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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna (Read 23039 times)
Stigma
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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #11 - 03/20/18 at 19:41:31
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CanadianClub wrote on 03/20/18 at 08:09:42:
I thought with Pert + Cornette combo, we have covered in this Ragozin-Vienna complex, but who knows... maybe this is more an introductory-type of book.

Smiley

I doubt that. Panczyk and Ilczuk have a reputation for "complete" books with serious analysis, not for move by move explanations. And the Vienna being a razor-sharp line where many lines turn on deep tactics and computer analysis, it would be difficult to write an introductory-type book on it.

P.S.: To return to the topic of complete 4...dxc4 Vienna coverage, there are a few rarer lines beside 5.Bg5, 5.e4 and 5.e3 that would need to be included, like 5.Qa4+ (mentioned by an ordinary chessplayer below) and 5.g3.
  

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CanadianClub
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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #10 - 03/20/18 at 08:09:42
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The cover is vey nice !

I thought with Pert + Cornette combo, we have covered in this Ragozin-Vienna complex, but who knows... maybe this is more an introductory-type of book.

Smiley
  
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Jonathan Tait
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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #9 - 03/20/18 at 07:06:13
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fjd wrote on 03/20/18 at 03:36:29:
If only there were an Everyman editor who browsed these forums on occasion...   Cheesy


The only books I get to see in advance are the ones I work on. Not seen this one. Sorry Wink
  

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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #8 - 03/20/18 at 03:36:29
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If only there were an Everyman editor who browsed these forums on occasion...   Cheesy
  
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Stigma
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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #7 - 03/20/18 at 02:33:51
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an ordinary chessplayer wrote on 03/20/18 at 01:46:53:
Stigma wrote on 03/19/18 at 19:15:43:
I agree. White can avoid the entire book and still play critical lines, by meeting 4...dxc4 with 5.e4 or 5.e3 and 4...Bb4 with 5.cxd5.
After 5.e4 Bb4 I don't see a good move other than 6.Bg5, which is definitely a Vienna Variation. And I think 5.e3 is a not very accurate QGA from white's point of view. So you will have to explain what critical lines you have in mind.

I was thinking of the pawn sac line IsaVulpes already mentioned: 4...dxc4 5.e4 Bb4 6.Bxc4!? etc. Do you feel Black has solved that by now? It was supposed to be critical, but I don't follow theoretical developments in the Vienna closely. In any case it would be very natural to cover it (and also 5.e3 even if that's inaccurate) in a book devoted to the Vienna.

P.S.: If neither 4...dxc4 5.e4 nor 5.e3 are dangerous, it doesn't make sense for any strong players to play the Vienna via 4...Bb4 5.Bg5 dxc4, since that gives White several extra options (5.cxd5 exd5 6.Bg5, 6.Bf4 or 6.Qa4+; 5.Qa4+; 5.Qc2). But they do, and 4...Bb4 is supposedly Ilczuk and Panczyk's preferred move order in the book.
  

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an ordinary chessplayer
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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #6 - 03/20/18 at 01:46:53
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Stigma wrote on 03/19/18 at 19:15:43:
I agree. White can avoid the entire book and still play critical lines, by meeting 4...dxc4 with 5.e4 or 5.e3 and 4...Bb4 with 5.cxd5.
After 5.e4 Bb4 I don't see a good move other than 6.Bg5, which is definitely a Vienna Variation. And I think 5.e3 is a not very accurate QGA from white's point of view. So you will have to explain what critical lines you have in mind.

I agree with you that I have not seen "complete" coverage of 4...dxc4 anywhere.

Lalic (2000) Queen's Gambit Declined: Bg5 Systems in his chapter 7 on the Vienna Variation has the following:
  • Game 53 4...Bb4 5.Bg5 h6 6. Bh4 dxc4
  • Game 54 4...dxc4 5.Bg5 Bb4 6. Qa4+ (and extremely brief coverage of 6.a3 and 6.e3 in a note)
  • Games 55-67 4...dxc4 5.e4 Bb4 6.Bg5
Other than that, in the Introduction he has a game Eslon-Tal, Seville 1992, with 4...dxc4 5.Qa4+. In this game white did not play Bc1-g5 at all. It's not unique in that respect. Despite the title, Lalic has a whole chapter on Bc1-f4.

4 Symbols
5 Introduction
Part 1: Exchange Variations
16 1 The Alatortsev Variation: 3...Le7 4 cxd5 exd5 5 Lf4
27 2 The Exchange Variation: White develops his Knight on e2
35 3 The Exchange Variation: White plays Sf3
Part 2: White plays an early Sf3
52 4 An Anti-Lf4 line
57 5 The Ragozin Defence
82 6 The Manhattan Variation
101 7 The Vienna Variation
Part 3: 4 Lg5: Deviations for both sides
123 8 The Dutch/Peruvian Gambit
129 9 The Cambridge Springs
149 10 White plays e3 and Tc1 without Sf3
155 11 White plays Sf3 and Tc1 without e3
Part 4: Main lines
162 12 Anti-Tartakower: Lxf6
169 13 The Lasker Defence
177 14 The Tartakower Variation: Rare lines
185 15 The Tartakower Variation: Main line
198 16 The Extended Fianchetto
202 17 The Rubinstein Variation
207 Index of variations

Table of contents lifted from here: http://www.schachversand.de/d/detail/buecher/5271.html
  
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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #5 - 03/19/18 at 19:28:59
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Pert did.
  
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Stigma
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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #4 - 03/19/18 at 19:15:43
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IsaVulpes wrote on 03/19/18 at 19:06:05:
I'd think a book on the Vienna should/might start with 4. ..dc4:, and also/in particular cover the pawn sac line 5.e4 Bb4 6.Bc4: Ne4: 7.0-0 Nc3: 8.bc3: Be7?!

400 pages on just the old Ragozin/Vienna mainline seems a whole lot, considering many of the lines are rather narrow, and there isn't much to say beyond "this move is good because it's good"?!
Very curious how this will end up looking

I agree. White can avoid the entire book and still play critical lines, by meeting 4...dxc4 with 5.e4 or 5.e3 and 4...Bb4 with 5.cxd5.

Though many players now reach the Vienna mostly from the Ragozin (4...Bb4) move order, so perhaps the thinking is there's already enough recent coverage of the rest of the Ragozin for the Black player to consult. But then it would indeed be nice to get complete coverage of the entire Vienna, i.e. everything after 4...dxc4. AFAIK no such book has ever been published.

Btw. did Pert and/or Cornette cover this transposition to the Vienna in their respective Ragozin books?
  

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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #3 - 03/19/18 at 19:06:05
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tracke wrote on 03/19/18 at 14:50:19:
~400 pages , 1 d4 d5 2 c4 e6 3 Nc3 Nf6 4 Nf3 Bb4 5 Bg5 dc4

The book appears to be limited to this line according to the back blurb, but can that really be true?
I'd think a book on the Vienna should/might start with 4. ..dc4:, and also/in particular cover the pawn sac line 5.e4 Bb4 6.Bc4: Ne4: 7.0-0 Nc3: 8.bc3: Be7?!

400 pages on just the old Ragozin/Vienna mainline seems a whole lot, considering many of the lines are rather narrow, and there isn't much to say beyond "this move is good because it's good"?!
Very curious how this will end up looking
  
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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #2 - 03/19/18 at 17:14:31
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Interesting, I'm not sure there has been much around book wise specifically for the QGD Vienna before, so I think there is a gap in the market (Cyrus Lakdawala missed a shot here  Wink)
  

Those who want to go by my perverse footsteps play such pawn structure with fuzzy atypical still strategic orientations

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Re: Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
Reply #1 - 03/19/18 at 15:35:00
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A non-repertoire opening book?!   Shocked
  
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tracke
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Panczyk/Ilczuk on QGD Vienna
03/19/18 at 14:50:19
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Everyman has announced a new book for Summer 2018:

Queen´s Gambit Declined : Vienna   by Panczyk/Ilczuk

~400 pages , 1 d4 d5 2 c4 e6 3 Nc3 Nf6 4 Nf3 Bb4 5 Bg5 dc4

Nice cover: https://www.everymanchess.com/queens-gambit-declined-vienna

In the past I really liked most books of Panczyk/Ilczuk:
always good pieces of serious work and very useful.
Looking forward this, too.

tracke  Smiley

  
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