grin , There are tons of strong openings like King's Indian, Grunfeld etc which gives better alternatives for the counter player
  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #15 - 09/27/16 at 20:11:41
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Quote:
Hi,

No, 5. Nbd2 after 4... Bb4 is not the most challenging option for sure. Black can go 5... c3 and is much better, just check with the engine.

I think you might be mixing up the line with 4... exd4 5. Bxc4 and then Bb4 where 6. Nbd2 is a good move.
                   


My apologies I just looked at the pgn and didn't open the game on a chessboard. You are right , after 4...Bb4 5.Nbd2 is a bad mistake however, also in this case, Bd2 is not the most challenging line for White.

After 4...Bb4  theory gives 5.Nc3 as the most challenging. I see that you propose 6...Nd7 which is mentioned only very briefly in the source I have. On what have you based your analysis of 6...Nd7? Is it 100% indipendent analysis.

How does the QGA fare in correspondence chess? I do not have any correspondence chess source. Can you share some of yours  (uncommented games of course)?
Regards.
  
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NegiRefutes
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #14 - 09/27/16 at 14:53:15
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Hi,

No, 5. Nbd2 after 4... Bb4 is not the most challenging option for sure. Black can go 5... c3 and is much better, just check with the engine.

I think you might be mixing up the line with 4... exd4 5. Bxc4 and then Bb4 where 6. Nbd2 is a good move.
  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #13 - 09/27/16 at 07:52:04
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Scarblac wrote on 09/26/16 at 19:05:35:
When GM David Smerdon reviewed "Understanding the Queen's Gambit Accepted" on his blog last year ( ), he stated "The QGA feels like it’s been around forever, but of late I’ve noticed more and more top GMs adding it to their repertoires, so much so that I’ve even added it to mine."

Is it that unpopular?


The QGA IS unpopular. Just goes trough the games of the latest olympiad and compare how many QGA have been played agains all the other major openings. I guess that only the Tarrasch is played less than the QGA.

  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #12 - 09/27/16 at 07:50:08
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Hi Negi,
I think that you overlooked the most challeging option in the 4...Bb4+ variation which is Nbd2. I have looked at the existing theory and I haven't liked it at all.
Instead 4...exd4 5...Nc6 6...Be6 can be caotic but gives counterplay to Black if White plays 7. Bxe6. 7.Bb5 allows White to pressurize by sacryficing temporarly a pawn but the resulting endgame seems holdable.
  
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NegiRefutes
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #11 - 09/26/16 at 20:47:26
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Any improvements on the lines I posted (mainly the 4... Bb4 lines) would be good because I'm thinking about playing the QGA in the future.
  
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NegiRefutes
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #10 - 09/26/16 at 20:46:06
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I think 3. e4 e5 is best for Black.

Here is some analysis, it is not complete as I haven't had the time to analyse everything.

@Scarblac
The QGA is pretty unpopular compared to most of the opening being played today at the top level.

  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #9 - 09/26/16 at 19:05:35
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When GM David Smerdon reviewed "Understanding the Queen's Gambit Accepted" on his blog last year ( http://www.davidsmerdon.com/?p=1769 ), he stated "The QGA feels like it’s been around forever, but of late I’ve noticed more and more top GMs adding it to their repertoires, so much so that I’ve even added it to mine."

Is it that unpopular?
  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #8 - 09/26/16 at 16:11:03
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I have the impression that the main reason why the QGA is not used more at higher level are:

- The dxc5 endgame
- The forcing nature of most  of the other lines in which a well prepared White player can enter a very plain position.

My feeling is that even a traditional Declined Queen's gambit could provide better winning chances because even in draw positions the non-forcing nature of the game gives opportunities to out-manouvre the opponent.

I would say that the Petroff stays to the QGA as the Spanish Berlin stays to the QGD.
However as a drawing weapon I think the QGA is a very good opening. In fact Kasparov and Fischer used the QGA when they were looking for a draw.
As such it should be a perfectly suitable opening also for a weaker player.

NegiRefures, what do you think of 3.e4 e5?
  
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NegiRefutes
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #7 - 09/25/16 at 20:06:02
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Hi 'mrbenoni',

So I have done a little bit of analysis on the 3. e4 variation and checked Ivanchuk's games there. Black seemed to be getting very close to equality in both of those and I have some improvements for Black to do even better. The main problem for me with the QGA is actually the endgame line with 7. dxc5, as lower-rated players likely can draw and higher rated players can press. Though for most players, the QGA is a good weapon.

I'll post some analysis on 3. e4 later today or tomorrow likely.
  
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NegiRefutes
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #6 - 09/24/16 at 00:47:20
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@mrbenoni

Yes, Carlsen did play the QGA vs. Giri, but he is Carlsen and can get away with playing lots if stuff. Lately he has been trying 1... g6 as a way to play for the win. So the QGA is totally fine, but, stuff like the Nimzo/Queens Indian and the Grunfeld are more popular as they are easier to equalize in. I'll post some analysis on 3. e4 lines maybe in a day or so and I'll also check the Ivanchuk games.

The QGA is a perfectly fine opening but at the top level they prefer to play the absolute best lines.
  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #5 - 09/23/16 at 23:39:30
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Probably because it is not outwardly showy and people do not take the time to get to know it.
Reminds me of high school.
  

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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #4 - 09/23/16 at 19:57:21
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Wang Hao - Ivanchuk and InarKiev - Ivanchuk both 2016 seem to be smooth draws in the 3.e4 variation.
To be noted that also Carlsen has been willing to enter the same variation recently in the game Giri-Carlsen Bilbao Masters 2016.

In your opinion what are the problematic lines and what are  instead the reccomended ones?
Regards & thanks.


  
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NegiRefutes
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #3 - 09/23/16 at 18:17:24
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Yes, the 3. e4 line is a problem. You don't see more of it after 1. Nf3 because most people go 1. Nf3 d5 then 2. c4 or 2. g3, not 2. d4.
  
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #2 - 09/23/16 at 11:43:48
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Are you saying that the GQA is just not so good? I have noticed that Ivanchuck has played a couple of recent QGA games that ended in very quick draws. If the problem is the central variation ( 3.e4 ) why don't we see more of it after 1.Nf3?
I am really interested in your opinion , thanks.
  
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NegiRefutes
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Re: Why isn't the QGA more popular?
Reply #1 - 09/23/16 at 01:23:51
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The QGA isn't that popular because GM's prefer to play something really sound and strong like the Nimzo Indian or the Grunfeld. The QGA is definitely not a bad opening but if it was played against a GM, 3. e4 would probably be played.
  
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Why isn't the QGA more popular?
09/22/16 at 19:52:21
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Hi ChessForum,
I am really wondering why the QGA is not more popular.
Theorically it seems to be in good shape and the theory to learn, compared to other defenses, is relatively small.
Even if the Central variation 3.e4 wasn't sound I don't understand why we don't see more of it at least after 1.Nf3?
To me it seems a very good drawing weapon so why don't GMs use it when Black is fine with a drawn?
What's the expert opinion?
  
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