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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Something vs the dutch? (Read 2337 times)
brabo
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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #11 - 02/26/19 at 16:32:14
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In 2006 the same Dambacher already played against me 1.d4 f5 2.c4 Nf6 3.Nc3 e6 4.e3 b6 5.Bd3 Bb7 6.f3 c5 but followed it up with 7.Nge2 as 7.d5 can be answered with exd5. Here we see the disadvantage of the bishop to the queen as it is now less interesting to take on f5. This game hasn't been saved in the databases. Besides do you know that Dambacher plays the Dutch with black too which makes it even more interesting to know that he chooses this system for white.

Anyway it leads to very interesting fresh positions as after move 8 we are entering virgin territory. Some fun lines:
9.a3 fxe4 10.fxe4 0-0 11. Bg5 Nxd5 11.Bxd8 Rxf1+ 12. Kxf1 Ne3+
10. Bh4 g5 11.Bg3 Bxg3 12.hxg3 Qc7 13. Qf2 fxe4 14.0-0-0 d6 15.fxe4 Qe7 and my analysis of 2017 says 0.00 which of course is a typical Stockfish-evaluation.

Anyway as black you should be happy to reach such positions when you have studied it at home.
  
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MNb
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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #10 - 02/25/19 at 18:09:14
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This provides more questions (10.Bh4!? or first 9.a3!? or perhaps 4.e3 b6 5.Bd3 Bb7 6.f3 arguing that after c5 7.d5 White has made a more useful move) than answers  Which reinforces my wish to have a strong player writing a book on 1.d4 f5 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Nf6 (no g2-g3). This is very common among amateurs, who tend to play 1.d4, 2.c4 and 3.Nc3 on automatic pilot. Maybe this is something for you? If Tony Rotella can do it .....
  

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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #9 - 12/28/18 at 05:11:39
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MNb wrote on 12/14/18 at 17:57:32:
Dambacher-Froeyman, BELchT 2012.

I improved black's play considerably later in 2017 see below game
  
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brabo
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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #8 - 12/28/18 at 04:51:19
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I wrote about 5 years ago an article on my blog about the Dutch opening with h3 - g4 see http://chess-brabo.blogspot.com/2013/09/a-dutch-gambit-part-2.html
An even older article on my blog covers a direct g4 in the Dutch see http://schaken-brabo.blogspot.com/2012/10/een-hollands-gambietje.html (At that time I didn't yet provide the translations to English of my articles.)
  
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an ordinary chessplayer
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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #7 - 12/14/18 at 22:31:31
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I actually think your ultra-classical suggestion is far better theoretically. But my Dutch opponents on the whole have seemed pretty helpless against this delayed h3/g4 idea. This included some quite strong players. After 1.d4 e6 2.Nf3 f5 3.h3, your 3...b6 is a very good move. I did however manage to win the only time I faced it, by playing 4.g4!?, anyway! The comparison with the Sicilian is appropriate, but there are subtle differences. E.g.:
  • 1.e4 c5 (does not weaken the king) 2.a3 g6 (prepares castling in 3 moves).
  • 1.d4 f5 (weakens the king) 2.h3 b6 (prepares castling in 4 moves).

Also the insertion of 2.Nf3 e6 helps white a little in his response to ...Bb7.
  
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MNb
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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #6 - 12/14/18 at 17:57:32
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Laramonet wrote on 12/14/18 at 14:46:55:
The suggestion from MNb, when played with 4.Qc2, is the recommendation in Opening Repertoire: The English by David Cummings.

That's correct, but my suggestion 4.Qc2 b6 5.e3 (or 5.f3 first) isn't. Thanks for reminding me; now I can add two more games to the list above.

Krasenkow-Pakleza, POLchT 2014
Dambacher-Froeyman, BELchT 2012.

1.d4 e6 2.Nf3 f5 3.h3 is not a bigger problem than any other setup indeed, thanks to 3...b6. Compare 1.e4 c5 2.a3 g6.

  

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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #5 - 12/14/18 at 14:46:55
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The suggestion from MNb, when played with 4.Qc2, is the recommendation in Opening Repertoire: The English by David Cummings. I've not changed to play it yet but when 2.Nc3 arrives, I will !  Smiley
  
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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #4 - 12/14/18 at 13:02:11
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All the suggestions so far are decent, the question is which one is most uncomfortable for the Dutch player. I have a very good record with LeeRoth's second suggestion. 1.d4 e6 2.Nf3 f5 3.h3 is no problem, but white needs to be ready for 2...Nf6, 2...d5, and 2...c5.
  
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MNb
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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #3 - 12/14/18 at 11:10:12
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Mtal wrote on 12/13/18 at 16:12:59:
IHe plays the classical.

All the recommendations above have one big downside: 1.d4 e6.
So I recommend the good old Rubinstein Variation 1.d4 e6 2.c4 f5 3.Nc3 Nf6 and now either 4.e3 or 4.Qc2. A few model games:


Ivanov-Guliev, Moscow 1995
Sasikiran-Krasenkow, Olympiade 2004
Van den Berg-Burstein, Haifa/Tel Aviv 1958
Kortchnoi-Knaak, Lugano 1989
Kortchnoi-Rivas Pastor, Haifa 1989
Schlosser-Picard, BL 2003
Kappler-Böhm, Liege 1983
Lautier-Vaisser, FRAch 2001
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #2 - 12/14/18 at 04:22:26
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For something different yet good: 1.d4 f5 2.Bg5

For something venomous: 1.d4 f5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.h3 e6 4.g4

For something that Magnus played: 1.Nf3 f5 2.d3

  
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Re: Something vs the dutch?
Reply #1 - 12/13/18 at 17:02:52
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Mtal wrote on 12/13/18 at 16:12:59:
I kinda have a chess rival lol (well he is one of my busdoes,who actually goes out of his way to prepare for me). I like to surprise him as white vs his dutch. Any recommendations? Maybe something off beat with some venom to it? He plays the classical. Thing is I am not someone who likes playing lines with g3. Well any advise would be great. It be great if I could catch him with something. Lol even though he is my buddy, he does like to slam pieces, act kinda arrogant, tell my my lines are bad (even of I'm winning the whole game and I gag a piece or something) etc... Thanks.


What about the Staunton Gambit?  It's actually pretty dangerous if White knows the best lines. 
  
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Mtal
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Something vs the dutch?
12/13/18 at 16:12:59
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I kinda have a chess rival lol (well he is one of my busdoes,who actually goes out of his way to prepare for me). I like to surprise him as white vs his dutch. Any recommendations? Maybe something off beat with some venom to it? He plays the classical. Thing is I am not someone who likes playing lines with g3. Well any advise would be great. It be great if I could catch him with something. Lol even though he is my buddy, he does like to slam pieces, act kinda arrogant, tell my my lines are bad (even of I'm winning the whole game and I gag a piece or something) etc... Thanks.
  
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