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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) 2017 World Cup (Read 19929 times)
Keano
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #85 - 10/04/17 at 11:19:17
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More propaganda. Fortunately it is impossible to ever recover a reputation when you dont have one in the first place.
  
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sim
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #84 - 10/04/17 at 10:20:52
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The extent to which I take Mr. Azmaiparashvili's side is that "I wore the same pants in the previous rounds" isn't a good enought excuse in principle, and that, while "gypsy" is a racially laden word, he likely didn't intend it to be a racial insult to Mr. Kovalyov (just a regular insult, like "street musician"). That's it. If Mr. Azmaiparashvili and the rest of the organisers had held themselves to the same principles they expected from Mr. Kovalyov, they would have tried to rectify their mistake by apologising in stead of by trying to redefine history.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #83 - 10/04/17 at 09:14:12
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an ordinary chessplayer wrote on 10/01/17 at 20:29:23:
Jorge Vega:
Quote:
I know Mr. Azmaiparashvili very well and I know that he has a very strong character and quite loud voice, but I am sure that it was not his intention to insult Mr. Kovalyov. (emphasis added)


LOL what? Pretty sure insulting Kovalyov was exactly his intention. You could perhaps say insulting him to this extent was not his intention, but obviously he was trying to get him to follow the rules and insults could help in this regard. Say, if your friend doesn't tip enough and you tell him "come on man, don't be a cheapskate." That's an insult designed to make him follow an unwritten rule. Not to say that "cheapskate" is equivalent to what Zurab said, it's just a random example of the principle.

(I don't agree with the rule, nor do I take Zurab's side to any extent. I'm just trying to say that Vega's statement makes no sense at all.)
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #82 - 10/03/17 at 01:29:34
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Yes, a bit random.
Hired hack to Mr Sokolov: "You were not there. Please pull something out of your @rse"
Sokolov: "Happy to..."
  
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Confused_by_Theory
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #81 - 10/02/17 at 17:00:43
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Hello.

sim wrote on 10/01/17 at 19:05:46:
http://en.chessbase.com/post/the-kovalyov-report
Well this is an interesting experiment. Will this kind of attempt at framing the debate, that usually works very well with most audiences, work as well with a chess audience? Aren't chess players generally more used to judging on their own, and aren't they perhaps slightly more intelligent on average?
I think this could be too transparent to fool a large enough percentage of the intended audience.

(Edit: sorry, I don't know if it adds much to the discussion. Maybe I just wanted to vent.)

Yes. This is not anywhere near serious investigative journalism. Many of the Chessbase comments are about this so if anyone is wondering why just read there.

Apart from some fresh recounts of events from Chief arbiter Delega and Chief organiser Azmaiparashvili (which seem to be in line with previous ones) I could not find anything of interest. The selected people interviewed in the report brought up almost nothing of investigative value; which is not really surprising considering they were mostly not present or did not seem to be near enough to the incident to even give their account of happenings. They also brought up much irrelevancy, but yea, without investigative direction when meeting these people the people interviewed are basically just going to say the stuff that comes up in their minds.

an ordinary chessplayer wrote on 10/01/17 at 20:29:23:
This bit from Anastasiya Karlovich made me laugh:
Quote:
I did not say anything about the dress code, because it’s not my job to make warnings and I try to be careful with players, they are quite sensitive people.

The last part about chess players? I probably would have too if I didn't believe it was so broadly accurate.

For Karlovich not to "warn" about when players are somehow breaking som minor rule or norm seems like an entirely professional way to go about her job. In fact, to my mind, it seems pretty much like an indication of competence from ms. Karlovich.


Have a nice day.
  
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an ordinary chessplayer
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #80 - 10/01/17 at 20:29:23
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I think it was quite reasonable for the organizers to commission this piece of "journalism". I found the opinions interesting, but as you say, I am still going to judge on my own.

Jorge Vega:
Quote:
I know Mr. Azmaiparashvili very well and I know that he has a very strong character and quite loud voice, but I am sure that it was not his intention to insult Mr. Kovalyov. (emphasis added)


This bit from Anastasiya Karlovich made me laugh:
Quote:
I did not say anything about the dress code, because it’s not my job to make warnings and I try to be careful with players, they are quite sensitive people.

We should all try to be more like Anastasiya Karlovich.
  
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sim
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #79 - 10/01/17 at 19:05:46
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http://en.chessbase.com/post/the-kovalyov-report
Well this is an interesting experiment. Will this kind of attempt at framing the debate, that usually works very well with most audiences, work as well with a chess audience? Aren't chess players generally more used to judging on their own, and aren't they perhaps slightly more intelligent on average?
I think this could be too transparent to fool a large enough percentage of the intended audience.

(Edit: sorry, I don't know if it adds much to the discussion. Maybe I just wanted to vent.)
  
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ReneDescartes
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #78 - 09/27/17 at 01:28:25
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Keano wrote on 09/22/17 at 11:23:58:
MVL is a very talented player but he does not seem to have much match strategy. Whatever the state of the match he plays the same risky stuff. He should have closed up shop after winning the first game with White.

On the other hand, Ding seems to have a natural feel for match strategy--a "player," as Lasker would say.  He instinctively stabilized himself with a draw after failing to win a won game against So (So shouldn't have accepted); he played fast to disorient Aronian and it worked; he went for counterplay and sticky situations when down in the fourth match game and it worked. And he's a gentleman. Very impressive.

Dink Heckler wrote on 09/22/17 at 12:26:49:
I would think faster time controls greatly favour the attacking side in this ending. So easy to blunder the rook.

Agree, generally attacking is easier under time pressure because, e.g., you just have to find one fork whereas the defender has to find them all; but there are more failures to convert in rapid than classical. Maybe a lot of time is taken by the non-forking situations where the king and rook are close and sliding around like eels.

But my main point was just that the humiliation would be horrible in an Armageddon game where a draw in a drawn match is a loss!
« Last Edit: 09/27/17 at 14:27:21 by ReneDescartes »  
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Keano
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #77 - 09/22/17 at 21:24:44
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rest day today presumably
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #76 - 09/22/17 at 12:26:49
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ReneDescartes wrote on 09/21/17 at 19:50:06:
So Aronian converts a Q vs R endgame against MVL under Armageddon conditions. I did a database search and not only Svidler, but also Georg Meier and Kovalev failed to convert this ending in rapid--and Morozevich and Navara failed to convert it in classical controls! What a horrible way for Aronian to lose a Candidates' berth that would have been...


I would think faster time controls greatly favour the attacking side in this ending. So easy to blunder the rook.
  

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Keano
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #75 - 09/22/17 at 11:23:58
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MVL is a very talented player but he does not seem to have much match strategy. Whatever the state of the match he plays the same risky stuff. He should have closed up shop after winning the first game with White.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #74 - 09/22/17 at 07:10:36
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Re endgame K+Q vs K+R, Dana Mackenzie has good blogpost on this:
http://www.danamackenzie.com/blog/?p=4910
  

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ReneDescartes
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #73 - 09/21/17 at 23:15:09
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Fascinating (it wasn't annotated in Megabase and I didn't count the moves). Good show by Navara!
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #72 - 09/21/17 at 20:41:31
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ReneDescartes wrote on 09/21/17 at 19:50:06:
Navara under classical time controls [..] failed to convert this ending.

If that's referring to this game http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1633790 , Navara evidently didn't fail to convert, he merely offered a draw after achieving a winning position (a FairPlay gesture due to some touch move incident early in the game).
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #71 - 09/21/17 at 19:50:06
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So Aronian converts a Q vs R endgame against MVL under Armageddon conditions. I did a database search and not only Svidler, but also Georg Meier and Kovalev failed to convert this ending in rapid--and Morozevich and Navara failed to convert it in classical controls! What a horrible way for Aronian to lose a Candidates' berth that would have been...
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #70 - 09/21/17 at 19:41:21
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IsaVulpes wrote on 08/28/17 at 10:47:14:
http://challonge.com/tournaments/3773687/predictions/153148 this is mine

- MVL loses in the Semifinals to Aronian
- Ding Liren takes it all

Well, my prediction could've been worse! Looking forward to this final
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #69 - 09/20/17 at 21:13:09
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two play-offs in the semis.

there will be some nervous players now Smiley

Very impressed with Ding Liren btw, actually I cannot call either match
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #68 - 09/19/17 at 16:44:12
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Strange decision by Aronian to go into a mainline Grünfeld against MVL. Isn't this "known" to be a draw currently?

Poor lad Zherebukh who totally didn't know his green card business until the WC had started is btw currently playing in the Fall Classic in St.Louis. I wonder when he signed up for that..
  
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Keano
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #67 - 09/18/17 at 14:12:05
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Svidler went out with a bit of a wimper there in the end against MVL. Expected a bit more from him with the White pieces.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #66 - 09/17/17 at 16:09:02
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Bibs wrote on 09/17/17 at 13:43:15:
RoleyPoley wrote on 09/17/17 at 09:52:49:
Keano wrote on 09/16/17 at 20:36:57:
RoleyPoley wrote on 09/16/17 at 19:16:47:
I'm not so surprised. This was presumably a reaction to the media picking up on Kovalyov's clothing after his win against Anand. If he had played and beaten someone less well known, we probably wouldnt have been aware of what he was wearing and those running the competition wouldnt have done anything.


I am unaware of any media comment on this before the incident, got a link?

I have watched most of the rounds live and was even unaware he was wearing shorts. He usually was sat at the board, and any interviews after his wins were shot from the waiste up.


I saw an article on Kevin Spraggett's site commenting on his dress shortly after he beat Anand. I thought the picture used may have been picked up elsewhere too, but i havent checked.

http://www.spraggettonchess.com/dress-like-a-grandmaster/

I thought it a bit too much of a coincidence that this went online and then the following round his wearing shorts became an issue.


To be honest, I really don't think Spraggett's oddball mix of soft porn and chess info garners much attention. To attempt to at least evidence such a truth claim, one rarely if ever sees the site getting a reference anywhere. For me - just struck me as ... a bit sad and creepy.   


I didnt mean that Spraggetts site was being picked up, i meant that i thought the picture he was using/article being written was probably similar to other articles being written by other writers at the time.
  

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Keano
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #65 - 09/17/17 at 15:41:17
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Bibs wrote on 09/17/17 at 15:35:07:
[quote author=5B75717E7F100 link=1503861623/63#63 date=1505659181]
Just had a look at the page. Fella uses a lot of bold and caps.
It would be easy to mock, but it just seems like a case where pity is a more humane response. Yet another chess player who presents himself as a couple of sarnies short of a picnic. See also: Salov, Fischer...


I actually agree with a lot of the points he is trying to make, but the site and his method of cummunication is a bit extravagant Smiley

If I had a website with my name on it I might be more concerned with libel laws and such, but it seems he has no fear in that direction.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #64 - 09/17/17 at 15:35:07
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Keano wrote on 09/17/17 at 14:39:41:
Mind you he doesnt hold back does Spraggett,

I like the headline "Kirsan psychopath ********* Anton’s ambition"

And the article where he explains Anton was within the dress code players but Azmai was beaking the dress code for arbiters.

You couldnt make it up.


Just had a look at the page. Fella uses a lot of bold and caps.
It would be easy to mock, but it just seems like a case where pity is a more humane response. Yet another chess player who presents himself as a couple of sarnies short of a picnic. See also: Salov, Fischer...
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #63 - 09/17/17 at 14:39:41
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Mind you he doesnt hold back does Spraggett,

I like the headline "Kirsan psychopath ********* Anton’s ambition"

And the article where he explains Anton was within the dress code players but Azmai was beaking the dress code for arbiters.

You couldnt make it up.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #62 - 09/17/17 at 13:43:15
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RoleyPoley wrote on 09/17/17 at 09:52:49:
Keano wrote on 09/16/17 at 20:36:57:
RoleyPoley wrote on 09/16/17 at 19:16:47:
I'm not so surprised. This was presumably a reaction to the media picking up on Kovalyov's clothing after his win against Anand. If he had played and beaten someone less well known, we probably wouldnt have been aware of what he was wearing and those running the competition wouldnt have done anything.


I am unaware of any media comment on this before the incident, got a link?

I have watched most of the rounds live and was even unaware he was wearing shorts. He usually was sat at the board, and any interviews after his wins were shot from the waiste up.


I saw an article on Kevin Spraggett's site commenting on his dress shortly after he beat Anand. I thought the picture used may have been picked up elsewhere too, but i havent checked.

http://www.spraggettonchess.com/dress-like-a-grandmaster/

I thought it a bit too much of a coincidence that this went online and then the following round his wearing shorts became an issue.


To be honest, I really don't think Spraggett's oddball mix of soft porn and chess info garners much attention. To attempt to at least evidence such a truth claim, one rarely if ever sees the site getting a reference anywhere. For me - just struck me as ... a bit sad and creepy.   
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #61 - 09/17/17 at 09:52:49
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Keano wrote on 09/16/17 at 20:36:57:
RoleyPoley wrote on 09/16/17 at 19:16:47:
I'm not so surprised. This was presumably a reaction to the media picking up on Kovalyov's clothing after his win against Anand. If he had played and beaten someone less well known, we probably wouldnt have been aware of what he was wearing and those running the competition wouldnt have done anything.


I am unaware of any media comment on this before the incident, got a link?

I have watched most of the rounds live and was even unaware he was wearing shorts. He usually was sat at the board, and any interviews after his wins were shot from the waiste up.


I saw an article on Kevin Spraggett's site commenting on his dress shortly after he beat Anand. I thought the picture used may have been picked up elsewhere too, but i havent checked.

http://www.spraggettonchess.com/dress-like-a-grandmaster/

I thought it a bit too much of a coincidence that this went online and then the following round his wearing shorts became an issue.
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #60 - 09/17/17 at 01:48:52
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According to chessbase.com, Kovalyov wore the same striped [sic] shorts every round. According to Kovalyov he didn't even bring any long pants. Let's look at the timeline:

09.02 Opening ceremony and technical meeting (Kovalyov presumably in shorts)
09.03 Akobian 0-1 Kovalyov (shorts)
09.04 Kovalyov (shorts) 1/2-1/2 Akobian
09.05 No tiebreak, Kovalyov free day
09.06 Anand 0-1 Kovalyov (shorts)
09.07 Kovalyov (shorts) 1/2-1/2 Anand
09.08 No tiebreak, Kovalyov free day
09.09 A few minutes before the round is to begin Kovalyov, wearing shorts (big surprise), is requested to change into long pants.

Are the organizers able to calculate more than one move ahead? If the idea was to maximize the chance that Kovalyov would be dressed properly for the game against Rodshtein, then a good time to make the request was on 09.07, thus giving Kovalyov a whole day to figure out how to comply. If the idea was to set Kovalyov up for failure, then by all means wait until just before the round starts to make the same request.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #59 - 09/16/17 at 20:36:57
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RoleyPoley wrote on 09/16/17 at 19:16:47:
I'm not so surprised. This was presumably a reaction to the media picking up on Kovalyov's clothing after his win against Anand. If he had played and beaten someone less well known, we probably wouldnt have been aware of what he was wearing and those running the competition wouldnt have done anything.


I am unaware of any media comment on this before the incident, got a link?

I have watched most of the rounds live and was even unaware he was wearing shorts. He usually was sat at the board, and any interviews after his wins were shot from the waiste up.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #58 - 09/16/17 at 19:16:47
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Confused_by_Theory wrote on 09/16/17 at 18:40:57:
That so many rounds passed before action was taken is a bit strange. At the same time the chief arbiter is in principle correct to act whenever he perceives a problem or a bad state of things, regardless of wheter this has previously gone unchecked.


I'm not so surprised. This was presumably a reaction to the media picking up on Kovalyov's clothing after his win against Anand. If he had played and beaten someone less well known, we probably wouldnt have been aware of what he was wearing and those running the competition wouldnt have done anything.
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #57 - 09/16/17 at 18:40:57
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Hi.

Big post on Dress code incident coming.

IsaVulpes wrote on 09/09/17 at 13:58:05:
Kovalyov got a warning for "not following the dresscode" and decided to both forfeit his game and leave the tournament. His infraction seems to have been wearing shorts -- which he also did in the first round, as well as when he beat Anand. Truly strange..

That so many rounds passed before action was taken is a bit strange. At the same time the chief arbiter is in principle correct to act whenever he perceives a problem or a bad state of things, regardless of wheter this has previously gone unchecked.

The action taken, to aproach the player 10 or so minutes before the round and ask him to go up to his hotel room and change into pants (if he is able presumably though see below), I personally find an ok way to handle the situation. If it were me I would handle it afterwards but I don't see any major fault here anyway. That is if the arbiter was not overly insistent on the going up to change part once Kovalyev said he did not have any pants to change into. That would be stressful for the player.

Not entirely clear based on this interview with the chief arbiter anyway:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FuqhvA1hVc
He first describes how he tells the player to go up to the hotel room and change into pants and only at a later point in the video does he add the context if he is able.

Keano wrote on 09/09/17 at 17:34:11:
The arbiter was simply asking if it was possible to change shorts, god nows what Azmai said to him.

Yea. Exactly. Kovalyov apparently claimed (wording coming from the arbiter) that he did not have the correct colour; so the arbiter decided to focus on this more pressing issue instead of the dress code related discussion. Colours were confirmed to the player but at that point it seems like the dress code discussion was just forgotten and the chief arbiter presumably went away to oversee the start of the round. If this indeed is the case then it is not good. As an arbiter you don't have a serious discussion with a player about something and then just drop it without some kind of recognition from the player that he has understood what the discussion was about and ideally also some kind of consensus between arbiter and player about will happen in the future. At the same time. Maybe this is what happened. I can't tell how the arbiter and player parted from the available sources.

Azmaiparashvili, perhaps sensing this possible lack of closure (or actually consulting the chief arbiter beforehand as he claims he did), then approached Kovalyov and in a direct manner it seems told Kovalyev to go change into pants. So Azmaiparashvili asked a question to which Kovalyov supposedly replied "why?". Fairly horrible as a response to my mind. Firstly. One word replies always triggers people. I mean read the bloody situation, excercise some self control and don't go for it. Secondly the player knew full well (from the earlier conversation with the chief arbiter) there was at least one high ranking official who saw problems with his attire. To then play dumb when another official approaches is just poor and can also rile up the official considerably if he starts thinking the player is trying to have the same discussion as he had a while a go with a different official. Now. Zurab's magnificent reply "because you look like a gypsy" I'm fairly sure also had a somewhat triggering effect and yea... discussion derailed. I don't blame Kovalyov for leaving. When someone early on drops a comment like that it is, to my mind, fairly certain that he is not the most balanced person at that point and is going to be hard to reason with constructively.

Kovalyov forfeited after 15min and left the same day it seems. When he was 100% certain he was not going to play on he should definitely have made absolutely sure his opponent knew he was not coming tomorrow. Don't know if this happened but hopefully it did in a good way and this is essentially just out of respect for your colleagues by not wasting their time and granting them peace of mind.

Stigma wrote on 09/10/17 at 01:10:07:
But in fact he wasn't told he was doing anything wrong during previous rounds. He wasn't advised there was any problem until five minutes before this 3rd round game, when it would be too late to go and buy long trousers. Then Azmaiparashvili came along and yelled at him, just to make 100% sure his concetration was ruined.

That is one interpretation of events but yea... I still think definite statements surrounding cirumstances and especially what drove the people involved are a bit hard to make in many cases.

There is for example a clear distinction between Azmaiparashvilis recount of how the word gypsy was used and Kovalyov's recount (also given by ACP and the Candadian federation).
Azmaiparashvili:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94yv9OLcVQw
Kovalyov:
https://chessdailynews.com/official-statement-from-gm-anton-kovalyov-about-world...
Here I find it very hard to believe Kovalyov's statement that he was called a gypsy. That it was said he was dressed as one, very likely stated, but there is a clear distinction in severity between the two. For Kovalyov (+ACP+Canadian chess federation less explicitly) to push that he as a person was called a gypsy risks being seen as a wrongful recount.

And some more things:
Another point worth pointing out, Zurab never asked me to go and change, the conversation consisted of threats, insults, and agressive behavior from Zurab. He was clearly provoking me.
Underlined is in effect contested by Azmaiparashvili. To which I have to add that the never asking to go change part is extremely hard to believe in.

Also raised is that complaint that Azmaiparashvili demonstrated aggressive behaviour (whatever this means). In chess official circles I feel it is a serious charge to make against someone and that not writing specifically what was considered aggressive is simply to vague for such an accusation.

Somewhat also interesting is if Azmaiparashvili acted after talking to the chief arbiter or if he just rushed in to the situation. Zurab says he did talk to the chief arbiter beforehand but the chief arbiter does not mention this conversation in his video. Something going on there.

Stigma wrote on 09/10/17 at 01:10:07:
And all this for something that isn't even violating any rule - the only dress code people around the internet are managing to dig up explicitly allows bermuda shorts!
RoleyPoley wrote on 09/14/17 at 15:59:04:
How to explain irrational behaviour? The current FIDE Dress Code specifically (Reg.5) prohibits the clothing that World Cup organizer Azmaiparashvili was wearing the day he attacked Canadian Anton Kovalyov for not respecting the same Code. Even though Kovalyov’s bermuda shorts are explicitly allowed by the same Code (Reg.3a).

Just bringing up some document with the text proposal in the url and saying it is the Fide dress code is not greatly confidence inspiring.

Has it been ratified?
From what I can tell this would have happened either in presidential board meeting 2013:3, Tallinn, or Fide congress 84 in the same city. I tried but could not find those protocols.

Has it been implemented?
Does not seem like it.

IsaVulpes wrote on 09/10/17 at 05:29:47:
How about this for an excuse: He specifically asked the organizers of a past WC whether shorts would be legal, and was given the go-ahead. Nothing indicated that anything had changed.

If you ever find yourself in a situation where you doubt the authenticity of a rule or regulation being pushed on you there are basically two options.
a) make some kind of case. From what I can tell Kovalyov tried this but, being unable to handle the siatuation (and I'm not saying it was a good situation), did not manage to do this well enough.
or...
b) Ask the person trying to push these regulations on you to first name them in detail and then explain them. Basically this is your right nowdays as a player. What then is going to happen is that 90% of the time the person pushing the regulation will not be able to verbally recount and explain the rule or regulation in question in a good way. You will then need to calmly explain this to them and ask to see the rule in printed form, standing your ground until you get this possibility.

Obviously Kovalyev made some weak attempts at a) and then gave up entirely. This often feels natural but never a good thing. You want the arbiter to explain using the printed regulation, otherwise there is every chance he can push some misunderstood rule or whatever on you and you won't be able to do much as long as the arbiter is hard to reason with (which sadly, far to often is the case).

Bibs wrote on 09/15/17 at 17:00:41:
To help improve - a clear set of rules, from FIDE.
Plus a set of sartorial guidelines too, perhaps from ACP (e.g. Think of it as a party where the invitation states 'smart casual' and you are keen to make a good impression; wear shoes, trousers, shirt and a jacket to prizegiving - any jacket can hide alll sorts of ills; don't wear T-shirt and/or shorts unless you are playing chess on the beach or by the pool; use shampoo; use a comb; shave regularly; check clothes for stains; use a deodorant and foot spray; wear shoes not dirty trainers/sneakers...)
ErictheRed wrote on 09/15/17 at 18:20:09:
I agree with Bibs.  If people are being paid to play, there needs to be some sort of standard for attire.  What professional organizations don't have those standards?  Especially ones where the work is being televised or photographed?
Keano wrote on 09/15/17 at 18:50:40:
All agreed, but read up on this particular incident.
Stigma wrote on 09/15/17 at 20:34:26:
I agree wholeheartedly that FIDE should have had a stricter dress code for top events. But for the time being they don't, apparently. And that's all that matters when judging this particular incident.

Also agree to Bibs suggestions.

Stigma wrote on 09/15/17 at 20:34:26:
The irony that in fact Kovalyov was complying with the current dress code while Azmaiparashvili was not (as RoleyPoley pointed out earlier) is just priceless. The dress code for arbiters is stricter than for players.

Yer. Hehe.

RdC wrote on 09/15/17 at 23:12:06:
It's my view that the bad publicity you get by arbitrary enforcement of a dress code exceeds the alleged damage from poor attire.

Definitely.


Edit: And Fide's reply to the Canadian protest is of course quite misguided as noted
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #56 - 09/16/17 at 00:55:29
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A few relevant links from around the web on The curious incident of the shorts in Tbilisi:

Azmaiparashvili giving his side of the story in two video interviews (these are several days old by now):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukuxx1RHs3g

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94yv9OLcVQw


Further clarification from Kovalyov:

https://chessdailynews.com/more-clarification-from-gm-anton-kovalyov-about-tbili...

Letter from the Chess Federation of Canada, and FIDEs response:

http://www.fide.com/component/content/article/1-fide-news/10413-letter-from-ches...

FIDEs response doesn't make much sense to me. It seems to suggest that since Azmaiparashvili has helped bring a lot of money into chess, he should get a free pass to behave as he pleases?! Realpolitik maybe, but this has nothing to do with ethics, fair play, or "Gens una sumus".
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #55 - 09/16/17 at 00:01:32
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Keano - hi, all hi. I do not think it is a red herring to discuss what underpins, and to note that this is a problem. Slovenliness IS an issue, and sponsors are not gonna like it. 

I noted that he is a student. I'm a uni teacher (or 'prof' if you like).  My job is teaching, looking after and helping students to get to a position where they can function and hopefully succeed in the outside adult world. I'm looking after students in Cambodia right now as it happens. I do agree that younger people often don't know how to behave. Rumsfeldian 'unknown unknowns' perhaps Wink  That's not to be dismissive or patronizing. No. It's to understand, and from there, to anticipate and to know how to deal with. Clothing, politeness and punctuality are common issues with students and with chess players.

As an example - one lass was late constantly. I sat down with her after a class, and discussed her daily schedule - p/t job, sleep time, wake up time, travel time. And planned a different schedule, with more sleep built in. In addition to me following attendance rules. I feel such an approach would work with chess players, and is necessary. Clear rules, properly written by literate sorts, who see both sides of this. Plus some softly-siftly guidance in a metaphorical 'arm round shoulder, let's chat about this' kinda way.

RdC. Yes, agreed that Azmai looked a mess in the video. Casting abrasive stones in bullying fashion, while looking slovenly himself. Put a shirt on man! Try a suit - do without the tie, sure, but a suit! Remembering the issues in 2004 in Calvia (even before he tried to crash the stage, headbutted a copper, received choice physical responses, was arrested and jailed), that does does not bode too well if he is directly involved.

(Actually, when discussing the Olympiad with a couple of the main organizers at the organizers desk in a hotel back in 2004 in Spain, a serious issue with organizers of that event was the wacky extras and freebie stuff 'required' by FIDE types. A circle that they found very difficult to square administratively, when there are budgets to adhere to, and meetings with business and local government sponsors. Including an individual who had demanded two separate hotel rooms. In his 'two separate roles'. I still really don't get why - to get a double breakfast helping, of a buffet?!  Roll Eyes And that demanded double-roomer was, yes, you guessed it...)
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #54 - 09/15/17 at 23:12:06
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Keano wrote on 09/15/17 at 21:57:06:
What happened to Kovalov is complete abuse and victmisation by Azmai, who unfortunately will be organising the olympiad .


It's my view that the bad publicity you get by arbitrary enforcement of a dress code exceeds the alleged damage from poor attire. Azmai himself is guilty of this. Surely he should either be wearing a suit or a branded tee-shirt?
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #53 - 09/15/17 at 21:57:06
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It was a disgraceful treatment of a player to be fair. A student also, not a professional, but who had just knocked out Anand.

Some on here trying to throw a few red herrings in.

A dress code is all well and good but do it properly if you want to enforce it. What happened to Kovalov is complete abuse and victmisation by Azmai, who unfortunately will be organising the olympiad Sad God help us.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #52 - 09/15/17 at 20:34:26
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I agree wholeheartedly that FIDE should have had a stricter dress code for top events. But for the time being they don't, apparently. And that's all that matters when judging this particular incident.

The irony that in fact Kovalyov was complying with the current dress code while Azmaiparashvili was not (as RoleyPoley pointed out earlier) is just priceless. The dress code for arbiters is stricter than for players.
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #51 - 09/15/17 at 18:50:40
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All agreed, but read up on this particular incident.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #50 - 09/15/17 at 18:20:09
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I agree with Bibs.  If people are being paid to play, there needs to be some sort of standard for attire.  What professional organizations don't have those standards?  Especially ones where the work is being televised or photographed?
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #49 - 09/15/17 at 17:00:41
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I do agree that there needs to be a certain minimum standard. For sponsors. Who are likely to be wish to have visual documentation (photos!) of their association with clean, smart people.

No, oh no, in an ideal world it should not be necessary. Keys should not be tapped about such, and it is unfortunate that this needs to be discussed at all. It's dreary. But without basic hygiene and sartorial rules you see any number of players who smell and look like their accommodation for a tournament is in a bush, in the nearest park.

Some players have to be told to wash their hair, to not wear the same attire every day, and to bathe. Distressingly, some similar problems in academia! It's not enough to just be 'smart' in a narrow fashion. Being clean and presentable is a necessary part of the package.

To help improve - a clear set of rules, from FIDE.
Plus a set of sartorial guidelines too, perhaps from ACP (e.g. Think of it as a party where the invitation states 'smart casual' and you are keen to make a good impression; wear shoes, trousers, shirt and a jacket to prizegiving - any jacket can hide alll sorts of ills; don't wear T-shirt and/or shorts unless you are playing chess on the beach or by the pool; use shampoo; use a comb; shave regularly; check clothes for stains; use a deodorant and foot spray; wear shoes not dirty trainers/sneakers...)

For the record, I think Kovalyov was silly to wear shorts. It's just not ... the done thing. And certainly not the same pair, every day, gadzooks. But he was treated absolutely terribly by Azmai.

Yours wearily,
B

  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #48 - 09/15/17 at 16:09:53
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Grischuk has had his problems with explosive endgame failure. In the candidates' against Kramnik, he moved into a pawn ending that just looked obviously lost, and was so.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #47 - 09/15/17 at 12:17:53
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Jupp53 wrote on 09/14/17 at 19:19:43:
Dink Heckler wrote on 09/13/17 at 15:33:50:
Chess pros: Why can't we be paid like professionals?
Also chess pros: We demand the right to turn up dressed like hobos!


This is an awful attitude towards people! As long as they are clean everything is all right. They are no salespersons and they don't get paid as models. They are paid for playing chess! If they are forced to cloth like salespersons it's corruption!

'Awful attitude'? What?! They are marketing the game to sponsors, or hoping to at any rate. They are not playing the glass bead game, cloistered in a dingy castle, removed from the world. This whole attitude is why chess has to rely on crumbs from Kirsan's wallet - and look where that has got us.
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #46 - 09/15/17 at 02:41:14
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The white man thing was a complete parody. Racism in the subsequent standardization? Even if there were an element of that, it could hardly be disentangled from the general associations of white and black in Western culture, which date to medieval times and earlier.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #45 - 09/14/17 at 22:20:57
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Amazing Grishchuk did not win that ending. Was a great match deserved to go on to blitz and Armegeddon.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #44 - 09/14/17 at 19:53:56
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tony37 wrote on 09/14/17 at 19:17:53:
ReneDescartes wrote on 09/14/17 at 18:54:10:
Really? Maybe I am one of those Americans who sees racism everywhere after all.

While we're at it, why does the white man always get to move first??

it seems to be a recent (19th century) invention, so yes, there may be some racism here (subconscious or not)
the Immortal Game was played with black (Anderssen) having the first move

I don't have a source for the following, so take it with a grain of salt. But I read somewhere that originally either Black or White could move first, often just alternating in order to not have to switch pieces. Then when someone wanted to standardize this, they felt that the Black pieces could confer the advantage of getting help from dark forces! Sounds like something people could take seriously in the middle ages.

So as compensation for this naturally it was decided White should be allowed to move first...
« Last Edit: 09/14/17 at 22:48:20 by Stigma »  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #43 - 09/14/17 at 19:48:46
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ReneDescartes wrote on 09/14/17 at 18:54:10:
Really? Maybe I am one of those Americans who sees racism everywhere after all.

But why does the white man always get to move first??

I must admit I also found your comment on the pairing of East Asians a bit extreme. Sounds like a wild conspiracy theory and quite untypical – I've always found your posts here nuanced and measured.

Maybe you were joking somehow?
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #42 - 09/14/17 at 19:19:43
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Dink Heckler wrote on 09/13/17 at 15:33:50:
Chess pros: Why can't we be paid like professionals?
Also chess pros: We demand the right to turn up dressed like hobos!


This is an awful attitude towards people! As long as they are clean everything is all right. They are no salespersons and they don't get paid as models. They are paid for playing chess! If they are forced to cloth like salespersons it's corruption!
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #41 - 09/14/17 at 19:17:53
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ReneDescartes wrote on 09/14/17 at 18:54:10:
Really? Maybe I am one of those Americans who sees racism everywhere after all.

While we're at it, why does the white man always get to move first??

it seems to be a recent (19th century) invention, so yes, there may be some racism here (subconscious or not)
the Immortal Game was played with black (Anderssen) having the first move
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #40 - 09/14/17 at 18:54:10
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Really? Maybe I am one of those Americans who sees racism everywhere after all.

But why does the white man always get to move first??
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #39 - 09/14/17 at 18:50:34
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ReneDescartes wrote on 09/14/17 at 16:51:53:
Another charming fact about the organization of this tournament--all players with epicanthic folds ("asian-looking faces") ranked above 35th in the world on the August and September Fide rating lists were seeded in the same half of the pairing tree, guaranteeing that the final could not feature, for example, Nakamura vs. Ding (Bu, the sole exception over 2700 in the other half, was seeded so as to meet Carlsen in round 3 if he won twice).

I am not one of those Americans who sees racism everywhere. This matter would not be worth commenting on were it not for the fact that the most valuable thing at stake here is not victory in the World Cup, but a berth in the 2018 candidates' tournament, which both finalists will receive. One of those berths looks like an all-but-reserved non-asian slot.


This is a pretty bizarre statement as the seeding is completely determined by rating. Looks pretty difficult to intentionally tweak ratings to have this specific distribution.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #38 - 09/14/17 at 16:51:53
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Another charming fact about the organization of this tournament--all players with epicanthic folds ("asian-looking faces") ranked above 35th in the world on the August and September Fide rating lists were seeded in the same half of the pairing tree, guaranteeing that the final could not feature, for example, Nakamura vs. Ding (Bu, the sole exception over 2700 in the other half, was seeded so as to meet Carlsen in round 3 if he won twice).

I am not one of those Americans who sees  racism everywhere. This matter would not be worth commenting on were it not for the fact that the most valuable thing at stake here is not victory in the World Cup, but a berth in the 2018 candidates' tournament, which both finalists will receive. One of those berths looks like an all-but-reserved non-asian slot.

« Last Edit: 09/14/17 at 19:13:51 by ReneDescartes »  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #37 - 09/14/17 at 15:59:04
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How to explain irrational behaviour? The current FIDE Dress Code specifically (Reg.5) prohibits the clothing that World Cup organizer Azmaiparashvili was wearing the day he attacked Canadian Anton Kovalyov for not respecting the same Code. Even though Kovalyov’s bermuda shorts are explicitly allowed by the same Code (Reg.3a).

http://www.spraggettonchess.com/psychopathy-in-tbilisi/
http://www.spraggettonchess.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Dress_Code_players.jp...
http://www.spraggettonchess.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Dress_Code_organizers...
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #36 - 09/13/17 at 18:22:42
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Jupp53 wrote on 09/13/17 at 14:59:14:
Taking about dresscode: I like everbody treating it this way:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJiBBb8X0AIYl04.jpg


Smiley well done Chucky

Edit - and another good scalp knocking out Giri now.
« Last Edit: 09/14/17 at 09:39:28 by Keano »  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #35 - 09/13/17 at 15:33:50
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Chess pros: Why can't we be paid like professionals?
Also chess pros: We demand the right to turn up dressed like hobos!
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #34 - 09/13/17 at 14:59:14
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Taking about dresscode: I like everbody treating it this way:

  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #33 - 09/13/17 at 10:47:08
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IsaVulpes wrote on 09/10/17 at 05:29:47:
This is still entirely aside from the described treatment at the hands of Zurab being unacceptable even if Kovalyov had turned up naked.

Agreed. Zurab is on his own turf, playing the authoritarian dictator, head of his own appeals committee, abusing his people at will for his pleasure.

On a lighter note, naked tournaments would considerably simplify the dress code.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #32 - 09/11/17 at 18:52:25
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Interesting game by Bu to beat Carlsen a few days ago; I'm constantly surprised at the number of early (before move 10) new ideas and nuances have been cropping up in the Open Games over the past five years or so.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #31 - 09/10/17 at 18:38:51
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Carlsen, Naka, Kramnik all going home today.

Nice game by Ivanchuk as Black.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #30 - 09/10/17 at 12:51:52
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As ever, alas, one wishes the ACP had someone considerably more thoughtful and literate to write for them.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #29 - 09/10/17 at 12:11:20
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #28 - 09/10/17 at 05:29:47
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TN wrote on 09/09/17 at 21:59:44:
Keano wrote on 09/09/17 at 18:02:02:
Not surprised. Zurab Azmai has a history of this.

Dont blame the lad to go home to his studies.


Good on you for sticking up for Kovalyov. You wouldn't believe the vitriol directed at him in the comments to the ChessBase story - ironic considering a paid account is needed to post on the articles there...

Really surprising to me that anyone at all would direct anything beyond "yeah, shorts are kinda unprofessional" at Kovalyov. More than obvious with whom lays the blame.. Azmaiparashvili even openly admits that he said gypsy.

TopNotch wrote on 09/09/17 at 23:30:28:
Showing up in striped Bermuda Short Pants in such an event seems absurd to me and the excuse given just as ridiculous.

How about this for an excuse: He specifically asked the organizers of a past WC whether shorts would be legal, and was given the go-ahead. Nothing indicated that anything had changed.

In General, the rules are incredibly nebulous and dont explain anything - plus it's by no means the first instance of 'unprofessional' clothing at the elite level and theres never been a comment about it; eg Caruana wore a meme-tshirt at the Sinquefield Cup & Nepo is known to walk around in DotA-shirts & -sweaters - is that less "offending"?

Wesley So was scribbling notes on his notation sheet, which is expressedly forbidden and may very well get into the realms of cheating, yet it took multiple warnings with repeat offences for there to be any action at all (which then happened to be the forfeiture of the game, but even that decision was disputed by many).
If you are against your players wearing shorts (then write that into the rules.. But ok, lets ignore that part), go to him and say "hey, we'd prefer you not to wear this, please come with trousers tomorrow, consider this a warning, thank you" - dont send the player back to his room right before the game.

This is still entirely aside from the described treatment at the hands of Zurab being unacceptable even if Kovalyov had turned up naked.

E: The one /possible/ counterpoint to the Kovalyov-case I found was that he actually wanted to leave the tournament from the get-go (whyever) and tried to provoke/fake some Kind of 'Scandal', which he might be able to use as an excuse (which would also be why he complained about the "wrong" colour).
I suppose its possible to believe that (I certainly dont, although I will admit it's mighty strange for a player of his level not to know his colour), but it wouldn't even change anything about the dresscode rules being unclear & the alleged behaviour of the TD (who also happens to be chief of the appeals commitee?! Who got that idea), so it feels like a bit of a moot point to me
« Last Edit: 09/10/17 at 11:37:05 by IsaVulpes »  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #27 - 09/10/17 at 05:03:06
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TopNotch wrote on 09/09/17 at 23:46:23:
You have no idea what your'e talking about, Yarolsav is in the position right now that if he leaves the United States, chances are he would lose his green card status and not be let back in, and thanks largely to Trump he would have to start the citizenship process all over again from scratch.

And he learned about this when? One day prior to the tournament? Did he get the idea to apply for a green card last week? Was Trump elected on Monday?
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #26 - 09/10/17 at 01:10:07
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TopNotch wrote on 09/09/17 at 23:30:28:
Showing up in striped Bermuda Short Pants in such an event seems absurd to me and the excuse given just as ridiculous. These young guys do some weird things and then seem shocked when things go awry. Not condoning what Zurab's behavior or that of the arbiter allegedly was, but showing up for World Cup games in those kind of pants is the equivalent of thumbing your nose at the opponent and the organizers.   

These guys need some training in etiquette and what's acceptable, 'I put on some weight and don't have pants that fit' is just not going to cut it sorry. I like Anton's chess, but after getting away with this dress code fiasco in a previous round, he should have been advised of potential forfeit if repeated.

But in fact he wasn't told he was doing anything wrong during previous rounds. He wasn't advised there was any problem until five minutes before this 3rd round game, when it would be too late to go and buy long trousers. Then Azmaiparashvili came along and yelled at him, just to make 100% sure his concetration was ruined.

And all this for something that isn't even violating any rule - the only dress code people around the internet are managing to dig up explicitly allows bermuda shorts!

You could argue that FIDE and/or a top tournament like this should have a dress code that bans any kind of shorts (and I would agree for the top tournaments), but it seems that in fact they don't. And the way to get a new code adopted is not to suddenly, randomly apply it to one player just before an important game.

The blame for this mess falls squarely on the organizers, not the player.
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #25 - 09/09/17 at 23:46:23
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IsaVulpes wrote on 09/09/17 at 14:02:52:
trw wrote on 09/05/17 at 18:26:28:
Why isn't there more talk about Yaroslav's intentional forfeit?

Had a post written about this, but somehow must've forgotten to hit send.

Was specifically referring to
trw wrote on 09/03/17 at 15:01:58:
Good question. And wasting a spot that should go to another potential challenger... ala Topalov / Kamsky / Short / Morozevich / Sutosvky / or many other talents like IM Noritsyn who right fully earned a place here the proper way... https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=853&v=qBNEcRgHkvE

Unlike Carlsen, Zherebukh ACTUALLY wasted a spot, for no reason whatsoever. Rather shocking, and not very reassuring that we haven't heard anything about this since day 1.
Would hope he gets a lifetime ban from future World Cups minimum -- entirely unacceptable behaviour.


You have no idea what your'e talking about, Yarolsav is in the position right now that if he leaves the United States, chances are he would lose his green card status and not be let back in, and thanks largely to Trump he would have to start the citizenship process all over again from scratch.

Lets make America great again! Gotta luv the american electorate, so well informed and deliberative they elected a genius for a president. 
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #24 - 09/09/17 at 23:31:27
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TN wrote on 09/09/17 at 21:59:44:
Good on you for sticking up for Kovalyov. You wouldn't believe the vitriol directed at him in the comments to the ChessBase story - ironic considering a paid account is needed to post on the articles there...


Malcolm Pein on twitter was saying the ACP need to step in and take some type of action.

It is an outright disgrace what has happened.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #23 - 09/09/17 at 23:30:28
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Showing up in striped Bermuda Short Pants in such an event seems absurd to me and the excuse given just as ridiculous. These young guys do some weird things and then seem shocked when things go awry. Not condoning what Zurab's behavior or that of the arbiter allegedly was, but showing up for World Cup games in those kind of pants is the equivalent of thumbing your nose at the opponent and the organizers.   

These guys need some training in etiquette and what's acceptable, 'I put on some weight and don't have pants that fit' is just not going to cut it sorry. I like Anton's chess, but after getting away with this dress code fiasco in a previous round, he should have been advised of potential forfeit if repeated.

Tournament players ought to take themselves and the image of the game more seriously if they expect potential sponsors to do so.
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #22 - 09/09/17 at 21:59:44
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Keano wrote on 09/09/17 at 18:02:02:
Not surprised. Zurab Azmai has a history of this.

Dont blame the lad to go home to his studies.


Good on you for sticking up for Kovalyov. You wouldn't believe the vitriol directed at him in the comments to the ChessBase story - ironic considering a paid account is needed to post on the articles there...
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #21 - 09/09/17 at 18:02:02
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Not surprised. Zurab Azmai has a history of this.

Dont blame the lad to go home to his studies.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #20 - 09/09/17 at 17:52:09
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What I read now without being able to give another source than a chat:

Anton Kovalyov
1 Std. ·
I wanted to wait a little till I calm down, but I'm tired of seeing lies everywhere. So here's what happened:
The issue were not the shorts but how I was treated. I came to the game and was approached by the arbiter asking me to change (first time). I told him that I don't have pants with me, and then I noticed that I was playing black instead of white, which came as a surprise for me and asked him to check that. He and the other arbiters checked and confirmed to me that I'm playing with black, we talked a little and everything was fine. Then came Zurab, he was very agressive, yelling at me and using the racial slur "gypsy" to insult me, apart from mentioning several times that I will be punished by FIDE. I told him that I had asked before at the previous world cup if what I was wearing was OK and I was told by somebody from the organization that yes. Zurab, in a prepotent way, said he doesn't care, he's the organizer now. At this point I was really angry but tried not to do anything stupid, and asked him why he was so rude to me, and he said because I'm a gypsy.
So imagine this, the round is about to start, I'm being bullied by the organizer of the tournament, being assured that I will be punished by FIDE, yelled at and racially insulted. What would you do in my situation? I think many people would have punched this person in the face or at least insulted him. I decided to leave.
Worth pointing out, I didn't take any pants with me because I gained some weight and they were to tight. If the organization of the tournament would have warned me sooner I would have taken a cab to the mall and bought pants, without any problems whatsoever, but instead I was treated like garbage. I was too stressed out by the way I was treated and the threats of being punished by FIDE no matter what I do, so I choose to leave before I do anything stupid.
Another point worth pointing out, Zurab never asked me to go and change, the conversation consisted of threats, insults, and agressive behavior from Zurab. He was clearly provoking me.
I will not appeal anything. I am disgusted by this type of people. I don't want the money. I'm coming back home.
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #19 - 09/09/17 at 17:34:11
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IsaVulpes wrote on 09/09/17 at 13:58:05:
Kovalyov got a warning for "not following the dresscode" and decided to both forfeit his game and leave the tournament. His infraction seems to have been wearing shorts -- which he also did in the first round, as well as when he beat Anand. Truly strange..



Seems like our old friend Azmairasgvili decided to stick his head in. The arbiter was simply asking if it was possible to change shorts, god nows what Azmai said to him.

I'd support the lad in a case against FIDE, truly awful treatment. He is a great player and a student also.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #18 - 09/09/17 at 17:03:33
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Audiatur et altera pars.

These days there is a speedup of quick judgments before taking time to get some basic information.
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #17 - 09/09/17 at 14:02:52
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trw wrote on 09/05/17 at 18:26:28:
Why isn't there more talk about Yaroslav's intentional forfeit?

Had a post written about this, but somehow must've forgotten to hit send.

Was specifically referring to
trw wrote on 09/03/17 at 15:01:58:
Good question. And wasting a spot that should go to another potential challenger... ala Topalov / Kamsky / Short / Morozevich / Sutosvky / or many other talents like IM Noritsyn who right fully earned a place here the proper way... https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=853&v=qBNEcRgHkvE

Unlike Carlsen, Zherebukh ACTUALLY wasted a spot, for no reason whatsoever. Rather shocking, and not very reassuring that we haven't heard anything about this since day 1.
Would hope he gets a lifetime ban from future World Cups minimum -- entirely unacceptable behaviour.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #16 - 09/09/17 at 13:58:05
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Kovalyov got a warning for "not following the dresscode" and decided to both forfeit his game and leave the tournament. His infraction seems to have been wearing shorts -- which he also did in the first round, as well as when he beat Anand. Truly strange..
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #15 - 09/09/17 at 11:07:04
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Great Bu's up!
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #14 - 09/08/17 at 18:01:51
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If results could speak:

'This is a pretty fun tournament, just chilling here on my 4/4 score, no pressure man. How come the rest of you aren't enjoying yourselves?'

'...hmm, this doesn't look like the strongest super-tournament anymore, half the top 20 bailed' Shocked
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #13 - 09/08/17 at 16:16:12
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Keano wrote on 09/08/17 at 11:04:43:
they could have at least put Kramnik and Karjakin in different halves of the draw


Well, Karjakin's out already... It's a tough gauntlet for everyone.
Cool
  

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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #12 - 09/08/17 at 11:04:43
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So Carlsen seems to think its strange, but never mind he will "exploit" the rule for himself Smiley Fine principles from the World champ.

Kramnik made a fair point the other day - they could have at least put Kramnik and Karjakin in different halves of the draw.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #11 - 09/06/17 at 20:34:46
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Monocle wrote on 09/06/17 at 19:08:38:
Keano wrote on 09/04/17 at 20:07:07:
But I stand by my point. Carlsen is getting a free roll here to eliminate any potential nasty opponents he has in mind for his title.


Knockouts are such a lottery anyway, the real problem is that it's a silly way of selecting candidates, not that Carlsen is allowed to play in it. 





There was a video interview with Carlsen after the Sinquefeld cup this year talking about his participation.  His rationale was that it was an interesting tournament and he wanted to play, and he agreed that it was strange the rules allowed him to play and affect the candidates, but he'll play while the rules allow it.

https://www.chess.com/news/view/carlsen-at-the-world-cup-i-want-to-exploit-this-...

Quote:
Carlsen agreed that it's a slightly remarkable decision to play a tournament where he will be part of the selection process of his opponent in his next match.

"It is strange, for sure. For me it's not a factor in deciding whether to play or not but it is a bit odd that the rules allow me to play when it's a world championship qualifier; you cannot say it in any other way. But as long as the rules are there then I want to sort of exploit this loophole to get an interesting experience.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #10 - 09/06/17 at 19:08:38
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Keano wrote on 09/04/17 at 20:07:07:
But I stand by my point. Carlsen is getting a free roll here to eliminate any potential nasty opponents he has in mind for his title.


Knockouts are such a lottery anyway, the real problem is that it's a silly way of selecting candidates, not that Carlsen is allowed to play in it. 


  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #9 - 09/05/17 at 18:26:28
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Why isn't there more talk about Yaroslav's intentional forfeit?
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #8 - 09/04/17 at 20:07:07
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Karjakin I have no problem with because to get a shot at the World ch he still needs to win the Candidates.

But I stand by my point. Carlsen is getting a free roll here to eliminate any potential nasty opponents he has in mind for his title.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #7 - 09/04/17 at 01:01:22
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Anish Giri was quoted as saying that Carlsen considers this to be the real world championship, but Giri expects he'll go back to spectating next year!
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #6 - 09/03/17 at 18:23:15
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Keano wrote on 09/03/17 at 13:40:43:
How is Carlsen allowed to be in this?

Because the World Cup is (or tries to be?) primarily a tournament, and only secondarily a method to qualify for the Candidates.

You may ask the same question about Karjakin, who also is already qualified.

In general half of the qualification for the Candidates is a "farce", so I don't think it matters too much. I for one love the World Cup, and quite enjoy that Magnus decided to make it that bit stronger.
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #5 - 09/03/17 at 15:01:58
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Keano wrote on 09/03/17 at 13:40:43:
How is Carlsen allowed to be in this?

Surely it is vastly unfair on the players he (might) knock out?



Good question. And wasting a spot that should go to another potential challenger... ala Topalov / Kamsky / Short / Morozevich / Sutosvky / or many other talents like IM Noritsyn who right fully earned a place here the proper way... https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=853&v=qBNEcRgHkvE
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #4 - 09/03/17 at 13:40:43
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How is Carlsen allowed to be in this?

Surely it is vastly unfair on the players he (might) knock out?
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #3 - 09/02/17 at 17:59:32
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLWeW7dm3i4 GM Gustafsson also made one on stream. All sounded quite logical, which makes me a bit less confident about mine  Wink
  
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #2 - 09/02/17 at 15:40:32
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Re: 2017 World Cup
Reply #1 - 08/28/17 at 10:47:14
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http://challonge.com/tbilisi2017 you can make 'em here, and then potentially win c24 Premium or a coaching session or somesuch

http://challonge.com/tournaments/3773687/predictions/153148 this is mine

For anyone too lazy to check the entire link out, some cliffnotes
- Carlsen gets to the Quarterfinals and loses to MVL
- MVL loses in the Semifinals to Aronian
- Nepomniachtchi makes a surprisingly good run, beating So + Anand and only losing in the Semis to Ding Liren
- Wei Yi gets stopped by Caruana (who then loses to Ding Liren)
- Ding Liren takes it all

Not sure yet how much of this is prediction and how much wishful thinking, but a pure prediction would pretty much just be to pick the higher rated player everywhere, which seemed rather boring Wink

While going through this list of players, I was struck again by how much of a Dark Horse the chinese players are.. Wei Yi everyone knows, but the rest?
For a (near-)Top10 player, I have seen very few games of Ding Liren. Li Chao of course I know the name, but again, he's almost 2750 and I can't remember seeing a game of his, while all the players around him I know rather well. Bu Xiangzhi is 2710 and it's the first time I consciouly hear his name!
That should definitely influence their performance, but again, I'm unsure whether it'll help (opponents are less used to them) or hurt (they're less used to playing varying opponents of that level), or balances out.. mh.
  
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2017 World Cup
08/27/17 at 19:20:23
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The chess tournament, not the football.

Predictions?
  

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